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Old 24th February 2020, 14:36   #31
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

With all due respect to Mr. Goenka, he should not use "they are using too big of a car" and "China" in the same analogy.

The Chinese market is now becoming known for manufacturers launching XL / long-wheelbase models, especially for the Chinese market. Some of these models are Made in China and for China only.

There is a certain style and comfort that comes along with long-wheelbase cars, which are useful for long drives or to be driven by a chauffeur. They are definitely not very practical for driving in the city due to turning radius.


There is an article on it, this was way back in 2010!
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchin...nt_9296482.htm

While TopGear version in 2016,
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/bei...wheelbase-cars


On another note, I gave up on commuting with a car after a while, not due to having a long-wheelbase car. Even if I had a Tata Nano, I still would have given up the daily drives to Office.

The solution is having a spider web network of Metros with individual seats and not standing 2 hours every day to and from work.

Last edited by aah78 : 25th February 2020 at 05:16. Reason: Spacing.
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Old 24th February 2020, 14:50   #32
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

I am in alignment with Mr Goenka's statement on the need to reduce the number of cars on the road; I have been using car pooling for the past couple of years till last year, and have since switched over to public transportation (Hyderabad Metro). I have considerably reduced the usage of my car, and take it out only when at least 3 of the family members are travelling or, my aged parents need a ride. I make do with my two wheeler, as much as possible.
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Old 24th February 2020, 15:12   #33
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

I chose an SUV to drive on our rickety roads and not really as a status symbol of owning a big car.

How about improving public transport so I dont need a car. If i had the public transportation like what they have in say singapore, my car would be relegated to that once-in-6 months outstation trip only. But obviously you cant expect a car manufacturer to talk that language. After all, their livelihood depends on adding more cars to the road.
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Old 24th February 2020, 15:55   #34
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

Funny this coming from Mahindra which is known for big cars.
Anyways, I believe smaller cars are not the solution.
Solution is to have first grade Public transport in all cities so that people don't need to buy cars for intracity transport at all.

By advocating smaller cars (even at the expense of larger cars) you are not solving anything, just pretending to solve it.
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Old 24th February 2020, 17:56   #35
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

I would like to know how Goenka travels between cities/countries. In his private jet right? One person travelling in few thousand pounds heavy airplane? That is very bad. Right? No, it is a crude way to think about in terms of weight, especially the mobility. Car industry is to blame, for not innovating enough, for example, like how Tesla innovating. The other thread in teambhp said, Tesla are 5 years ahead of time in terms of technology, when compared to others in the auto industry.

The truck they revealed seems to be future as well for me, with the build, technology and design. Futuristic ideas are difficult to accept first. When traditional auto industry did something like this? They are the one to blame themselves, rather than, blaming the consumers. I can not stop thinking of those travel operators who used to buy Amby's, Standard vans and first thing they do is to re-weld many parts in the local workshop! It took me few years to digest that fact. Those days where we need to book and wait for few years to see the car.

Last edited by Akshay1234 : 28th February 2020 at 17:06. Reason: adding a space for readability
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Old 24th February 2020, 21:51   #36
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

Absolutely hilarious and hypocritical. India probably has the smallest cars and most utility for each car compared to most places on Earth.

What does he expect us to do? Cram 10 people into 1 auto and move around town like cattle? Because India is the only place where people already do that, but it still isn't good enough apparently.
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Old 24th February 2020, 23:52   #37
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

Mr.Goenka and many others before him have made the same point about cars being too inefficient in the sense that they are currently much heavier than the load that they have to transport. However it is insane to say that this is prevalent only in India. In fact, I would state that India is probably much more efficient than many other countries globally in the sense that there is greater adoption of public transport here. Of course the reason for that is obviously the greater poverty levels in India.

However, Mr.Goenka and others of his ilk should focus their attention on launching smarter, safer and fuel efficient transportation. When M&M bought Reva, we all thought that they would leverage Mr.Maini's technology skills and their financial muscle to launch an all new wave of electric vehicles. Well what did we get? The E Verito?

