[Bibendum90949]

Originally Posted by locusjag

This is utterly wrong, no two ways to put it.
I have the same 4 speed AT in my A Star and I have studied and learnt that the gear ratio of the 4th cog is actually better than the 5th cog in the corresponding manual transmission.So back to the 4 speed Maruti automatic gearbox - what misinformation are these two chaps spouting in this video?

Had he defended the question with this logic of the taller 4 th cog, it would have sounded much better than what he responded. I would say Maruti's 4 speed AT is still an elephant in the room. Won't the taller cog on 4th also means that the 3rd one is far spaced and hence some seamless shifts are compromised and it may have a cascading effect on the 1 st and 2 nd gear too. I've not driven it, hence asking on the shifting experience.

[Researcher]

Originally Posted by Bibendum90949

Maruti's rational is most of their 4 speed AT customers of Brezza, Dzire etc would be urban users and hence they wouldn't need the 5 th and 6 th gear.

Either this is a very poor market research by an intern or the top management of Maruti has simply become too relaxed with their 50% market share. The elders in our family still recall how Maruti single-handedly ruined the concept of having automatics for the market by introducing 3 speed torque converters which had really bad fuel economy.

The only three things that Maruti has in its favour is its reliability, cost of ownership and points of contact. With an aggressive number 2 in Hyundai/Kia, it won't be long that Maruti lose that 25% gap to them. Most of us can recall how fortunes changed for Nokia just in 3-4 years after the iPhone/Androids were introduced. Someone please educate Mr. Raman about this.

20 years back, most people bought cars in the 3-4 lac range and with no other option, Maruti used to rule the segment with 800, Zen, Alto and WagonR. Recently, people are shifting to the 6-10 lac segment and we see Swift, Dzire and Baleno having to share the charts with i10 and i20. In a few years when people move up to the 10-15 lac segment, (can say has started with the Creta/Seltos twins), Maruti will simply be forced to minority or oblivion with this 70s era License Raj logic for providing 4 speeds, negligible safety and no diesels.

Edit: It seems Maruti has forgotten how the mighty Hindustan Motors was toppled due to them. Seems they will witness the repeat of history, but this time on the other side.

[locusjag]

Originally Posted by Bibendum90949

Had he defended the question with this logic of the taller 4 th cog, it would have sounded much better than what he responded.

Here's how I would've justified their latest 4 speed offering - "the 4th cog has tall gearing and will keep highway users happy. Its gear ratio is in fact taller than the gear ratio of the manual 5th gear on many of our offerings. Now, we're aware of the effect of the other gears ratios on in-city fuel efficiency. To help with exactly that, the mild hybrid system with the Li ion battery has been built in."

See? I deserve to be in that guy's chair, earning his salary and talking to journos

Won't the taller cog on 4th also means that the 3rd one is far spaced and hence some seamless shifts are compromised and it may have a cascading effect on the 1 st and 2 nd gear too. I've not driven it, hence asking on the shifting experience.

The nearly spaced 1st and 2nd very quickly give up and hand off to the 3rd. It sticks on the 3rd for far longer than I would want it to. It is somewhere in this zone that my A Star is fuel-inefficient.

[Bibendum90949]

Originally Posted by locusjag

Here's how I would've justified their latest 4 speed offering -

Such an apposite reply buddy.

The nearly spaced 1st and 2nd very quickly give up and hand off to the 3rd. It sticks on the 3rd for far longer than I would want it to. It is somewhere in this zone that my A Star is fuel-inefficient.

Thanks for the clarification. Will try my hand some day. Yes the bottom line is you'll only have as many gears to cater to all driving conditions and play around with.

[Aniruddha_Ch]

With all "calculate kiya kya" campaign in place, customer should ask "Website update kiya kya" ; Nexa website is still having mention of 1.3 DDIS in below link
https://www.nexaexperience.com/nexaw...aleno-variants

[volkman10]

In Sept-20, the dispatch figures show a bit of disadvantage in not having a diesel variant, but not bad as expected.

- In the CUV segment, Vitara Brezza comes second and loses 12% volumes in Sep’20 v/s Sep’19



- Dzire de-grows at 11%, but still is the segment leader

- Ciaz too loses 11%. Could be the absence of a diesel or the more desirable cars from competition?

Source:Auto Punditz

[venbas]

Originally Posted by volkman10

- Dzire de-grows at 11%, but still is the segment leader

- Ciaz too loses 11%. Could be the absence of a diesel or the more desirable cars from competition?

Maruti Petrols are lousy underpowered crap that cannot hold a candle to current competition. With that gem of a DDiS engine gone thanks to BS VI regulations, Maruti has been hit with a double whammy of competitors introducing turbo petrols that are fun to drive and quite frugal. With buyers being more discerning in choosing premium hatch/crossover over Sedans Maruti will be relegated to an also ran if they don't see the writing on the wall.

