[ttm_220d]

Prelude:

Those of you who read my posts are quite acquainted with my Kia Seltos GTX Diesel AT, the highs and the lows, the good and the bad. Something significant happened last week, where I had to claim the warranty of two main components (I will cover this in detail in the following days) but one of these components was the Day time Running Light (‘DRL’). This write up is not about to bash Kia, far from it, in fact they have been very prompt in addressing my issue. Instead, this write up is exploring the world of ‘yellowing DRLS’; the silent defect plaguing Indian cars, particularly Indian ‘German’ cars.


(the above two pictures are of my Seltos when it was new vs. when it was taken to the Dealership to inspect the DRL issue in January)

What is the defect?

DRL’s are often polar/ tube light white. The hue from a DRL is unmistakable as it is often a very sharp and bright white. The actual hue of the DRL may vary based on the cost of the car, but they all tend to stay towards the cooler white end of the colour spectrum. What is not expected is the uneven “yellowing” of the DRL, especially on a DRL that is not more than a few months/years old.



(A few pictures I received from owners who are facing this issue,...continued below)

Are people even aware of this?

I myself at first only noticed the car when I was parking my Seltos late at night and I could see a subtle reflection on the black garage gate. The change in hue was so imperceivable at first, I didn’t think much of it. Mind you this was around month 6 of the car ownership.

Around month 8, the change in hue was definitely more accentuated. As in the Seltos it is a continuous front light bar that extends from the headlights to the grill, there was a clear shift in the polar white hue of the DRL to a yellowish tinge. I cross checked it with pictures of the car from when I first bought it and there was a clear change in the hue. What was surprising was that it was on both the DRLs and both evenly affected. I read a few TeamBHP Forums on this. Luckily, the good people at Advaith Kia have placed an order to replace both and they replaced it within a week.



A lot of complaints:

I posted my yellow DRL findings on my Instagram, and I was surprised by the number of responses and comments I received from a vast group of Indian car buyers. Many helpfully, shared pictures and there was a clear trend. Many of the German/Korean cars had this issue. Surprisingly, many of the never VAG products made for India as well as the international models such as the Tiguan etc faced this issue. From the comments received on what I shared: Breeza/Hyundai/Kia/VAG/Tata & Mahindra seemed to be the most common. I even got a picture from a new MG Astor electric which had the same issue.

The causes for this issue:

As I am a Lawyer by profession, mechanics are not my strong suit, hence I don’t think it will be accurate of me to pass comments on a subject matter I have no experience with, but what I noticed in my Seltos was that there was a lot of running on the highways last few months during the hot days, maybe this further exacerbated the issue? With regards to the VAG products, the internet seems to suggest that many of these DRL comprise of a single strip of LEDs that gradually burn over time. Maybe the engineers didn’t account for our Indian heat or underestimated how long these DRLs would be switched on, but I am not focused on the mechanics, I am focusing on how we as consumers in India just struggle with sub par cars and this is another miniscule issue that makes on think with their wallet and not their heart when purchasing a car. I received many reactions on Instagram also stating that many of these DRLs come from the same supplier and it is a supplier issue that is plaguing all these vehicles.

Why this matters?

One of the responses I received from a very helpful Skoda Octavia owner said that his dealer was charging INR 80,000/- (after all the “discounts”) to replace just one headlight which went yellow, the other was on the way to face this issue. This is a lot of money for the average consumer and there is no excuse for these issues on brand new cars. What will car owners do when this issue plagues them a day after the car warranty expires? Cars nowdays feel like they are built to last the very day the warranty goes out? The irony is many of these car companies shifted from trusty and reliable halogen bulbs to DRLs on the promise of brightness, safety, energy saving and lower maintenance, but the irony of the DRLs slowly turning yellow is what I feel is a full circle moment of the never ending plight of the Indian car buyer.

What car companies and you should do?

All those who face this issue, should immediately claim it under warranty, if it exists and hopefully, you all have a pleasant experience like I had with Kia. Car buyers also should be more mindful in noticing these issues and pointing them out before it is too late. Off late, I feel some car buyers are willingly putting up with the few issues and niggles with their new cars as they don’t want to deal with the inconvenience of dealing with fighting with the dealerships/proving their point. To these people I say, it’s better to take action when your car is still new and there is a strong onus on the company/dealership to rectify issues before it snowballs into a bigger issue or it’s too late or you will be hit with the usual defence of “it’s the way you are driving”.

