[v12]

Drivers, Pedestrians and Traffic cops are all to be blamed for all traffic problems created.

How many of us have seen cops hiding behind trees and electric boxes just to catch offenders when they shud be standing at the signal

junction? Who is to be blamed if the offender causes and accident if he hits a pedestrian (who has crossed on a red light)? The pedestrain??

The cop?? The driver??
The Driver cos he broke the signal.
The Pedesttrain cos he also broke the signal.
The cop also. Cos if he was at the junction (instead of hiding), the driver wud not have broken the signal and the guy wudnt be injured/killed.

Also cops are more on the lookout for making money rather than preventing anyone from breaking the rules. You cant blame them too. They

are poor and have a family to support. That doesnt mean they can do all this. Everything isin the hands of the Govt. This is what I feel they

shud do :

1. > Stop registration of new auto-rickshaws. We have enough of them.
2. > Increase the salary of the traffic cops. Also give them basic amenities.
3. > Make tests for licenses more strict.
4. > Install cameras at signals.

[normally_crazy]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]Stop registration of new auto-rickshaws. We have enough of them

this is an absolute gem of a point , but just try and say this and people say where will the common man go ? taxis r too xpensive !!

better still dont allow the autos on the arterial roads of the city..the western and eastern express highways shud be off limits for autos.. people shud be forced to travel by buses on these roads..

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]Install cameras at signals.

according to me ..a very bad idea...if people can throw stones at newly installed street lamps to see who's aim is better , they can do the same with the cameras. better still flick the camera and sell it off in chor bazaar.

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]Make tests for licenses more strict

another gem of an idea , but who will implement it ? the rto guys ? naah..
the more i think on these lines , the more loop holes i see..

regarding the pandus , strict and upright officers of the traffic dept shud conduct surprise raids on major traffic junctions, if a pandu is hiding suspend him or fine him ( fining isnt a good idea coz after the raids the motorists will have to make up the losses )

come on guys...anymore ideas ?

[Shan2nu]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]4. > Install cameras at signals.

I like this idea, let the people break the rules, then at the end of the day, send each one of them a notice, asking them to produce their DLs in court and pay a fine. Get caught 3 times, and get your DL suspended for a month/few months.

Shan2nu

[manticore]

Me guessing that this is not something to which a solution can be found right-away. Like they say, it's ingrained in our system and our minds. Here, might is right, and ethics be damned. I'd written an article at NDTV.com on driving in our cities. Plz do check it out. It's exactly the same what I wanted to put here.

Driving in India - Ethics, or the lack of it

[satish_appasani]

For India to develop what we need is DISCIPLINE.

I always felt that discipline should start first in roads.

I will be first to jump in when asked to volunteer in improving traffic.

[GreenHex]

manticore! (and other Team-BHPians),

While I sympathise with the feelings expressed in your article. I do
Have some reservations on what you have said. My view is that they
are simplistic and do not reflect what we are as a country.

What you see on the roads is an extension of our (collective) concept
of "democracy" - This means that every person has a right to the road
irrespective of weather (s)he rides on bathroom slippers or a Pagani
Zonda.

Further, (s)he has the right to express h{im|er}self in any way. One
can (and should) expect the chaos on our roads given our past history.
(ok, that's a topic on it's own, so let's leave it at that)

Take our Policemen. For the most part, they will never own a car, let
alone understand what it is to own one or be an enthusiast. Most of
them are from the lower strata of the society. I would never blame
them for the chaos on the roads. Not even the bribes...

In the USofA, cars are cheap ($500!, less than some cellphones) , fuel
is cheap (at less than bottled water even at $2.00 a gallon), everybody
owns a car. Their economy is based on this fact and they are willing to
kill lots of people to preserve their way of life. (that's another thread!).

I've ridden public transport in the USA (and no other country, so don't
get at me). What struck me is the fact that nobody (N-O-B-O-D-Y) was
ever in a "hurry" (like we are over here). Everybody is casual and cool.
When the bus starts, we know (for a fact) that it's 5:51am (not 5:30 or
5:53!). What is this? As an article in Pune Times questioned; "Why are
we in such a hurry to get somewhere?"

Some of our traffic problems may be attributed to the over-crowding in
our cities. There are simply too many people than our infrastructure
can hold. We have what I call the "cockroach" mentality. We like to
clulster around already overpopulated areas.

