[TusharK]

Maruti Suzuki is developing flex-fuel engines that will be able to run on up to 85% ethanol blend. However, prior to their introduction, Maruti will roll out E20-compliant engines in India by April 2023.



The Government of India had announced its plans to introduce 20% ethanol blending with petrol in some parts of the country from April 2023. At present, the petrol available in India has 10-15% ethanol. Any higher and the engines would require a few modifications essentially to handle the corrosive nature of the fuel.

Significant modifications to the ECU as well as injection and ignition systems would be required for the engines to run on E85. Moreover, India could also be the first market to get BS6-compliant E85 engines.

Meanwhile, Maruti Suzuki is also strengthening its CNG portfolio. Recently, the carmaker introduced the Swift CNG. The carmaker is also exploring bio-CNG as an alternative fuel.

Source: Autocar India

Link to Team-BHP News

[PrideRed]

Heard that Scooters are coming up with updated engine to handle extra ethanol content and prices are expected to rise by 8-10%. I don't know if the price hike is just to be compliant to new fuel or even includes changes to adhere to new CAFE/BS6.2 norms, but another significant price hike will impact auto industry.

[Livnletcarsliv]

85% ethanol blend? Seriously? What next - engines that can run on 100% ethanol, whisky, brandy, beer, sugarcane extract, etc.

While Maruti can build such engines, how can international manufacturers be able to make engines that are E85 compliant when these brands are producing engines globally and for global markets?

I can sense the influence that Maruti should have given to the Central government to continue to dominate the market.

[Reinhard]

Slightly off topic - but if the authorities / auto-makers are working on as much as 85% of ethanol blend - why not in fact work on an "all-new" technological invention? Like Otto-Diesel did with the current ICE cycles? Why not make a 100% ethanol burning engine, which is still eco-friendly and long lasting?

I know the doubt borders a bit on sarcasm/joke - but would it really be that complex to get rid of the last 15% of gasoline in the fuel that sprays from the injector? Just a thought to open a discussion. For example - Brazil I believe has E100 (something like that) fuel available since many years. Then how come rest of the world continues to burn petrol for everything? Is the Ethanol manufacture that much costlier to keep petrol still viable at current crude prices?

Originally Posted by Livnletcarsliv

While Maruti can build such engines, how can international manufacturers be able to make engines that are E85 compliant when these brands are producing engines globally and for global markets?

Well - actually E85 is not new, its pretty well established in highly-developed countries. Its quite regularly available in the US, some EU countries, Australia etc in fact. So from that perspective, the development by Suzuki, will only help its exports further .

[condor]

85% ethanol blend will be a long time away/ may never happen, especially if this ethanol is plant based. Food grains for people need to be taken care of first, before diverting any grains on a large scale for other usage.

[Mustang_Boss]

Originally Posted by condor

85% ethanol blend will be a long time away/ may never happen, especially if this ethanol is plant based. Food grains for people need to be taken care of first, before diverting any grains on a large scale for other usage.

Sugar is used to produce Ethanol. With better MSP (Minimum support price) for sugar, its availability is in abundance and exceeds our domestic needs. We couldnt get rid of the same as the international price of sugar is cheaper when compared to our MSP . So, Ethanol blend is a very good way to get rid of it and in turn saving some Dollars for the country.

[Shreyans_Jain]

Originally Posted by condor

85% ethanol blend will be a long time away/ may never happen, especially if this ethanol is plant based. Food grains for people need to be taken care of first, before diverting any grains on a large scale for other usage.

Sugarcane, brother!!

Bulk of this ethanol will come from sugarcane. That it is a most water guzzling plant is nobody’s concern. It is the sugar lobby at work here. And it is no coincidence that this agenda is being pushed by the minister who so happens to be a sugar baron himself.

[Black_Star]

Originally Posted by Livnletcarsliv

85% ethanol blend? Seriously? What next - engines that can run on 100% ethanol, whisky, brandy, beer, sugarcane extract, etc.

How about electric and gas too?

