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Old 13th August 2022, 09:57   #31
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Re: Tall tales from the second-hand car market

Where have all the (good) individual car sellers gone? Where to find them?

Till 5 years back there were plenty of individual (non dealers/ platforms) owners selling directly on carwale/olx/newspaper etc. Where have all of them vanished?
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Old 13th August 2022, 15:31   #32
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Re: Tall tales from the second-hand car market

4 different prices.
3 different odometer readings in a week.
2 different dealers.
1 car.

How does one ever trust these dealers?!
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Old 13th August 2022, 17:24   #33
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Re: Tall tales from the second-hand car market

Quote:
Originally Posted by VPJ74 View Post
Where have all the (good) individual car sellers gone? Where to find them?

Till 5 years back there were plenty of individual (non dealers/ platforms) owners selling directly on carwale/olx/newspaper etc. Where have all of them vanished?
From my casual conversation with a reputed used car dealership's owner, most people are holding on to their cars at the moment and they don't have much inventory. The increasing prices and lesser features due to chip shortage, along with the long wait times have owners with reasonably good cars just deciding to keep the car and not sell them anytime soon. The few owners who do put up ads are immediately contacted by speculators who offer them better prices if they can sell it for them instead and the very short supply means they can control the market this way.

Im going to copy paste this comment I made in the Grand Vitara thread since it is more appropriate here and offers more knowledge:


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Originally Posted by Cresterk View Post
Looking at the extreme prices of pre-owned cars in my state of Kerala (priced at or above the ex-showroom from back when the first owner bought it), it makes zero financial sense to get a pre-owned car nowadays. Gone are the days when you let the first owner take the depreciation hit and then got an almost new used car for 20% less. Most of the people putting up ads today aren't the owner's or even used car dealers with their own inventory but just speculators.

They track down the owners and then convince them that they can get insane prices for their car and take one or two photos of it. Considering most of them can't get photos of the interior, I doubt the owner even takes them seriously enough to let them inside the car or perhaps he is not even aware that his car is being put up for sale. Maybe they only contact the owner if they actually get someone desperate enough to pay whatever they are asking. I'm guessing they are targeting rich people who don't have the patience to deal with a new car's waiting period.


Also another tactic they use is to screenshot the owner's ads and then re-upload them with insane prices. They contact the owner and convince them to take down their own ad and promise them that they can get them much higher prices for a 1% commission. After a lot of searching, I had locked down a deal with the owner of a used endeavour 3.2 which in itself was rather overpriced (I agreed to pay the asking price itself since I had been looking for a car for so long). I took a bit of time to ensure everything was good with the car, found out that it had some major replacements under warranty. While debating with myself on whether or not to still buy it, I called him the next day to ask some more details but to my surprise he told me that the car was already sold. I was shocked since who would have actually offered above asking price without even seeing the car in person? Anyway, while browsing olx again, I saw the same car with the exact same pictures being put up for sale for 8l more! This was by a known speculator based in another city 200 kms away. They hadn't even seen the car or bought it, they apparently just promised the owner they could get a much better price in return for a commission. The car is still up for sale on olx 2 months later though which gives me immense satisfaction


Most of the ads here are put up by this cartel under different names. With rising interest rates and inflation for essential items, especially on fuel, there are actually almost no buyers to pay these prices for used cars but they are being propped up by mindless speculators selling cars with no guarantee of being good and almost no capital invested. The best time to buy a used car will be perhaps in a year once new cars are more readily available and these clowns are bankrupt. The market should adjust itself due to an overabundance of supply from more people actually wanting to sell their well maintained old cars when they get new ones.

Last edited by Cresterk : 13th August 2022 at 17:25.
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Old 21st February 2023, 22:34   #34
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Chronicles of buying a used 'enthusiast' car in India

OLX Ad: Basic details, proper English sentences with desired description (No 'Showroom Candishan', '360% Check', 'Parsi Bumm Premium', 'Engine & GB Gaurantii' etc), 3rd owner car and a note to brokers to not to respond.

Poster Boy - PB (Lets call him that now): Shares car details in prompt manner and is co-operative. Calls himself a car enthusiast. Car was repainted in full recently and some cosmetic accessories added for show-off. All good so far and I find PB as quite a decent fellow.

Buyer (myself) : Why selling?

PB: I am going Abroad for studies, dad doesn't want to keep 2 cars at home.

Buyer checks the service record at Honda. Finds discrepancy in ODO reading. ODO was at 90K in 2020 but the OLX ad says it is at 68K today. First red flag. But given that seller sounded a good boy, ignored.

Buyer: When did you buy it? What was the ODO then? From whom?

PB: 2020, 68K. Direct Seller.

Buyer: Why does the record say 90K in 2020? Why is service not done at Honda after that?

PB: I guess I was scammed by the Agent during selling.

Buyer: Agent? You just said it was a direct purchase? Red Flag 2.