[wheelguy]

Actually they did very well for what used to be a diesel only model previously now being a petrol only model, talking about Brezza. Give a Maruti an average product and they will show you how to do wonders which most of the other manufacturers cannot do.

[VWAllstar]

Originally Posted by wheelguy

Actually they did very well for what used to be a diesel only model previously now being a petrol only model, talking about Brezza. Give a Maruti an average product and they will show you how to do wonders which most of the other manufacturers cannot do.

They are masters of selling average products in huge numbers. On the flip side, they have always failed to sell an excellent product. S Cross 1.6 is a recent example of it. To my knowledge and some information from a reputed dealer, Maruti is under pressure from dealer network as well for getting the diesel cars again. We must not forget that apart from sales, servicing is a major profit making business for these dealers. And proactively thinking, with less diesel cars on road even the service profit margins will take a big hit.
With Kia and Hyundai taking away the bigger chunk of Crossovers and Compact SUVs, it becomes imperative for Maruti to bring better products or stick to Tier 2-3 cities for higher sales number.

[pedrolourenco]

Originally Posted by GTO

Wondering what Maruti will say when they launch their 1.5L diesel in BS6 form.

Originally Posted by TROOPER

So what will MS say when they launch BS6 diesel next year?

You seriously think they will be able to do it? They had the brilliant 1.3 Multijet from Fiat. The chopped it in 2 and increased the displacement a bit to give us the Celerio Diesel. Not a very good job and as expected it failed. Then they joined 2 of these twin cylinder engines and did a lot of work and gave us the "BS6 Ready" 1.5 DDiS. Brilliant job. Not so brilliant was their inability to convert it from "BS6 Ready" to "BS6". Apparently they are good only at reverse engineering. They are probably having difficulty reverse engineering the BS6 features of a Fiat engine since Fiat does not have any 1.5 for them to copy.

Originally Posted by Kishen.padiyar

Wonder where was this wisdom when their DDiS powered cash cows were bringing them loads of money in the form of both sales and service

And they once claimed that Fiat cars were not fuel efficient.

Originally Posted by Sahilrai166

When consumers pay extra to get the turbo petrols over the regular ones then why not pay extra and get the diesel and enjoy its sheer torque and fuel efficiency.

Simple. If they want us to ditch diesels, give us decent petrols (turbo petrols to be specific).

Originally Posted by abhishek46

Not everyone buys a diesel for the economy.
Diesels are a pleasure to drive on the highways, due to their effortless torque.
They offer the ideal mix of performance and fuel efficiency.

Precisely the reason I bought a Rapid TDI instead of the MPI 6 years ago despite Petrol and Diesel being priced the same in Goa.

Originally Posted by 46TheDoctor

1. For people who do high runnings, diesel certainly works out to be a lot cheaper than the petrol even with a premium of 5-10% in aquisition cost over the equivalent petrol variant. There are plenty of calculations about this that are posted on this forum before.

Exactly.

Originally Posted by Sheel

Or is it that they are predicting further delay in converting the 1.5 to BS-6 or some other issue [for further delays], hence all this propaganda to show diesels in poor light?

Exactly. They have hit a roadblock with the 1.5 DDiS and have no clue how to make it BS6 compliant.

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

One thing I realized in the calculator is that MSIL uses the ARAI rated km/l value. All of us know that real world efficiency is significantly lesser than the rated FE. Further, petrol engines returns for worse FE than diesel engines in real world traffic conditions.

This calculator is pure hogwash.

In fact the Diesel real world mileage is quite close to the ARAI figures. Within 2-3 Kms less than the ARAI figure as opposed to 7-8 Km less for the Petrols.

[BLACNWYTE]

Saw this in today's newspaper.



An advertisement given by TATA dealers in Kerala. It basically explains why Diesel cars are better than petrols ones in giving you better savings and also a better driving experience. I guess this is in response to the Maruti 'Calculate Kia Kya?' ad.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

And that's how the cookie crumbles -



PS: Surely a software error, I know.

[hserus]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

And that's how the cookie crumbles -

PS: Surely a software error, I know.

Hahahha what numbers did you feed that tool for this result?

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by hserus

Hahahha what numbers did you feed that tool for this result?

If the difference between petrol and diesel car is in three digits or less, the tool fails logic and suggests petrol - all the way from Rs 999 to Rs 1.

Was simply trying to see what the Maruti calculator thinks of TGDi v/s CRDi pricing when I noticed this bug.

[TorqueIndia]

Irony is that , Maruti have already hurt the resale values of their own diesel cars with the calculator ads . Recently we were hunting for a used car for my friend and found that Swift, Dzire, Ritz and Ertiga diesel variants premium has reduced drastically in Kerala.

Scross diesel was already available at mouth watering prices being a sales dud. Brezza is holding up its value right now, may erode soon.

My guess is Maruti would never return with diesels for the private customers, if it comes it will be exclusive for commercial registration.