Car companies should also understand, that yes, maybe the average Indian consumer might not have the same purchasing strength as their foreign counterparts, doesn’t mean they should be taken for a ride in reliability and false promises of ‘foreign engineering’. The best advertisement for your cars is solid, reliable and trust worth engineering. We Indians think we want fancy gizmos and the latest technology, but there’s a reason why Maruti Suzuki righn supreme in this country, it’s because of reliable engineering. My belief is that car companies (knowing full well of the average Indian’s economic constraints) should focus on providing us with technology and features once they have truly been tested, developed and in the market for many years. The average Indian buying a German sedan such as a Virtus or a Salvia for the first time has probably not been to Germany, has probably not driven a well appointed and luxurious German car and has probably not had much experience with cars more expensive. He is buying your car on the promise of him living the dream of the stellar engineering and mechanics of your brand. 5 years into ownership, if he is slapped with a bill of INR 80,000/- for just one headlight, would he/she really feel like coming back to your brand? It’s also important for foreign car makers to get their basics right as in a pretty conservative market like India, where our elders always advise us to stick to their tried and tested and boring brands, every instance of defect even of the smallest nature just gives them an “I told you so card”.


(Picture sent by the Kia service manager once he got the approval to change the DRL)

Concluding Notes:

I hope my experience in this write up helped some of you go out and check your DRLs to see if they are yellowing. If so, you know what to do. This experience of mine was due to me taking my Seltos for a very annoying DPF issue (which I have documented before and will have a comprehensive post out soon). If this exists for you, I hope your dealership is as cooperative as mine. And to the car company executive reading this blog, if there is a one in a million chance you are reading this blog, please do your part in helping us Indians live our car dreams without issues such as this be a daunting warning, preventing us from falling in love with your cars.

I am grateful Kia replaced the entire headlight set up in my Seltos without any hassle. I hope that if you are facing this issue, your company will be just as cooperative.

[Mortis]

It's definitely due to the heat. White LEDs are actually blue or violet LEDs with a phosphor on top which gives off white light when excited by the wavelength given off by the blue LED underneath, similar to how white flourescent tubes are actually UV tubes with a white phosphor.

Now while LEDs are more efficient than incandescent bulbs in the sense that per watt, they produce a higher amount of light compared to heat generated, they still get pretty hot, especially when a higher power or higher density of LEDs is concentrated in one spot. This is true even of the strip type LED lights which are considered "low power" and the fact that they are in an enclosed space without a heatsink.

LEDs have optimum performance and life only if they are cooled properly. Unfortunately most of the time they are not. This is why even basic "low power" LED household bulbs do not last anywhere close to the 20-50000 hours that LEDs are capable of, leaving aside poor quality ancillary electronic components and planned obsolescence.

If you look at the rated lifespan of LED retrofit bulbs, the numbers for Philips are in the basic halogen territory at 1000-1500 hrs and for Osram it is around 2500 hours which is still only half of the 4-5000 hours that HIDs are rated for and again nowhere close to the lower end 20000 hours that LEDs are capable of. The reason for it is that is simple because in automotive scenarios they just cannot be cooled adequately without adding unacceptable bulk in the form of large heatsinks or complexity in the form of moving parts i.e. multiple cooling fans with smaller heatsinks. Then there is the need to make all of this waterproof.

In the case of DRLs turning yellow, it's because of the heat and maybe some amount of corrosion of the components causing a change in the voltage and current they are receiving. White LEDs do change their hue slightly when there is a change in the electricity they are receiving.

The DRL strips in these headlights are most likely attached to a plastic inner frame, so they aren't even benefitting from some passive cooling which they would get if attached to the metal casing and minor heatsinks present on these sealed LED headlights.

Now as to the effect of the tropical climate on the LEDs, I don't think that it's too much of an issue. On the external side I don't think outside temps and incident light would play a major role. There is usually some air gap to act as insulation and even if the external temperature is 40 degrees, it's within acceptable parameters.

As for temperatures on the back - I'm not a hundred percent sure but for the same car operating in tropical vs temperate climates, I don't think there will be a major difference in engine bay temps beyond a few single digit degrees unless the light was anyways heating up to the upper limits of it's ideal threshold and those 4-5 degrees extra was enough to push it over the line which leads me to my conclusion -

Poor design and cost cutting is the reason they are getting discolored due to poor heat management !

