[LokiPilaniya]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

A steady 70 to 80 kmph gets me to my destination no later than the chaps who are forever accelerating off at 100 or 120 kmph. A junction, a railway crossing, navigating through a town,, a herd of cattle, a toll plaza are all equalizers of speedsters and slow pokes like me alike. Indian roads by habit, attitudes and design are simply not meant for driving safely beyond 80 kmph. Just one old man's views.

Exactly, just drive within the speed limits and check your own safety, wear seat belts follow the rules. It is as simple as that.
I've been doing this and I love it, I enjoy the road also as I'm within speed limits I have enough time to react if anything happens.


I've travelled on this particular road 2 times (Jaipur-Mumbai) and never faced any issues.

Not sure why people are questioning the road infra or authorities!
It's a clear case of overspeeding and safety negligence by the driver and passengers. How hard it is to see for everyone?

Yes, you can question road infra and authorities but only if you were following your own safety measures in the first place!
If you neglect your own safety then why question others?

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by LokiPilaniya

Exactly, just drive within the speed limits and check your own safety, wear seat belts follow the rules. It is as simple as that.

Not sure why people are questioning the road infra or authorities!
It's a clear case of overspeeding and safety negligence by the driver and passengers. How hard it is to see for everyone?

Yes, you can question road infra and authorities but only if you were following your own safety measures in the first place!
If you neglect your own safety then why question others?

Thank you for your post not pandering to political correctness. For purposes of the analysis we should separate the empathy for the injured and deceased {which I have expressed in prior posts} from the hard facts on the ground.

Even if we cannot estimate the speed this was a car it seems that was trying to overtake from the left side {i.e. the incorrect side} at exactly the point the car was entering a bridge. If that is the case then even if we assume they were at a legal speed, which might be the case, overtaking on a bridge is a no-no, overtaking at the point both vehicles are just entering/have just entered a bridge is a bigger no-no and so is overtaking from the wrong side.

Road infrastructure in India is poor. It has got better in the last decade or so but still poor in spades. We cannot change it overnight or even in 5 years. What we can change overnight is the way we drive and take ownership for our own safety.

[balenoed_]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

..it seems that was trying to overtake from the left side {i.e. the incorrect side}... overtaking at the point both vehicles are just entering/have just entered a bridge is a bigger no-no and so is overtaking from the wrong side.

On a 3 lane road, where all the 3 lanes goes towards one direction, is overtaking from left side a wrong thing? Didn't know. Can't we overtake from either side on a divided multi lane road?

[itwasntme]

Originally Posted by balenoed_

On a 3 lane road, where all the 3 lanes goes towards one direction, is overtaking from left side a wrong thing? Didn't know. Can't we overtake from either side on a divided multi lane road?

Technically, yes I am afraid, but we know in real life.

[msdivy]

On a typical divided 4-lane, unfenced Indian highway:
80 to 100: Comfortable speed for relaxed driving
Above 120: Needs complete attention from the driver
Above 140: Needs extreme attention from the driver and hope nothing goes wrong (like dogs, cows, jaywalking, bad roads, puddles, etc)

If the drive was for leisure, the driver didn't have to speed. It's driver error and bad judgment. So a rich man lost his life in an expensive car. Yes, he had a chance if he had worn seatbelts. RIP.

[PreludeSH]

Originally Posted by balenoed_

On a 3 lane road, where all the 3 lanes goes towards one direction, is overtaking from left side a wrong thing? Didn't know. Can't we overtake from either side on a divided multi lane road?

Even I am confused. When you have trucks or other slow moving vehicles on the right lane, you need to use the left lane to pass.

Of course changing lanes at the last minute without having a clear view of the left lane (or right lane) is dangerous. Its even dangerous when moving to middle lane on a 3 lane highway. I have seen vehicles moving to centre lane from left and right at almost the same time after passing a truck in the middle lane I find 3 lanes very dangerous if not having a clear view.

Always keep a long distance from the vehicle in the front. I slow down to achieve this sometimes when a vehicle cuts in front of me. Enjoying the drive for me is not about cutting left and right regularly nor travelling above 100 kmph.

[MT_Hyderabad]

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

Looking at the speeds they were traveling at…

Attachment 2355434

Illustration from Deccan Herald.

Longlive the Mathematician who calculated 180 to 190 km/hr in that image.

There are also people who are saying that as average speed is 133km/hr, they must be doing more than 150 at the time of accident.
Sir, why this bias? They may be doing 90km/hr in this stretch and 160 on the other sections.. Who knows?

The lady seems to be a responsible driver, like most of us pretend to be on social media platforms (pun intended). She also posted some traffic complaints to Mumbai traffic police earlier in her driving career.

We had responsible doctors and knowledgeable people in the car, who would not have let the car go beyond 120 km/hr. I am confident about it.

I will be too cautious to blame high speed until proven. It may be that it collided at 90 km/hr, which is a good enough speed to kill someone not buckled up and the condition of the car is a testimony to this assumption.