Meet Toyota Corolla Altis Hybrid from Brazil, it can run on petrol, 100% ethanol and electric. The future is here

[abhi9044]

All these developments and talks but still can't introduce their 'BS6 ready' Diesel Engine

[Mustang_Boss]

Originally Posted by abhi9044

All these developments and talks but still can't introduce their 'BS6 ready' Diesel Engine

I think the problem here is multi-folded.
Do we have BS6 fuel available everywhere? Just by plonking Bigger DPF without having BS6 fuel, the DPF failures will occur. You need to drive long to get rid of additional soot accumulating in DPF, which is cumbersome for most users.

The other way is to use Ad-Blue or other solutions, which people will not prefer in the lower price bracket. Makes things complex.

BS6 diesel engines could be more sensitive, atleast in the lower price bracket delivering lower CC. How unadulterated our fuel is? Everyone knows the answer.

And then the additional cost for building a complex engine, which again most people dont accept under 10L segment.

On the other hand, working with a Petrol engine is easy. Switching to plastic tanks and changing fuel lines and few other components comprises of ~60-75% of this solution.

Hyundai uses CRDI tech whereas Honda have their own inhouse engine, which shouldn't be considered for this comparison. Honda has taken its own sweet time to develop IDtech Engine.

I agree with your point of view, but bashing Suzuki is not going to help in anyway. I don't think Maruti will launch a diesel engine until BS6 unadulterated diesel is made available everywhere.

[TwerkyC0ffee]

What will happen to existing vehicles once the 85% ethanol blended fuel is mandated? Will they require any modifications to maintain their compatibility or the government has some new stupid rule coming up?

[fhdowntheline]

The government needs to give a proper road map on how long can existing petrol engines be used before E20+ fuel is the only option across all petrol pumps. Just shooting off random deadlines wont work. What is the thought process suggested for buyers who are planning to buy new cars from now on until 2023.

[Carma2017]

I think it's a sensible plan. We can't put all our eggs in the EV basket alone. China anyway controls almost all lithium mining sans Australia. So, world and by extension India is bound to be dependent on China for their EVs in the near term and medium term. The world's leading battery researcher, BYD, is Chinese. Even our Indian EVs like Nexon already are sporting Chinese components galore. Any conflict will lay bare this dependency although to be true it is not the only item for which we are dependent on China. However till the time we have non rare earth battery tech available, one would remain worried.

So, we need to look at all other options like Hybrids, Fuel Cell vehicles, hydrogen vehicles, Bio CNG, ethanol etc. India is anyways a sugar surplus nation with rich sugarcane belts in UP and Maharashtra. So, supplies should not be an issue.

[Reinhard]

Originally Posted by TwerkyC0ffee

What will happen to existing vehicles once the 85% ethanol blended fuel is mandated? Will they require any modifications to maintain their compatibility or the government has some new stupid rule coming up?

A mandate of particular high concentration of ethanol - doesn't make existing fuel blend redundant. If the regulation comes up for something like 85% blend in future - obviously the fuel stations will have dispensers for both types of fuel (additional nozzles - Unleaded-E85-XP95-Diesel-TurboJet" etc etc. In most cases, the government regulation requires for the current fuel blend to be kept available along with new fuel type for about 15-20 years at least, which covers the lifespan of the current breed of vehicles by and large, after which most of them get phased out anyway.

[ds.raikkonen]

The use of ethanol to reduce GHG emissions is not clear, there have been studies in this direction which suggest otherwise. As per these studies, the carbon sink created by growing plants to create the bio-ethanol is not enough to offset the emissions created during well to wheel process.

Currently the ratio of ethanol blended is for anti-knock purpose, taking that up to 85% does not make sense for our mass market cars currently.

85% ethanol fuel is meant for high performance vehicles which other wise run on high octane fuel as it has similar anti-knock properties i.e. sports/hyper cars which run on higher temp/compression ratios/engine speeds.

For our purpose, HEVs/PHEVs are the best intermediate step towards BEVs that run on energy produced from renewable sources and not coal power.