[Livnletcarsliv]

We are witnessing this phenomenon for quite some time now.

India example 1 - same car, same characteristics but different brand
1. Nissan Terrano vs Renault Duster
2. Nissan Micra vs Renault Pulse
3. Suzuki Baleno vs Toyota Glanza
4. Upcoming Suzuki Ciaz vs Toyota Belta

India example 2 - same car, different characteristics but different brand
1. Hyundai Venue vs Sonet
2. Hyundai Creta vs Seltos
3. Skoda Rapid vs VW Vento
4. Skoda Kushaq vs VW Taigun
5. VW Passat vs Audi A4 vs Audi A6 vs Skoda Superb
6. Toyota Camry vs Lexus ES
7. Urus vs Q8 vs Cayenne vs Bentayga

In example 2, I can understand the economics and business model of the same platform different brands. The product experience and customer experience - both are different here. It is in good books.

However in example 1 - I personally feel and think that it is exploiting the ignorance of a customer. The brands are making a fool out of the customer per se. It is in bad books.

What do you think?

[Tapish]

How is the same car in case 1 exploiting ignorance? I for one liked the Terrano's design but the Duster didn't appeal to me. For you, it may be different. If I was in the segment, maybe I would have bought the Toyota Urban Cruiser instead of the Brezza just for the grille design.

As far as the car is not positioned as something else totally, it cannot be called a case of ignorance/ cheating. I remember the Captur being referred to as the global Captur which was a different car altogether, that clearly was making a fool of the customer, not these.

T

[lawdgawd]

Even Example 2, the buyer needs to only a single day's internet research to understand that the cars are the same.

In that time frame, he would also be able to get the basics of the difference in service experiences, parts availability etc between the two brands.

I don't see any exploitation.

Now, if a buyer is fully focused on the brand name and does not do any research or does not care even if he does, that is his choice, right?

[Livnletcarsliv]

Originally Posted by Tapish

How is the same car in case 1 exploiting ignorance? I for one liked the Terrano's design but the Duster didn't appeal to me. For you, it may be different. If I was in the segment, maybe I would have bought the Toyota Urban Cruiser instead of the Brezza just for the grille design.

Originally Posted by lawdgawd

Now, if a buyer is fully focused on the brand name and does not do any research or does not care even if he does, that is his choice, right?

Except for a couple of cosmetic differences, how is Glaza different from Baleno and Duster different from Terrano?
Terrano and Duster had insignificant differences in the ride and handling dept.

Why would companies rename and rebrand an already successful other brand model and and sell it alongside?

For eg - If I buy a Glanza, neither do I get the Toyota product experience nor the Suzuki maintenance/service experience. Compared to Toyota standards, is Glanza a true Toyota?

[Porcupine]

The two examples are actually vastly different in themselves. The cars in example 1 are mainly the same car with slightly different cosmetic appointments and branding. The cars in example 2 only share platforms and at times drivetrains, but everything else is vastly different.

But with that said the case for both is pretty similar where consumers have preferences and different reactions to certain brands, styling and just an overall ownership experience which build a strong case for doing what the manufacturers are doing - for example the troublesome Skoda aftersales service vs. VW.

I don't think any of it is exploitation or cheating, but in fact a smart way of sharing resources and creating synergies.

[lawdgawd]

Originally Posted by Livnletcarsliv

If I buy a Glanza, neither do I get the Toyota product experience nor the Suzuki maintenance/service experience. Compared to Toyota standards, is Glanza a true Toyota?

That is not the question, though. The information is readily available, and you know what you are getting into. So its not exploitation.

And yes, its not a true Toyota but thats not the question being posed - the practice is called exploitative.

[Livnletcarsliv]

Originally Posted by lawdgawd

That is not the question, though. The information is readily available, and you know what you are getting into. So its not exploitation.

And yes, its not a true Toyota but thats not the question being posed - the practice is called exploitative.

Dude, I would still call it exploitation. At least in India, where more than 70% of customers are ignorant and first-time car buyers. Call it whatever (marketing strategy, partnership strategy, business model, etc), without giving anything extra/significant you are just brain(brand)washing the customers.

[porsche_guy]

I think the examples you have taken in both cases don't seem to be the best ones. I guess the question you want to pose is if rebadging is unethical but platform sharing is not. This is a very complex and subjective answer and may not always be the same for everybody.

As an example, one might say the Terrano was merely a rebadged Duster which till an extent is true, however I think the different styling and interior tweaks aren't something totally insignificant. As for the Glanza and Baleno, again, they are the same cars, however one might prefer the Toyota version due to a better service experience of Toyota/ an extra year of warranty/slightly lower price etc.

I personally find no harm in rebadging as long as it's feasible for the OEMs involved. More variations just mean more choices to the customer and that can't be bad right?

Originally Posted by Livnletcarsliv

Dude, I would still call it exploitation. At least in India, where more than 70% of customers are ignorant and first-time car buyers. Call it whatever (marketing strategy, partnership strategy, business model, etc), without giving anything extra/significant you are just brain(brand)washing the customers.