Let the black box data be out, we will all see what actually happened.

[Ishallownabmw]

Originally Posted by balenoed_

On a 3 lane road, where all the 3 lanes goes towards one direction, is overtaking from left side a wrong thing? Didn't know. Can't we overtake from either side on a divided multi lane road?

The Telangana traffic website mentioned overtaking is permitted from the right. I remember reading about it. However, this is the only source I could find regarding road laws in India. Link

The only reason I would ever overtake from the left is if the driver ahead has indicated me to do so. With a lot of dread. Usually I wait till the driver ahead allows me to pass from the right. Sometimes it never happens and I'm stuck cursing the driver ahead. The more patient you are the more safer is what I've learnt. Personally (India being Right Hand Drive) I have no vision if I'm behind a vehicle as to what is ahead when it comes to passing from left hand side. I would need to move quite some distance to the left to ascertain vision as compared to moving right. If I am on a three lane highway I would leave the extreme right lane for vehicles moving at faster speeds and maintain my course in the middle lane.

[kadanaJ]

If there's a positive take-away from this incident, it's that the front 2 passengers surviving, and the rear 2 passing away, has made something "click" in people's heads.

Many folks in my circle automatically realised that the rear passengers must not have been wearing seatbelts. Many have sworn that from now on, they will start wearing seatbelts at the rear.

Whether they actually follow through, is another matter entirely.

[simplyself]

Some videos purportedly minutes before the collision happened do not show the car to be travelling in high speed. That can be observed in relation to the speed of trucks on that road.

One report mentions that the three laned road suddenly turns into 2 laned one at the start of the bridge.

Whatever might be the speed, not buckling up might had cost Mr Mistry his life.

[LokiPilaniya]

Originally Posted by MT_Hyderabad

They may be doing 90km/hr in this stretch and 160 on the other sections.. Who knows?

I think this section has a speed limit of 60km/h. There is a flyover with sharp bend 500-700 meters before the accident spot/bridge and then there is toll both right after the bridge. A speed limit of 80-90 km/h or anything higher on this section would be a disaster!

The lady seems to be a responsible driver, like most of us pretend to be on social media platforms (pun intended).

Not everyone pretend but there are many responsible drivers and then there are those you've mentioned about. I used to drive fast on the highways like 130-140 and this was some 5-6 years ago. But now my basic rule is to follow the speed limit and defensive driving. I lost my best friend to a high speed car accident on Kishangarh bypass on Jaipur-Ajmer Highway where just before the accident car was doing 220+km/h and went under the truck from passenger side where my friend was seated. While the driver came out with just a scratch on his head!

We had responsible doctors and knowledgeable people in the car, who would not have let the car go beyond 120 km/hr. I am confident about it.

And I know few "responsible doctors and knowledgeable people" who doesn't care about the speed and just say my car will handle it! So I doubt it. I hope authorities check timing between tolls which this car crossed as it was on the highway, that will also tell the truth and the black box data from Merc.

I will be too cautious to blame high speed until proven. It may be that it collided at 90 km/hr, which is a good enough speed to kill someone not buckled up and the condition of the car is a testimony to this assumption.

Absolutely, but there is one more thing about over speeding. "When driving if you don't have the reaction time to correct yourself then you are over speeding"
It's like a highway may have the speed limit of 100km/h but it's us who needs to maintain a certain speed by judging the factors like traffic, road-weather condition and visibility so that we have that reaction time.

[HTC]

Originally Posted by sameer sultan

Please elaborate for my knowledge how a pilot and a sweep car could have provided safety in this accident scenario?

@Sameer,
Since these are high net worth individuals and their safety is important to their business, economy and large number of dependent familis of their business ventures - they need to be mindful of their safety. Not just road travel, could be any event.

I have seen politicos and top officials having pilot vehicles which leads the convoy ( or just one car as needed) giving a healthy distance from itself and the following vehicles. Also, they inform any dangers ( like unmarked humps, ditches, road conditions etc ) to the following cars using walkie talkies. Sweep cars will protect the main car from anyone trying to cause danger or attack from behind. also, they carry emergency medical supplies if needed. This setup can be done without creating inconvenience to general public and the whole setup can be done in a subdued manner (Have highly trained people in just 2 cars -front and back. Use sirens only on a need basis etc.

Hope this helps.

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by Kln

Quite telling that the media is solely focusing on 'personal responsibility' and rear seat belts rather than the awful state of highways and roads and the sheer lack of any action by the government. Propaganda much, TOI?

Propaganda too much? No way. Give us more. Bring it on.

It is about time the media started harping on about personal driving responsibility rather than generalised "freak accident" stuff

Originally Posted by Kln

The rumour mills and "unnamed sources said" industry is working overtime to not pin the blame on the horrible state of the roads and create an atmosphere of 'personal responsibility'. Very sad to see distinguished members of this forum fall for what clearly is a campaign to avoid any scrutiny of highway authorities.