PB: Sorry, there was an agent in between who charged commission. But I spoke to the owner. May be the Agent did the ODO tampering as he also runs a garage. You can see the car its wonderful in condition and then decide. Here is the GoMechanic service record for last service done and I have done it all - Oil, Filters, Suspension Bushes replaced, Suspension checked, Added Strips to stiffen the suspension more, etc.

Buyer gets fooled at the confidence and innocence at the same time.

Buyer: Ok, let me think over it. I work at XYZ area and will come to see on next weekend. You place is a bit far.

PB: Ok, sure.

Next day, buyer gets a call from PB and he says that he is on the way to the area for some work and can show the car if needed. Buyer agrees for the same.

Buyer: Why is the paint finish so lame? Looks like half finished job? Why these aftermarket logos?

PB: Its called Bhatti Paint. Its a premium finish. Logos are original from Japan - JDM make and cost about 5K. I am an auto-enthusiast. Need to keep cars clean and shining.

Buyer: Can you provide the bills for the tyres since they are less than 1 year old? Will be useful for warranty claims.

PB: I have lost the bills. Do the give warranty on tyres? I have never heard of the same ever. Another Red Flag.

Honda Logo looks like made in Dharavi instead of Japan honestly. Car paint job appears to be done by Uday Chopra in his Bandra shade from Dhoom, where he also works on his Gixxerrr and Haiya-Bussa you know.

Car has suspension work at front but PB claims it to be due to runner hitting the inner fender liner. Another red sign. But this time Buyer gets a little suspicious. Car Drives ok till certain RPM but after that it makes a lot of noise. Interior is as per age. Not a sign of a car belonging to an enthusiast.

Buyer: I will let you know in a couple of days.

PB: Oh you should decide by tomorrow. I work/live at YYY place and don't come home often. I may come back after 3 months after this visit. I have to work and study a lot na.

Buyer is now very suspicious by all the sweet talk and enthusiasm to sell. Asks for more time. PB reluctantly agrees.

Goes back to service record of the car, finds name of the seller (PB) in the notes/recommendations. Note says: "Recommendations not approved by PB" Car was getting serviced in the original owners name for a long time it means.

Buyer decides to call the owner to check.

Buyer: Ownerji, your car ABC has come for sale to me. Wanted to know why you sold it?

Previous Owner (PO): I sold that car in 2014, why ask now? Bummer 1.

PO: That car had some engine work, had no average to run it. Quotation from Honda was 2.7L for engine work. So I decided to sell it for 3.75L to Cars24. It had no accident though. No Bumper was ever changed. Bummer 2. .

Buyer: Sir, you have saved me a lot of trouble. May God bless you.

Car was apparently serviced at Honda in PO's name till 2020 and GoMechanic report of 2021 was fully fake. Perhaps it had an accident or so. AC too needed an extra leg to perform perhaps but since it was super hot that day (34-36C outside), that was also OKed/ignored earlier.

Buyer looses hope in Direct sellers now, after-all the behavior was worse than Dealers in this case. Dealer don't lie in your face after getting caught. They either agree to their fault or are upfront about the car condition and don't lie at all like this.

Buyer blames all new generation Medicos and generalizes them as 'Liers' and 'Cheats' for a moment. But after a hard days work, when Buyer goes back home, he forgets everything as a bad dream, realizes that some Doctors are still good people and continues with his search for an 'Enthusiast's Car'.

Last edited by sunilch : 21st February 2023 at 22:40.
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Old 22nd February 2023, 12:38   #35
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Re: Tall tales from the second-hand car market

If you're here for an interesting story, think I have one. It does not involve conning, odometer tampering or any of that, just a series of events that I found very entertaining to witness as a friend.

So a month ago my friend, let us call him Adam, was in the market for a Octavia vRS. It appears the vRS community is moving towards the M340i with the tuning scene picking up for Gxx BMWs, thanks to femtoevo. There were a bunch of vRS cars available, some surprisingly stock and many tuned.

Adam happened to shortlist a few cars but he was very clear that he is not going to pay inflated prices in this ridiculous used car market today. As negotiations were not closing with some sellers, he was getting impatient and a bit agitated. There is another common friend, let us call him Steve, who'd bought a vRS 230 six months' ago and was accompanying Adam and closely tracking the progress of what was happening - cars available in the market, quoted prices, the indifferent attitude of sellers and what not. Steve had his own shortcomings with the vRS and understood if there was ever a time to sell the car, it was now. One day, he suggested to Adam, "Why don't you buy my car, I am willing to sell it?".

Steve had bought this car 6 months ago from a dealer who calls himself an "investor" - generally happens to pay the seller money for the car, take the papers & possession and market the car for a profit.

Now to the fun part:
  • The car was first owned by a doctor in Mangalore and he had tuned the car to Stage 1 at a tuner in Bangalore.
  • An artist bought the car from the doctor sometime in 2021.
  • Dealer bought the car from the artist around April 2022.
  • Steve bought the car from the dealer in July 2022.