Well, it is indeed easier for them to point fingers at others, so its the fault of Indian consumers who are to blame for using 1500 kg cars to transport their puny 65kg bodies. No one is asking the indian customer if there is a safer alternative to the 1500 kg automobile. Let M&M or Tata launch an efficient electric 4 wheeler with a decent range, reasonable battery replacement costs and adequate charging stations in the major metros and see how we lap it up. Till then, don't expect any dramatic changes to our automotive choices.
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Old 25th February 2020, 08:31   #38
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

Warning : politically incorrect suggestion ahead

I would suggest we adopt travelators or moving walkways in our densely populated cities. But I doubt we have the capability to experiment and implement successful solutions at this point. The rest of the world has not adopted them on a large scale, meaning we cannot simply do a technology transfer even if we could simply afford them somehow.
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Old 25th February 2020, 09:37   #39
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

I proudly say, I am an ardent follower of Go-Green concept. I absolutely don't like to leave carbon footprint at least when I am commuting within the city limits.

Now coming to the point, I usually travel to my work on a bicycle. One day when I was heading home at around 10:30 PM I was hit by a black swift who was obviously drunk. He didn't even care to stop the vehicle to see if I am alive or not.

I broke my mandible and condyle and ended up in a hospital with titanium plates and screws. Since then, be it any distance I started using four wheeler as I cannot risk my life for the utter shallow maturity levels of the riders here in Hyderabad.

Drunken driving, lack of civic sense, attitude issues, biggies support have ruined my purpose of going green. Now I jog in the morning and commute only in 4 wheeler or I go by walk.
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Old 25th February 2020, 11:15   #40
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelguy View Post
Indians use too big car by size for moving a single person, and the fate met by Tata Nano was unfortunate, Mahindra and Mahindra MD Pawan Goenka said on Saturday.
So does this imply that Mr Goenka travel everywhere using public transport like metro and buses?
Or does he move around in small Alto sized vehicle?

The reason why he feels he moves around in whichever his current vehicle is the exact same reason why everyone feels that he should move in his current vehicle.
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Old 25th February 2020, 11:29   #41
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

I was in attendance at this event, he is a college senior (35 yr senior to be exact!!). His quote has been taken out of context because immediately after this he talked about smaller vehicles like the Nano & the new ATOM being developed by M&M for last mile connectivity.
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Old 25th February 2020, 12:02   #42
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasanka_Sanga View Post
I proudly say, I am an ardent follower of Go-Green concept. I absolutely don't like to leave carbon footprint at least when I am commuting within the city limits.

Now coming to the point, I usually travel to my work on a bicycle. One day when I was heading home at around 10:30 PM I was hit by a black swift who was obviously drunk. He didn't even care to stop the vehicle to see if I am alive or not.

I broke my mandible and condyle and ended up in a hospital with titanium plates and screws. S
I am sorry for your accident. Hope you have recovered well.
Unfortunately this is the fact in our country. Roads are highly unsafe for people on 2 wheels.
Which is why I feel there should be a massive development in public transport. And this is not limited to building Metros or more buses. It includes other infrastructure like over bridges, walkways, footpaths, cycle tracks etc.

I have moved to Singapore and am amazed to see the public transport infrastructure here.
All of us know how exorbitantly priced are the cars here, and not having one does not bite you here.

This is because of a very good network of MRTs, LRTs and Bus services all seamlessly interconnected to each other. Plus there are paved walkways that are covered. Even in the debilitating humidity and ubiquitous rainfall of Singapore last to last mile connectivity (I use it for the bit where you walk from your home/office to feeder/MRT stop) is not affected.

From someone who hardly walked in India on weekdays, I now walk atleast 4-5 Kms daily just commuting from office (and lunch) and I dont have to bother about the sun or rain for most part because the walkways are covered at many places.