[@ppy.tbhp]

Originally Posted by ttm_220d

Prelude
Those of you who read my posts are quite acquainted with my Kia Seltos GTX Diesel AT, the highs and the lows, the good and the bad. Something significant happened last week, where I had to claim the warranty of two main components (I will cover this in detail in the following days) but one of these components was the Day time Running Light (‘DRL’). This write up is not about to bash Kia, far from it, in fact they have been very prompt in addressing my issue. Instead, this write up is exploring the world of ‘yellowing DRLS’; the silent defect plaguing Indian cars, particularly Indian ‘German’ cars.

Originally Posted by Mortis

It's definitely due to the heat. White LEDs are actually blue or violet LEDs with a phosphor on top which gives off white light when excited by the wavelength given off by the blue LED underneath, similar to how white flourescent tubes are actually UV tubes with a white phosphor.

Hello ttm_220d, Mortis , the real problem with front LED light failures isn’t even the car brands—it’s the vendor! You know how so many people complain about their LED headlights, DRLs yellowing, flickering, conking out too soon, or just not performing as they should? The thing is, this isn’t an issue with just one brand—it’s happening across Maruti, Hyundai, Tata, Mahindra, even some premium brands. And the reason? LUMAX India.

LUMAX is basically the go-to vendor for LED headlights, DRLs and fog lights in India. Almost every automaker sources their headlights from them. Now, here’s where it gets messy—these guys have pretty much done away with proper quality checks. No proper quality control, no serious assurance testing, just mass-producing and shipping lights that don’t last.

What’s Going Wrong?

• Inconsistent quality – Some LEDs work fine, others fail way too soon. Total luck of the draw.
  
• Overheating issues – Poor thermal management means the LEDs degrade quickly.
  
• Sealing & waterproofing problems – A little moisture and boom Yellowing, flickering or dead lights DRLs and fog lights.
  
• Faulty driver circuits – The electronic control inside just gives up earlier than it should.

Now, since almost every car brand is sourcing from LUMAX, it doesn’t matter what car you buy—you’re stuck with the same unreliable headlights! And when something fails, people blame the manufacturer, when in reality, the automakers are just using whatever components they’re supplied with.

Why This Sucks for Us as car owners?
Because the automakers are always looking to cut costs and speed up production, they don’t put enough pressure on vendors to maintain quality. So LUMAX is getting away with making subpar headlights, and we, the customers, are the ones dealing with flickering or yellowing lights and expensive replacements.

I’ve added a link showing how LUMAX markets itself in the industry. They make it sound like they’re leading the game, but in reality, they’re just shipping out whatever they can get away with.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XS8J8S9meXM

They’ve literally listed all the big car brands as their customers. This just proves that almost every automaker is sourcing their headlights from LUMAX. So, when people think it’s a brand issue—nah, it’s actually the vendor. No matter which car you buy, you’re getting the same unreliable LEDs. That’s why this whole yellowing, flickering, failing headlight problem isn’t about just one company—it’s a LUMAX problem in INDIA.

They’ve literally listed all the big car brands as their customers. This just proves that almost every automaker is sourcing their headlights, DRLs, Fog lights from LUMAX. So, when people think it’s a brand issue—nah, it’s actually the vendor. No matter which car you buy, you’re getting the same unreliable LEDs.

That’s why this whole yellowing, flickering, failing DRLs and headlight problem isn’t about just one company—it’s a LUMAX problem

[IshaanIan]

Originally Posted by @ppy.tbhp

That’s why this whole yellowing, flickering, failing DRLs and headlight problem isn’t about just one company—it’s a LUMAX problem

If that were the case then why are so many Mercs also victim to the same issue? They don’t seem to be listed as being supplied by Lumax. Also why do the DRLs and other lights fail more often on a Tata than vehicles from other brands? I am sure I am not the only one who has noticed a worryingly large number of less than 3 year old Tata cars with one light not working or one drl not functioning. If Lumax supplies most manufacturers in India and they specifically, are to blame, then I would have to see the same failure rate across all manufacturers but that doesn’t seem to be the case. One thing remains true; almost all DRLs eventually turn yellow and it probably has a lot to do with not being able to incorporate proper cooling with the tech.

OT I always thought a German car with yellow DRLs looked better than one with white ones. I felt like it lent some character to their otherwise very sombre designs. Much like how fine wine tastes better when aged

[omranga98]

Here is my almost 3 year old Taigun with the DRLs gone yellow.
This unit was manufactured by Lumax.

