[CEF_Beasts]

Octavia RS coming in 2022 but will be a CBU.

[Aditya]

Skoda Octavia RS coming in 2022, but will be a CBU - Post moved to a new thread.

[vishy76]

I genuinely hope they price it sanely. The current RS245 itself was an extremely tough sell and was enroaching on BMW 330i territory. If the next gen is priced even higher, it will be dead on arrival.

I do disagree with Sirish when he says the vanilla 2.0 TSI Octavia can be tuned for extracting more juice. It's quite the opposite actually. The EA888 Gen 3B (used in the Tiguan Allspace, Superb and the new Octavia) is running a high compression ratio. This in layman's terms means the air fuel mixture is being squeezed and ignited in a very small area relatively, making the engine even more sensitive to fuel quality. The best it can handle in theory is a stage 1 remap that too with good quality fuel. Strapping a bigger turbo is out of question IMO.

The RS245 on the other hand uses a completely different engine with a lower compression ratio and different internals. It is much more resilient to tuning and turbocharging.

[itwasntme]

Originally Posted by vishy76

I do disagree with Sirish when he says the vanilla 2.0 TSI Octavia can be tuned for extracting more juice. It's quite the opposite actually. The EA888 Gen 3B (used in the Tiguan Allspace, Superb and the new Octavia) is running a high compression ratio. This in layman's terms means the air fuel mixture is being squeezed and ignited in a very small area relatively, making the engine even more sensitive to fuel quality. The best it can handle in theory is a stage 1 remap that too with good quality fuel. Strapping a bigger turbo is out of question IMO.

Is this true? I've not found any tuner uprating this engine because it's rare in the West plus fairly new.

[suhaas307]

Originally Posted by vishy76

I genuinely hope they price it sanely. The current RS245 itself was an extremely tough sell and was enroaching on BMW 330i territory. If the next gen is priced even higher, it will be dead on arrival.

I do disagree with Sirish when he says the vanilla 2.0 TSI Octavia can be tuned for extracting more juice. It's quite the opposite actually. The EA888 Gen 3B (used in the Tiguan Allspace, Superb and the new Octavia) is running a high compression ratio. This in layman's terms means the air fuel mixture is being squeezed and ignited in a very small area relatively, making the engine even more sensitive to fuel quality. The best it can handle in theory is a stage 1 remap that too with good quality fuel. Strapping a bigger turbo is out of question IMO.

The RS245 on the other hand uses a completely different engine with a lower compression ratio and different internals. It is much more resilient to tuning and turbocharging.

Originally Posted by itwasntme

Is this true? I've not found any tuner uprating this engine because it's rare in the West plus fairly new.

Yes, this is partially true.

The EA888 Gen3b motor employs a new combustion method based on the Miller Cycle. The Miller Cycle uses a higher expansion ratio than compression ratio, in essence - over-expansion, obtained by either early or late closing of the intake valves (EIVC - Early Intake Valve Closing and LIVC - Late Intake Valve Closing) resulting in a smaller and more effective compression stroke.

This new Gen3b engine has been deliberately restricted at the factory level for the purpose of achieving high levels of efficiency. The idea was for the 2.0 TSI to make power levels similar to that of the erstwhile EA888 Gen3 1.8 TSI motor whilst being about as efficient as the EA211 1.4 TSI. They've managed to (largely) achieve this.

The high-compression nature of the engine will prevent tuners from tweaking it to stratospheric levels that most tuners do, by swapping turbos and hardware components.

However, this does not mean that the car cannot be tuned. You can swap the stock turbo for an OEM IHI IS20 turbo, but you cannot tune it to kingdom come. The tune will have to be super conservative. and of course, it is entirely up to the owner of the car and his appetite for risk.

[itwasntme]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

The tune will have to be super conservative. and of course, it is entirely up to the owner of the car and his appetite for risk.

Come on Suhaas, name some numbers

[suhaas307]

Originally Posted by itwasntme

Come on Suhaas, name some numbers

Honestly, no clue!

But this distinction created by the VAG group will help further distinguish between products like the efficiency-focused Gen3b 2.0 TSI and the full-fat double-cream vRS 2.0 TSI.

That said, it remains to be seen whether the outrageous CBU price tag - that the vRS will invariably command over the regular Elegance/Style/L&K - justifies this fundamental distinction between the two cars. Especially when you consider the fact that you’re dangerously close to RWD Bavarian territory.

[Axe77]

Originally Posted by vishy76

I genuinely hope they price it sanely. The current RS245 itself was an extremely tough sell and was enroaching on BMW 330i territory. If the next gen is priced even higher, it will be dead on arrival.

Originally Posted by suhaas307

Honestly, no clue!