In Pune, where I live, a multiplex came up in one of the main roads
in town over a year back. There is no provision for parking space
nor space for vehicles to ease-in or out of the multiplex. Today,
the crowding/ chaos at the entrance is unimaginable! Did the planners
not anticipate the problems? No, I don't think so. It was obvious
even to a lay person like me. They simply don't care.

If only our laws demanded that sufficient parking space and runoff
be provide based on the envisioned business/ traffic, that multiplex
would not have come up at that location. It's so stupid, they expect
anywhere upto 500 people per hour to be sustainable as a business, but
they provide parking space for something like 50 cars and exiting
directly into the main road.

Take the example of our railway infrastructure, fortunately, most of
it was planned by the British. See the amount of space provided between
a Railway station itself and the main road that feeds it. In-fact you
can stand on the road and enjoy the magnificant facade of the station!
The British built some very pretty buildings. I cannot think of a SINGLE
beautiful building built after independence in our great country.

Even today, railway stations like Chennai and Calcutta are far from
crowded (though you see people everywhere). These are major stations
that handle unimaginable traffic. Contrast this to Kurla station in
Mumbai; it's nothing but a filthy shed.

Take any railway station on the Mumbai local track. See the space between
the station itself and the main road feeding it. You realise that over
the years, the land has been sold off to private businesses! Now you
have shops and whatnot in the space allocated for parking and runoff!

On the other hand, the stations built after independence (there is
one near my house) have parking space for 5 cars... I can only summarise
this as shortsightedness an immaturity.

Of-course, there is much more to our traffic woes than what I've written.

What is the solution? Nothing I can think of!

- mvk

[satish_appasani]

GreenHex

I accept all your points. The problem is after Independance, everybody wanted India to jump in to 21st century ASAP. So there was no proper planning.

But I can't accept that we cannot do anything. Once see Hyderabad. Everything has changed in the last one decade. Though the traffic is still nothing but worse, but think how it would have been if those flyovers and some wide roads haven't come up.

I belive now we have acceptable infrastructure. The only thing we lack is discipline. Two lanes would be enough if no body tries to jump the lanes. Current cops count would be good if everybody stops at signals.

[_Crazi4Speed_]

This is the most difficult points that India would unfortunetly battle with for many generations to come, its not that simple and it wouldnt take less time, but I am all for creating really stricit rules and tring them out in medium sized cities first and see how successful it is, how much cost it entails and what all can be done, what is the reaction of people and so on.

The best Idea so far is Put cameras on street light and other places, just not street lights, then increase traffic cop salary, I would say, India govt should out source the traffic job to Multinational security companies. I will tel you how. These guys have no authority and only are there to take note of things happening all around including keeping checks on cops and drivers all at the same time, these cameras should be fed to the security firm's office, so no govt employee can tamper with it. This will creat a sort of big brother feel on drivers as well as cops, have a section in the newspaper about traffic voilations and ppl who get cought and the fines they had to pay so that people get aware and think 10 times before making the error.

Since the govt cant afford(BULLSHIT) to pay more to the cops and hire a larger army of cops, they should improvise, like I said give it to the multinational security agency along with realestate along side the road for advertisements and some land so that they can create offices and stuff to lease out etc, this is how the security company will make money.

Give cops incentives to write tickets but with proof ofcourse which can be backed up with either camera or something else. If they dont keep up with their quota of tickets in a month then they could be considered for layoffs if they slacked for 6 months, force on cops will force them to do some work.

Like no talking on cellphone is a rule, there should be a rule for "keeping to your own lane, else pay 1000 rs"

I am just throwing some ideas here, nothing thought through..but I am sure these are totaly possible..

give incentives to the drivers to stop other reckless drivers and complain and may be recieve an award or some other sort of incentive..

mandatory cops on a major signal light at all times from 8am-10pm

ofcourse give up the road dev dept out to private firms who can maintain the roads, again making money with realestate surrounding the road, or toll tax on even regular road, using automatic cash deductors..

I mean there are soo many things that can be done, we just need one of us in the road ministry dept to do all of this...

If I think of more I will blabber here..I say all this is possible, but a lot needs to be done..

hell if things go extreem, I am thinking of an extreem idea(ofcourse not possible, but still)

have data records mandatory which are connected to the car's diagnostic system costing no more than 750-1000rs which just collects data and its mandatory for you to submit it to the RTO/security company every week to be analysed and may be used as a proof in cases where cops put fake tickets or individuals claim they never made the mistake..(but this can be the bomb)

Anyhow..we are long ways from anything..media should take it into their hands now..to educate the country..

