[hanzt]

Finally after following up for over 3 months with Toyota, got their official reply on whether to use E20 fuel in cars where the manual states use E10 only.



Again, there is no clear plan from Toyota on how they are going to address this problem for all their existing customers who have E10 compliant cars.

[Shreyans_Jain]

Originally Posted by hanzt

Finally got a official response from Toyota.
You can read it here (List all cars that are E20 and E20+ petrol compliant)

Thanks for sharing. Reposting the image here for everyone's convenience.



They have clearly mentioned not to use fuel with more than 10% ethanol content, and that doing so will void the warranty on affected parts. This also puts to rest the false claim peddled by their senior executive at a media event that "you can run any of our cars from 2013 or later on E20 fuel without any problems for the rest of the vehicle life.” .

https://www.v3cars.com/news/all-toyo...oduct%20plans.

[Sumedik]

Originally Posted by hanzt

Finally after following up for over 3 months with Toyota, got their official reply on whether to use E20 fuel in cars where the manual states use E10 only.

Thanks for sharing this useful insight. Does this apply to Maruti made Toyota cars or Toyota made Toyota cars?

This negates this article completely:https://www.v3cars.com/news/all-toyo...-e20-flex-fuel

Maybe they interpreted the ambiguous official statement with respect to confirmation bias!

[venkyhere]

So its finally clear (atleast from the one example of Toyota response) : Manufacturers have long known that what they have been selling in 2023 isn't E20 ready, yet they allow customers to be stabbed in the back by the govt, who are in cahoots with the sugarcane mafia. Blended fuel is really a business deal, not the 'let's save the exchequer 20% crude import' , because commensurate money is paid by the govt to the sugarcane industry.

Atleast the speculation regarding "have manufacturers safeguarded their customers against E20" is over.

[GTO]

Thanks for sharing, hanzt! Moving your post out to a new thread so as to warn others. A new thread means 100X the views & 100X the visibility in search engines, including Google. Will add to homepage later this week .

@ BHPians, if you should spot any good post in an existing thread that deserves its own new thread, please report the post and we'll move it out for greater visibility.

Thank you!

[Shreyans_Jain]

Pity all those Innova HyCross buyers who are stuck with E10 rated cars, after having paid the Toyota premium for reliability and peaceful ownership. It is shameful that a company like Toyota sold the new model of its most prolific and successful product for a good 6 months without making it compatible with the kind of petrol it will be run on. It is only now that they have made it E20 compliant, that too silently.

Toyota’s response is also reconfirmation of the fact that what’s written in the manual is the law.. All specifications mentioned therein have to be followed to the T, else you are playing fast and loose with your warranty coverage.

[hanzt]

Originally Posted by Sumedik

Thanks for sharing this useful insight. Does this apply to Maruti made Toyota cars or Toyota made Toyota cars?

Maybe they interpreted the ambiguous official statement with respect to confirmation bias!

As you can see from Q1, I asked this specifically for Urban Cruiser.

[anjan_c2007]

An excellent revelation that should rattle proponents of mindless E20 and E20 plus blending of petrol under the garb of clean air and lower outgo of petrodollars. They are in reality enriching their own ethanol manufacturing units. But how much of the air is in reality getting cleaner is not yet quantified. But for sure, non E10 automobiles are presently facing the wrath of this blending and their fuel lines and fuel related components are becoming dirtier and murkier.

In fact no automobile that is either non- E10 or E20 compliant can withstand these concoctions and owners will for themselves find the outcomes.

But while concluding the post, I must candidly say that even TKM's confession or a few critical comments from consumers won't unnerve those at the helm. They are used to forcing down concoctions down the throats of the gullible consumers and shall continue to do so.

[Sumedik]

Originally Posted by hanzt

As you can see from Q1, I asked this specifically for Urban Cruiser.

Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain

This also puts to rest the false claim peddled by their senior executive at a media event that "you can run any of our cars from 2013 or later on E20 fuel without any problems for the rest of the vehicle life.” .

Putting the two contradictory views together and trying to be optimistic, the senior executive might have meant Toyota made Toyota cars are E20 material compliant and in response to Hanzt's query Toyota has given a fail-safe response since the concerned car Urban Cruiser is made by Maruti Suzuki. Toyota would not know about E20 material compliance of MS cars most likely.

[Shreyans_Jain]

Originally Posted by Sumedik

Putting the two contradictory views together and trying to be optimistic, the senior executive might have meant Toyota made Toyota cars are E20 material compliant and in response to Hanzt's query Toyota has given a fail-safe response since the concerned car Urban Cruiser is made by Maruti Suzuki. Toyota would not know about E20 material compliance of MS cars most likely.

Whenever any car, or any product is sold by any company bearing its name, it is that company’s responsibility to ensure the product is compliant with all its standards. Outsourcing is part and parcel of manufacturing, and this is its basic tenet. Who makes it and where is not the customer’s concern.

There is no scenario in which Toyota did not know what was going into the cars manufactured by Maruti Suzuki on their account. Each and every component, process and procedure is cross checked and validated before a company signs off on another company making its product. It is Toyota’s, or any other company who has outsourced, job to ensure that.

Toyota knew, and the specs were clearly mentioned in the owner’s manual. What was being written therein has been consistent throughout, and the company is standing by it.

[lapis_lazuli]

I have been trying to call this out , not just Toyota Suzuki but at many places. It's baffling: ignorance and non chalance on the aam junta part, atmosphere of impunity in bureaucratic circles and an uncanny but studied (ominous) silence from both fuel and vehicle makers. Even on this forum, I have doubts if all members are equally bothered. It is a threat, albeit you can get your car repaired every year, but that's just not the point. Why the collective bluff ??

[ashwin.terminat]

Originally Posted by lapis_lazuli

I have been trying to call this out , not just Toyota Suzuki but at many places. It's baffling: ignorance and non chalance on the aam junta part, atmosphere of impunity in bureaucratic circles and an uncanny but studied (ominous) silence from both fuel and vehicle makers. Even on this forum, I have doubts if all members are equally bothered. It is a threat, albeit you can get your car repaired every year, but that's just not the point. Why the collective bluff ??

Mahindra's XUV700 petrol engine is also not equipped for E20 fuel.

[jthomas]

What need to be done for existing E10 vehicles to use E20 fuel? Does this require a lot of changes or just few parts to be replaced Hycross produced in Jan/Feb/March are not E20 compliant.

So how many internal components would have been changed for manufacturing E20 complaint vehicle. A detailed analysis would be very helpful.

[GForceEnjoyer]

Looking at how we can barely be sure of the grade of fuel we are receiving at pumps currently, I think it's high time that we receive clarification on whether or not the cars we own are compliant or not. If they aren't, we should be informed of the changes necessary to do so. Why should we destroy our prized possessions by being forced to put in fuel that's harmful to them?

Manufacturers like Tata have made their existing engines E20 compliant recently, meaning that it can definitely be done to other older engines too (leaving out the cost for now). Information regarding what the changes were is the need of the hour. I'm sure we've collectively had enough of being left in the dark like this.

[Cresterk]

Originally Posted by jthomas

What need to be done for existing E10 vehicles to use E20 fuel? Does this require a lot of changes or just few parts to be replaced Hycross produced in Jan/Feb/March are not E20 compliant.

So how many internal components would have been changed for manufacturing E20 complaint vehicle. A detailed analysis would be very helpful.

My April 2023 manufactured Hycross doesn't have the E20 sticker either, despite it being manufactured after the govt deadline and being subject to the price increase

Meanwhile Toyota has quietly added these changes to the User Manual :




Toyota only mentions damages might occur at ethanol 50 or above. More clarification would be nice though.