I see a rumour mill of one: You! Well, OK, not really: almost all of us want to see better, safer roads --- but we are not making it a one-sided question. It's not that you're wrong, exactly.

But, by all means, continue to lobby for better road design, better road signage. Judging only by what I have seen on this thread, as I have never been there, this sudden running out of that lane does seem to be, in itself, potentially lethal.

And anyway, what are going to do during this long, long campaign to improve infrastructure? Watch the people die because they can't cope with the infrastructure we have?

And what are you going to do when you succeed? Watch more people die because they take bigger risks and drive faster on the new, wonderful roads?

Originally Posted by LokiPilaniya

Yes, you can question road infra and authorities but only if you were following your own safety measures in the first place!
If you neglect your own safety then why question others?

Exactly. Please, let us have better roads, but this must come first, now, then and always.

[LokiPilaniya]

Originally Posted by simplyself

One report mentions that the three laned road suddenly turns into 2 laned one at the start of the bridge.

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

Judging only by what I have seen on this thread, as I have never been there, this sudden running out of that lane does seem to be, in itself, potentially lethal.

I've been to this road twice and I never noticed anything lethal.
There are Rumble strips on the flyover before this section and then there are Rumble strips when you are approaching the bridge and also the gap in the divider. I am very much confident that this is a 60 km/h zone.

But if someone is ignoring all these indications and saying that there was a sudden change of lanes from 3 to 2 then they just need to get their eyes checked or maybe they should avoid driving on the highways for their and others safety!

Rumble strips are a road safety feature to alert/warn inattentive drivers of a stop or slowdown ahead, or of an approaching potential danger spot.(Wiki)

Here's a screenshot of the accident spot and road.

[3WiseMen]

Well this is very sad. Condolences to families who have lost their dear ones.

While there are way too many road accidents that place in our country, this one being high profile, will definitely be an eye opener for most.

I think the lessons learnt from this are:

While driving
1) Always wear seatbelts - the crash rating score is calculated after strapping all passengers with seatbelts, even those at the back. And children must be in car seats. Most Indian parents/children dislike it, but the sad truth is most cars are 5 star rated for adults, and the rating for kids is lower - now imagine a screnario without a car seat.
2) Drive within speed limits - if not a divider, it could have been a very big pothole or an animal/human crossing or some other unforeseen contingency. A crisis avoided is always better than a crisis averted.
3) While ADAS and other aids are great and will help you, they are not fool proof and therefore the driver must not loose concentration.

While deciding what car to purchase
1) Be wiser with your choices of car purchase, look at Star Ratings. (I know in this case there was a Mercedes and it is generally considered to be safe, but imagine if there was a 2/3 star car instead - One can only imagine how much worse it would have got with a less safer car!)
2) While purchasing a car look at factors such as 'Unstable Bodyshell'. Bodyshell shall and will always be your first line of defence. No amount of airbags or electronics can be substituted by a stable body shell that will take most of the impact for you.
3) Rather than creature comfort features, opt for safety features. The former will give you bragging rights, the latter will ensure you survive to be able to brag.
4) Avoid cars where the car has not been given for crash testing. Merely because a particular model sold in one region is a 5 star is no guarantee for even the Indian version being a 5 star. I vaguely remember reading on this forum how Kia Seltos sold here is a 3 star car but sold in the USA is a 5 star car. Similarly, the VAG India 2.0 have not been tested, a mere assurance that their internal tests are more stringent should not be enough - as the concerned manufacturers have not been transparent about what these criteria are, how they differ or exceed the NCAP standards, and ultimately how the models fared when tested.


@Mods: I have been contemplating a few ideas for a while. I'm not sure if this is workable, but please consider my suggestions:

1) I was wondering if we can in all our future reviews can add a little section on safety, which is not just limited to the advertised safety features but also crash rating scores. Maybe our reviews will influence people's choices, and ultimately maybe even pressurise the manufacturers to all get tested with the same norm.

2) While there are many posts in different threads where people with the knowledge have written about how one NCAP's stringency varies from the other, as there are enhanced parameters for awarding stars. Maybe we could have dedicates posts on these, maybe that will raise awareness that not all NCAP 4/5 stars are the same, and accordingly better choices will be made.

3) Maybe we all could sign a collective petition/representation where we request the concerned Ministry to mandate all manufacturers before launching a particular model, to have them crash tested, using the same yardstick. This I believe is as important as mandating 2/6 airbags. While many manufacturers would find this uncomfortable, but the sad truth is, in our nation which boasts the highest road accidents, we need safer cars - for the passengers.

4) A similar petition/representation could also be made for road signs, painting of road lines, marking of speed humps.

(I know it may be argued that this may be a little strong reaction to an event and that there are way too many road accidents that happen everyday, and therefore this one accident does not justify these actions - merely because it involved famous personalities. But think of it this way, this is for the first time, the issue of road safety has made a traction. Everyone right now seems to have taken cognisance of it. In a world where we forget things a little too soon, we must strike while the iron is hot.)