[amit]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ] the roads are bad infact pathetic with all potholes

The solution to this according to me is to file a PIL against the govt. demanding damages for mental harassment of car drivers and excessive wear and tear of vehicles due to pot hole ridden roads. So in bombay we can take the PWD, MMRDA, BMC and any other road maintaining authority to court and demand monetry damages alongwith smooth wide roads.
All team-bhpians in Bombay can file the case. Let's make a list of the cars we own arrive at the value of our cars, multiply that value by 50 and demand that money. We can talk to WIAA, Autocar India. BSM, Overdrive etc.
Maybe we can discuss about this in the next team-bhp meet and take this up seriously? If so, count me in!

[GreenHex]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (_Crazi4Speed_ @ Oct. 05 2004,23:13)]give incentives to the drivers to stop other reckless drivers and complain and may be recieve an award or some other sort of incentive..

Just a quick aside,

Somebody I know had a point of view that 50% of all
fines should be given to the policeman booking the offense,
immediately, and treated as his/her income!

(There are lots of problems associated with this, as what
happens to all the policemen who are unable to "book"
people? That's just one!)

- mvk

[_Crazi4Speed_]

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (GreenHex @ Oct. 07 2004,09:57)]

Just a quick aside,

Somebody I know had a point of view that 50% of all
fines should be given to the policeman booking the offense,
immediately, and treated as his/her income!

(There are lots of problems associated with this, as what
happens to all the policemen who are unable to "book"
people? That's just one!)

- mvk

Do you think its possible that there will policemen who wouldnt be able to book ppl..

on one hand you are saying that there are tons of drivers doing illegal stuff and then you go to say that policeman will have a hard time finding ppl, I am telling you its not possible, ofcourse some will make more than the others, but isnt that just how it is, that will put that competitive edge in our mama's to catch the ppl so that they make more..ofcourse 50% is way too much..but more like 10% or a chance at a salary hike..this is how the corporate world works..on incentives..y should the govt be diff..

[FlyingSpur]

Originally Posted by amit

This topic was posted at 14.56 and it's 22.18 now and just 2 replies! Now we know why the situation on our roads is so bad. None Cares!

It's not like we dont care. We were just stuck in traffic.

[jp1]

The system is fully corrupted, the only way we can improve the situation is automating as much as possible. We have all necessary rules, but no implementation. Some suggestions
a) Install cameras at few important/busy junctions to start with, slowly extend to all important junctions
b) The offenders records to be transferred to central computer center run by RTO for each city
c) Send the notice by post to the registered address of the vehicle owner and ask them to pay the fine at a designated computer center. The fine need to be hefty.
e) After the third or fourth offence issue notice to the owner for cancellation of license. This can be generated automatically from the computer center since it has all the details of violations and payments of fines
d) Publish the offenders Registration numbers who do not pay the fine at the RTO web sites
e) Publish the repeated offenders who are given notice for cancellation at the web site.
f) Repeated offenders to be taken to the court for cancellation of license
g) Offenders who do not pay fines should not be entertained at all at the RTO levels or to sell their vehicle (prospective buyes can check the web sites with the regn no.)

Once the traffic junctions are taken care by the above approach, train few cops to record offences with digital cameras of mobile phone usage while driving, lane cutting etc and transfer these to the computer center and the computer center starts following up. Pay these cops a percentage of the fines collected as incentives. These cops can be at important junctions where the pictures can be shot with landmarks and date and time so that any disputes can be resolved with proof.

jp

[androdev]

i am sorry to say this but t-bhp might be having a good percentage of its members as regular offenders of the traffic. i can't imagine a modded car sticking to its lane in traffic :-)

i realized as long as i stick to my lane (even if it means trailing a slow truck till i get a convenient opportunity to overtake) 70% of my stress is eliminated.

my advice to t-bhpians, stick to your lane and keep music that you enjoy (not radio). let the rest of the drivers zig-zag their way home. what many people don't realize is you CAN NOT beat the average speed of the traffic how ever clever you are.

some really crazy nut will always test your patience once in awhile, but there is little we can do unless a loaded gun is handy.

[nkapoor777]

Originally Posted by flyingspur

It's not like we dont care. We were just stuck in traffic.

Dude, you just dug up a 3+ years old thread. Are you sure it took you that long to get home due to traffic?