- Surprisingly, the tuner had posted something with the artist sometime in 2021 and they started wondering, who actually tuned the car? When we asked the artist, who we got in touch with somehow, he claimed he had taken it to the tuner to have it checked before buying it. Steve had taken the car to the same tuner in July 2022 to have it checked but tuner made no mention of its history, quite obviously as tuners don't like to certify cars or get involved in used car buy & sell processes.

- The dealer mentioned that the artist traded the vRS for a particular pick-up truck so we checked the artist's Instagram page to see when he got the pick-up, so we could understand how long the dealer had the car with him. It turns out he posted it first in April 2022, adding up the history of the car to us.

- We used one of the Vaahan apps on Android and it somehow still reflected the first owner name. Unfortunately, we could not make progress in getting in touch with the first owner and ask him more about the car.

In general, everything seemed to be ok. Also, Steve had driven the car for about 10,000 KMs before this, so everything seemed to be working fine in the car.

I am sharing this story to inform people on the forum that generally there is a lot more than what meets the eye when it comes to used cars. It is important to understand how the dealer procured the car and verify what he claims - in this case things added up but in some, they may not.
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Old 22nd February 2023, 13:57   #36
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Re: Tall tales from the second-hand car market

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Originally Posted by HighRevving View Post
Steve had his own shortcomings with the vRS and understood if there was ever a time to sell the car, it was now. One day, he suggested to Adam, "Why don't you buy my car, I am willing to sell it?".
Curious, did Adam buy Steve's car?
What's the reason (shortcomings) Steve wanted to sell it to Adam? Would Adam be in trouble if he buys the car?
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Old 22nd February 2023, 15:12   #37
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Re: Chronicles of buying a used 'enthusiast' car in India

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Originally Posted by sunilch View Post
Buyer looses hope in Direct sellers now, after-all the behavior was worse than Dealers in this case. Dealer don't lie in your face after getting caught. They either agree to their fault or are upfront about the car condition and don't lie at all like this.

Buyer blames all new generation Medicos and generalizes them as 'Liers' and 'Cheats' for a moment. But after a hard days work, when Buyer goes back home, he forgets everything as a bad dream, realizes that some Doctors are still good people and continues with his search for an 'Enthusiast's Car'.

The recent boom in used car prices due to the shortage of new cars lead to some used car dealers, brokers and agents making quite a lot of money by charging very high commissions. As usual, news of this spread and this has lead to every two bit scam artists, opportunists and sleazebags trying to jump in on this craze. Some of them have even resorted to calling themselves financial experts/businessmen and have started taking money from 'investors' promising them high returns for funding.

And then we have similar minded people without much capital taking cars that would normally rot on the side of the road and then trying to dress it up a bit and pass it off to some unsuspecting buyer who is in urgent need of a car. Both types of people are best avoided. They will unashamedly tell you any lie and will resort to any method to make money. That guy probably wasn't even a real medico.
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Old 22nd February 2023, 16:49   #38
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Re: Tall tales from the second-hand car market

Quote:
Originally Posted by MyLife_MyCar View Post
Curious, did Adam buy Steve's car?
What's the reason (shortcomings) Steve wanted to sell it to Adam? Would Adam be in trouble if he buys the car?
Yes, Adam bought Steve's car and it is all good. Steve wanted an inexpensive beater car that would provide better FE and take on bad roads. There was nothing wrong with the car.
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Old 25th March 2023, 00:34   #39
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Re: Tall tales from the second-hand car market

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Originally Posted by HighRevving View Post
If you're here for an interesting story, think I have one. It does not involve conning, odometer tampering or any of that, just a series of events that I found very entertaining to witness as a friend…
Good day sir
Actually the first owner is from Kundapur
He’s a friend of my uncle, I had asked about the car when he sold it to this Bangalore guy.
He was the one who got it tuned by Harmonix they had come down and tuned it. I saw this car on tbhp classifieds last year. When I had asked the owner in the beginning on why he’s selling this car he told me that their service was good and gave me advice to STAY AWAY FROM SKODA PRODUCTS IF YOU WANT TO HAVE A PEACEFUL LIFE

Mod Note: Please avoid quoting entire posts. Quote only the relevant/small part for ease of reading for our mobile users

Last edited by graaja : 29th June 2023 at 19:48. Reason: Trimming quoted text
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Old 29th June 2023, 18:27   #40
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Re: Tall tales from the second-hand car market

Hi

Found a 800km run Tucson which is manufactured in 2016, registered in 2019 to Hyundai Motor India, claimed to be allotted to a Korean employee but hardly used. I'm guessing it was a BS 4 lying in stock and registered before BS6 stock. Insurance expired in 2020 and not renewed. It's the base Tucson 2WD L model.

Looking to pick up this if there are no red flags.

Advice from Fellow Pre Worshipped buyers would be very useful.

This is the first used car I'm looking at.
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