That said, it remains to be seen whether the outrageous CBU price tag - that the vRS will invariably command over the regular Elegance/Style/L&K - justifies this fundamental distinction between the two cars. Especially when you consider the fact that you’re dangerously close to RWD Bavarian territory.

Unlikely this will sport a realistic tag, going by past experience. The 2021 Octavia will only be pricier than the outgoing model so unlikely the VRS will get cheaper than the outgoing.

And however much they may power it up, Bavarian RWD is Bavarian RWD - why would I pick a petrol Octavia VRS when I can own a much more reliable and purist BMW for comparable money. If I want cheaper and lower power with European build, there is the regular Octavia - for plain boring reliability without heart stopping performance, there’s Camry, for 50L plus purist performance, there is BMW. The VRS falls in no mans land unfortunately and will largely be a halo CBU offering with no real sales number of consequence.

[Vandit]

Originally Posted by Axe77

Unlikely this will sport a realistic tag, going by past experience. The 2021 Octavia will only be pricier than the outgoing model so unlikely the VRS will get cheaper than the outgoing.

And however much they may power it up, Bavarian RWD is Bavarian RWD - why would I pick a petrol Octavia VRS when I can own a much more reliable and purist BMW for comparable money. If I want cheaper and lower power with European build, there is the regular Octavia - for plain boring reliability without heart stopping performance, there’s Camry, for 50L plus purist performance, there is BMW. The VRS falls in no mans land unfortunately and will largely be a halo CBU offering with no real sales number of consequence.

Summed up perfectly. Frankly I wonder why Skoda even bothers to repeat their exercise with the way the last RS CBU import went. It was clear dealers struggled to sell it at the price Skoda wanted. In fact I received a call from a dealer somewhere in Nov/Dec asking me if I wanted to take a look at a couple of units they had on had for a reasonable consideration. This was a good couple of months after the media and news channels carried the "all units sold out" articles.

[firstguri]

Yeah, what actually happened with RS 245 was that some people booked it and thought they'll make money on it considering the way RS 230 sold. But then very few bought it when it prices were revealed and those people then cancelled their booking. The articles which stated the cars sold out weren't wrong as the lot was booked but then reality dawned after the prices were declared too close to 3 series and then those pre bookings were cancelled. Finally the unsold lot was rid off when 8 lakhs discount was announced......in fact I've read that it sold within a week.
So therein lies the reason; very few performance sedan lovers in our country and those people know cars! If you launch RS close to 330i territory, those performance sedan lovers know it's not worth it.
I wrote in the Octavia thread as well that the experience with RS 245 should have given some understanding to Skoda India about the price RS needs to be at, to sell. Sadly they're repeating it and I fail to understand their logic!

[Venkatesh]

No Octavia vRS for India.

Zac Hollis adds, “Can’t say for 2023 either”. So that’s a hard-no for the fourth-gen Octavia vRS.

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[Peri_patetic99]

Originally Posted by Venkatesh

No Octavia vRS for India.



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Seeing how their past vRS sales went, i am not so surprised but on the other hand skoda should have learned from their pricing debacle and if corrected, they could've had a winner on their hands with this one.

[Bibendum90949]

So this time around, they're saved from displaying the "sold out too soon" board

[viknb]

Originally Posted by firstguri

The articles which stated the cars sold out weren't wrong as the lot was booked but then reality dawned after the prices were declared too close to 3 series and then those pre bookings were cancelled. Finally the unsold lot was rid off when 8 lakhs discount was announced......in fact I've read that it sold within a week.

There seems to be a lot of confusion and misinformation regarding RS 245s going in and out of stock last year.

We visited Skoda in February to replace our 2009 Laura with a Superb. That's when the Sales Manager, who happens to be our relative, suggested to wait a little as there might be a chance to get an RS 245. Obviously I was shocked having read all those articles of them being sold out. But what the dealership told us was, due to the lockdowns world over, the final shipment of about 30 cars had been put on hold, and would only reach India in March of 2021. That delay of 11 to 13 months since booking date is what made a lot of customers cancel their bookings from the last shipment of 30 or so cars.

Around first week of March, 2021 when we paid the advance and booked the car, came all the articles of dealers offering 8 lakh discounts, so we rushed to the dealership to enquire about this. We also made calls to Chennai, Pune and Mumbai's Skoda dealer and all they could say was that they didn't have stock even if we paid the full price. Turns out this discount was fake news as well which was cleared up by few calls to management at the Aurangabad head office at the Skoda factory.

Atleast, we haggled a bit and were able to get a discount of 3.8 lakhs with the help of all the news, articles and misinformation floating around so something good came out of it.

[Venkatesh]

According to the latest report from Zac Hollis : Skoda India is considering bringing the latest generation Octavia RS to India as a CBU.



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