I think we are straying too far from the topic in question here. Let's not make this another thread blaming the OEMs for everything. Nobody is shoving Glanzas or Balenos into people throats. And as you mentioned, the customers are ignorant, then what should the OEMs do? Hang a huge billboard outside the dealerships that the Glanza is just a rebadged Baleno?


Enough people on this forum have willingly and knowingly bought rebadged cars. The market simply decides if a rebadge is successful or not. It's that simple

[TorqueMonster]

I personally think getting the same car from a different brand has its uses. Is it unethical, I think no. The cars you mentioned in example 1 are of the same segment. A buyer buying a car will not by any means be downgraded, he will get the exact same car, in the same segment, with a different badge on it. There is no actual downgrade happening here. If someone likes a car, and if they are ready to buy it, how does it become exploitation just because the same car under a different badge is also being sold? Both cars are the same, badge aside, and if by buying one car, if they get the same experience as the rebadged, I'm sure the customer is at no loss.

[Porcupine]

Originally Posted by TorqueMonster

4. Bang for your buck - The Camry and the Lexus is the best example. If the Camry offers 80% of the Lexus at a way cheaper rate, the person buying it certainly saving upon a lot of money by not buying the Lexus, once again because of Badge engineering. Skoda Superb offers everything a person may need when compared to the A4, at a much cheaper rate. It is a win for the buyer in the end, getting competent products at a cheaper rate.

This more or less sums it up. The products are built to suit different consumers. Everyone is aware that a Lexus is a Toyota in a more expensive suit - but there definitely is a market for that, people are willing to spend more money on Lexus products over their Toyota counterparts just for the premium appearance and brand perception.

[Kosfactor]

Bad.

Sticker jobs are a desperate attempt to keep the dealers occupied while the company is figuring out whether to launch new products or exit India. Same with useless CBU imports that has to be sold on discount a few months after launch, what did the company gain out of it? Nothing really.

Meanwhile good cars go flying out of the showroom without the salesman having to say a single word.

As customers we need choice and competition among manufacturers so that they come up with good innovative products. Just look at Nissan Magnite, it is unbelievable that such a fine balanced looking car could come at such a low price considering Nissan had Evalia, Micra and Sunny.

Platform sharing is good though, sticker jobs are bad.

[Livnletcarsliv]

Originally Posted by Porcupine

This more or less sums it up. The products are built to suit different consumers. Everyone is aware that a Lexus is a Toyota in a more expensive suit - but there definitely is a market for that, people are willing to spend more money on Lexus products over their Toyota counterparts just for the premium appearance and brand perception.

This belongs to example 2. And I do understand the rationale, economics, and other aspects of this. That's why it's in good books. My concern is with example 1.

[srgntpepper]

Reasons for someone buying a car are as not logical. Else there would one best car that everyone would buy.

Eg in category 1, a friend bought the glanza, despite suspecting Toyota maintenance costs would be higher, because he wanted the blue colour.

Even In an auto focussed site like this one so many decisions are made based on the luxury quotient, or other sentimental reactions. Not based on objective checklist.

To me a Duster and a Mercedes sharing engines could be exploitation but to the buyer who doesn't care about anything but the brand, it means happiness at an affordable point. And who is anyone to judge that.

[girishv]

Pardon me for going OT. Admins please feel free to delete this if found irrelevant.

Many multinational companies also involve in these kind of unfair practices, say for example laptop manufactures.

One such example I found was lenovo selling laptops at almost the same price in India and US.
Only when you look at the specification, you will realise that, only the model number matches. The Indian version comes with a gen old CPU and/or less RAM compared to its US counterpart. If the RAM is same, it will be running at lower speeds. How many of us compare the two models side by side to notice the difference?
Except for apple, I have seen this happening with many OEMs.

Originally Posted by Tapish

As far as the car is not positioned as something else totally, it cannot be called a case of ignorance/ cheating. I remember the Captur being referred to as the global Captur which was a different car altogether, that clearly was making a fool of the customer, not these.

T

[Hayek]

Frankly, badge engineering or platform sharing (call it what you will) has been an intrinsic part of the auto industry for more than 3 decades. The current Tesla factory in Fremont California was originally built by NUMMI - a JV between GM and Toyota which helped introduce Japanese manufacturing practices to GM. There is a case study I have read nearly 2 decades ago on how the nearly identical Toyotas produced in the same plant got materially higher JD Power Initial Quality Scores and Resale Values than the Chevrolet equivalents. You may call it irrational, but automobiles are not purchased just based on an excel
Spreadsheet - they are about the identity of the car buyer, and for a buyer a Nissan is very different from a Dacia (by the way the Duster is not even a real
Renault - it is a badge engineered Dacia) and a Toyota very different from a Maruti.

Some errors in the first post though - while the Passat and the Superb are both built on the stretched version of the MQB platform, the A4 and A6 both have longitudinally mounted engines - and are a different platform (with some shared engines) from MQB.