Cyclists have an almost un-interrupted dedicated paths across the city except on the large highways.

Yes Singapore is a special case, but for sure if we have the political will and the vision to implement and enforce it, this can be done in our country as well- atleast in the major Metro cities.

Advocating small cars to ease congestion or to improve last mile connectivity is IMHO advocating to take a step in the wrong direction hoping it will lead you to your destination.
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Old 25th February 2020, 12:58   #43
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

Quote:
Originally Posted by waldner_is_king View Post
I was in attendance at this event, he is a college senior (35 yr senior to be exact!!). His quote has been taken out of context because immediately after this he talked about smaller vehicles like the Nano & the new ATOM being developed by M&M for last mile connectivity.
Had a feeling this might have been the case, thanks for clearing it up.

But still however small the car, the problem is still the same.

The below posts are awesome, say it all:

Quote:
Originally Posted by vibbs View Post
Which is why I feel there should be a massive development in public transport. And this is not limited to building Metros or more buses. It includes other infrastructure like over bridges, walkways, footpaths, cycle tracks etc.
The problem is that now the Metros like the Bangalore Metro think that their job ends with running trains. How easy it is to get to a station, what the condition of footpaths are around stations, how many entrances are operational to make it convenient for people to get in, over bridges, rapid ticketing, etc are just afterthoughts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vibbs View Post
From someone who hardly walked in India on weekdays, I now walk atleast 4-5 Kms daily just commuting from office (and lunch) and I dont have to bother about the sun or rain for most part because the walkways are covered at many places.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vibbs View Post
Advocating small cars to ease congestion or to improve last mile connectivity is IMHO advocating to take a step in the wrong direction hoping it will lead you to your destination.
We need to stop supporting further investments that encourage private transport in cities and do everything to encourage public transport with walking and cycling last mile solutions. There will be a massive outcry (especially on TeamBHP ) but it's glaring obvious that that is the only sustainable way to go.
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Old 25th February 2020, 13:10   #44
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

There is nothing wrong in what he said; but itís a worldwide phenomenon, not just something specific for India. If the public transport system is mediocre and pedestrians or cyclists do not have the right of way, cars as a mode of personal mobility is the only reasonable and safe choice. And the so-called last-mile connectivity is a reality only in a few developed countries.
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Old 25th February 2020, 14:47   #45
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Default Re: Indians use too big a car to move a single person: Pawan Goenka

The thing with public transport is that everyone wants everyone else to use it. We need to be realistic with our expectations about public transport. It will involve some amount of walking on one or both ends of the journey, you will not always get a place to sit and many times you will not have the best of weather or conditions to walk. Yet there are far more who use public transport and go through this every day. If using public transport was as comfortable as using your own vehicle then private vehicles would entirely disappear and we wouldn't be discussing anything.

In one of the FB forums about Bangalore infra conditions, one chap mentioned that if BMTC gets 6000 more buses then he will start using public transport. Even allowing for this intended exaggeration, the thing is that people like these actually have no intention of using public transport and they can bring any absurd condition into the picture to justify their current habits. I would suggest giving public transport a chance even if it causes some discomfort. Some of it will diminish as you get used to it.

And let's not make exceptions like 'taking a sick relative to hospital' the rule. I know many conditions require use of personal vehicle but I am sure the thousands commuting every day are able bodied people, many of them in need of exercise and are not driving sick relatives to the hospital.

Oh, this post was about Mr. Goenka's statement. I appreciate his intent but simply throwing numbers like "1500 kg car for a 65 kg person" is very click-baity. A 500 sqft house for 12 sqft person? How does that sound? Or that the potatoes that I ate for lunch today travelled 700 Kms to reach my plate? Everything will look very enormous compared to we tiny humans. But the fact is such statistics exist in every aspect of life. To someone who wants that everyone should use only bicycles, Mr. Goenka's new mystery vehicle may still have a huge carbon footprint.
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