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Old 27th March 2020, 21:31   #121
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Supreme Court judgement copy on BS4 deadline extension.
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File Type: pdf FADA judgement_Order_27-Mar-2020.pdf (33.5 KB, 337 views)
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Old 27th March 2020, 21:52   #122
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Minutes from the proceeding between Supreme Court and FADA(as received). Quoting from the same:

"1,05,000 two-wheelers, 2250 passenger carsand 2000 commercial vehicles are there which have been sold but not registered through out India. Unsold vehicles are stated to be 7,00,000 two wheelers, 15,000 passenger cars and 12,000 commercial
vehicles."

"it is ordered that sold vehicles be registered by the
concerned authorities by 30.04.2020. However, at the same time we direct the applicant to furnish details of the purchasers, on affidavit, of the aforesaid vehicles through e-mail, within seven days from today. Details of registration shall also be furnished to
this Court."

" It is stated that there are 7,00,000 two-wheelers which are unsold through out India with different dealers. Similarly, passenger vehicles are 15,000 and commercial vehicles are 12,000.
In Delhi and NCR region, we are not allowing sale and registration of these kind of vehicles any more. However, in the remaining part of the country, due to the situation which has arisen due to lock-
down, it is ordered that not beyond 10% of the vehicles, except with the Dealers in Delhi and NCR region, are permitted to be sold out of the aforesaid number of vehicles to make up the good of six days which were available before the lock-down has been ordered in the country. Details of the sale shall be furnished by the applicant and there shall be no violation of the order passed by this Court. Sales to be done within ten days of the lifting of the lock-down operating in the concerned cities and not beyond it and on an affidavit number of vehicles sold shall be stated by the applicant/Federation of Automobile Dealers Association and only those vehicles shall be permitted to be registered about which affidavit is filed. "
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File Type: pdf 63998_1985_0_1_21579_Order_27-Mar-2020.pdf (33.5 KB, 100 views)
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Old 27th March 2020, 23:33   #123
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel_Drives View Post
"It is stated that there are 7,00,000 two-wheelers which are unsold through out India with different dealers. Similarly, passenger vehicles are 15,000 and commercial vehicles are 12,000.
In Delhi and NCR region, we are not allowing sale and registration of these kind of vehicles any more. However, in the remaining part of the country, due to the situation which has arisen due to lock-down, it is ordered that not beyond 10% of the vehicles, except with the Dealers in Delhi and NCR region, are permitted to be sold out of the aforesaid number of vehicles to make up the good of six days which were available before the lock-down has been ordered in the country.
If I take passenger vehicles alone, Does it mean 10 % of the 15000 passenger vehicles can be sold which translates to 1500 vehicles across all manufacturers? Note the word " aforesaid " in that verdict. But how would this be distributed to the dealers across the country remains unclear as the 15000 vehicles in question are from all manufacturers put together. Then how can the 10 % be worked out ? It can't be 10% from the unsold inventory of each of the manufacturer too as each of them will have a different number of unsold vehicles.

There's ambiguity all around I guess.
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Old 27th March 2020, 23:43   #124
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel_Drives View Post
Minutes from the proceeding between Supreme Court and FADA(as received)
What about the remaining 90%

Is the apex court trying to punish the manufacturers/sellers for letting stocks pile up or is it that it is suspecting that the numbers are inflated?
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Old 29th March 2020, 03:19   #125
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Guess SC just created a huge pile of donor Vehicles.

There come another partially throughout judgment from SC. How are they defining that*in six days dealers will sell only 10% stock. It is the end of FY some of them may sell lot more. The way I read it, the dealers will not be able to*register the stock even in their own names. Unless I am reading it wrong it is a reckless decision. Why does SC need the list? are they doing the role of RTO now? Lookslike SC has too much time in hand to look at each vehicle in detail.

Seriously they are talking about health of the nation etc, then let them make Judgments more sensibly. How much resources would have gone into making these BS4 vehicles. Keeping them idle and not registering them is wasting precious resources.

Can someone please quantify how much pollution are we talking from these set of vehicles relative to their BS6 counterparts
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Old 29th March 2020, 04:02   #126
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Most of the dealerships have lost hopes and are either closing deals with prospects or getting registered in their own names. Mostly the later. They will probably be reimbursed for RTO charges by manufacturers. Whenever everything reopens, customers can buy Pre-registered brand new. In some places, it may not be possible to get RTO or otherwise, SC has given permission to invoice now and register later. So, the dealerships are not going to suffer losses beyond an amount.

Things will be different for manufacturers as they can no longer ship the cars/ bikes. But I am not sure who all will be carrying inventories at this time. If they are, they can either convert to euro 6, export or use themselves
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Old 29th March 2020, 06:41   #127
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

No offense to the Supreme Court Judges, but I feel they are not understanding the depth of the impact this COVID epidemic will have on India's and the global economy. This is definitely no the time to play strict school headmaster. I don't have much sympathy for the manufacturers who knew all along that BS-VI was coming, but I would give them atleast a two given the current state of our country the world.

Government can pass a law as Supreme Court cannot overturn a law passed by the parliament unless it is unconstitutional. Maybe the manufacturers can request the Central Government for help.
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Old 29th March 2020, 06:49   #128
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

"Hero MotoCorp Ltd, India’s largest two-wheeler manufacturer, assured its dealer principals on Saturday to absorb its entire unsold BS IV compliant inventory comprising of motorcycles and scooter"

https://www.livemint.com/auto-news/h...396275062.html

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/bu...k-5083561.html

Quite an unprecedented move, that too within a day's time of SC judgment. Going by the stated FADA figures and Hero's market share, that's almost 3-3.5L two wheelers to be taken care of, almost half months production figures of Hero in best of times!!

Will other automobile companies follow suit?
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Old 29th March 2020, 08:56   #129
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

In these troubled times and a fast-approaching recession I doubt how those 10 days would really help. But with all due respect to the manufacturers, I agree with the Supreme Courtís decision. Sufficient time was given to clear the stock, this 10 days is just a consideration because of the ongoing unprecedented outbreak.

On the contrary, I am not sure how much of stock is really left. On paper, they are claiming 7000cr of unsold BSIV vehicles. I have visited many car dealers here in Pune, Bengaluru and Mangaluru, they hardly have any BSIV cars left with them, forget about march 2020 I was not able to find a BSIV vehicle for the year-end sale itself. My request is that if anyone has any information/list of BSIV vehicles in inventory, please share as it would be helpful.
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Old 29th March 2020, 09:55   #130
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Looks like Supreme Court contacted ICC and applied Duckworth Lewis formula to the BS4 inventory.

You had 6 days to sell all your BS4 inventor. Now due to lockdown we will give you 14 days but you can only sell 10% of inventory.

I'm wondering who are the manufacturers that have 15,000 cars left in inventory. I don't think it's any of the top manufacturers like Maruti or Hyundai.

Is it mainly Tata, Mahindra, Nissan, Datsun and the luxury segment like JLR, Audi etc....
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Old 29th March 2020, 10:09   #131
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
I'm wondering who are the manufacturers that have 15,000 cars left in inventory. I don't think it's any of the top manufacturers like Maruti or Hyundai.
No idea about cars but one of the 2 wheeler dealer in my family circle has said they included all the damaged on arrival vehicles in that list.

These were meant to be taken back or waiting for parts to make it sale worthy - so even if the court allow to sell the entire lot of BS4, they can't be able to do so.
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Old 29th March 2020, 10:24   #132
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
I'm wondering who are the manufacturers that have 15,000 cars left in inventory. I don't think it's any of the top manufacturers like Maruti or Hyundai.
Not sure if the FADA has covered commercial vehicle dealers, but to me it seems that it's primarily the CV's which are left over as the industry wasn't doing any good since the past year.
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Old 29th March 2020, 11:28   #133
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by jetsetgo08 View Post
Not sure if the FADA has covered commercial vehicle dealers, but to me it seems that it's primarily the CV's which are left over as the industry wasn't doing any good since the past year.
Read the report in earlier posts:

Quote:
It is stated that there are 7,00,000 two-wheelers which are unsold through out India with different dealers. Similarly, passenger vehicles are 15,000 and commercial vehicles are 12,000.
PV's are 15,000 and CV's are 12,000.
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Old 29th March 2020, 11:30   #134
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Another example of judgements that are impulsive and simplistic, rather than backed by good science and statistics. The ruling does not take into account the following drivers:

1. The consumer side driver - The per day sales during the last days of any month, even more so, the last few days of a financial year, would be much greater the average sales per day during the year
2. The manufacturer/dealer side driver - The incentives provided to close sales at such a time would be a lot more than normal level of incentives
3. India sells 20 million two wheelers a year. Considering a useful life of 10 years, there are 200 million of BS IV and worse (BS3/BS2) of them on our roads. An additional 7,00,000 two wheelers would be a drop in the ocean (additional 0.3%) in terms of incremental pollution. Many of these would have probably replaced ancient scooters and bikes which are far more polluting. So net, net, it may be more positive for the environment to sell these 7 lakh.
4. Allocation of 10% is kept vague. Typical India governmental and judicial style of making a headline grabbing ruling or judgement, without thinking through how to make it work, leaving the implementation intentionally chaotic.

I really wish math, science, statistics and economics were made mandatory subjects, requiring a high level of proficiency to pass, in law colleges instead of just philosophy, case law etc. Case law just further perpetuates judgements made the lazy way, by citing precedents rather than applying thought, analysis, use of data and logical reasoning. All sitting judges should be made to take the same courses and pass within a year. The COVID lockdown is such a great time to learn on-line!

Last edited by 84.monsoon : 29th March 2020 at 11:35.
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Old 29th March 2020, 12:14   #135
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Default Re: FADA wants to sell BS4 cars till 31st May, 2020

Pawan Munjal assures all their dealers that they will firmly stand behind them. Kudos to Hero for taking care of their dealers.

Quote:
"Will not let a single dealer suffer. Hero MotoCorp will look after every dealership through various measures to minimise the impact of disruption in retail and the lying stock."
https://auto.economictimes.indiatime...tners/74863534

Last edited by turbo : 29th March 2020 at 12:28.
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