My car is still under warranty so i will get this replaced in the next annual service.

[DicKy]

Originally Posted by ttm_220d

.... Instead, this write up is exploring the world of ‘yellowing DRLS’; the silent defect plaguing Indian cars, particularly Indian ‘German’ cars....Surprisingly, many of the never VAG products made for India as well as the international models such as the Tiguan etc faced this issue.

Not just Indian German cars or the newer ones. The Audis of late 2000s that started this LED DRL trend had yellowing DRLs. In fact, can't remember seeing any 10+ year old A4 or Q3 that doesn't have yellowed DRLs.

[Comrade]

Just this week, I was thinking why there are so Volkswagen Group cars with yellowed DRLs. Seems like its more prevalant in VAG cars, especially made in India. I also observe some very old MBs and BMWs but these two brands seem to last much longer (10+ years) than Volkswagen Group. I see many newer Taiguns with one of the two DRLs yellowed. Seems like QC is poor between VW & the vendor.

Not observed the issue being so common with Korean and Japanese manufacturers compared to German (especially VAG).

[@ppy.tbhp]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

If that were the case then why are so many Mercs also victim to the same issue? They don’t seem to be listed as being supplied by Lumax. Also why do the DRLs and other lights fail more often on a Tata than vehicles from other brands? I am sure I am not the only one who has noticed a worryingly large number of less than 3 year old Tata cars with one light not working or one drl not functioning. If Lumax supplies most manufacturers in India and they specifically, are to blame, then I would have to see the same failure rate across all manufacturers but that doesn’t seem to be the case. One thing remains true; almost all DRLs eventually turn yellow and it probably has a lot to do with not being able to incorporate proper cooling with the tech.

Hello IshaanIan, Every car has a different design, manufacturing process, and placement for these light assemblies, so at the end of the day, it’s the manufacturer’s and vendors job to test them properly and make sure they hold up in all weather conditions consistently and reliably. But honestly, I feel like that part is just being skipped. (cost-cutting)

And let’s be real—automakers are cutting corners big time. They’re making headlight assemblies smaller, removing fog lamps completely, and stuffing too many LEDs into tiny units that now have to do the job of both headlights and fog lights. The result? Way too much heat building up inside, and that’s probably what’s killing these lights so quickly. It’s like they’re more focused on saving costs than making sure things actually last.
And the worst part? These lights aren’t even lasting through the warranty period! I’ve seen them fail in just a few months or barely 10-15k km of driving in normal conditions. That’s insane! It’s not just an inconvenience—this is a proper safety hazard. Imagine driving at night or in bad weather and suddenly realizing one of your lights is out. What’s even more frustrating is that they’re now designing these light units as completely sealed units. So if something fails, you can’t just replace a small part—you have to change the entire assembly, which costs a bomb. It’s such a stupid design choice! Older cars were so much better. They had separate, replaceable parts, so if a bulb went out, you could just swap it in minutes instead of spending a fortune on a whole new unit. I remember my older cars even came with spare bulbs in the toolkit in case something went wrong while driving. That practice is gone now, all in the name of cost-cutting. It’s honestly so frustrating. They’re making things unnecessarily complicated and expensive instead of focusing on reliability and easy repairs.

KIA replaced all front light assemblies in my Seltos under warranty, the issues reoccurred in newly manufactured and replaced lighting assemblies in just two days of normal city driving. This confirms that my vehicle has design and manufacturing defects from the factory. KIA ASC has no solution now and I am compelled to drive my Car with design and manufacturing defects from the factory. This issue will effect all other owners at some point in time of ownership. I managed to source a broken headlight assembly of Kia Seltos with the help of my local FNG to get a better understanding of the manufacturing defects in my Kia Seltos. Turns out, the moisture absorbent pad placement is just a temporary, low-cost fix that Kia is using to buy some time. Honestly, it feels like something straight out of Dieselgate, where the automaker just tries to get past regulations and legal requirements without actually solving the core issue. I'll be posting a detailed breakdown on this in another thread soon.

I’ve included an image of the 2023 Kia Seltos headlamp assembly opened up to give a clear view of the defect. The goal is to understand the issue better and get rid of it once and for all. Hopefully, this helps in figuring out a permanent solution.



The problem actually gets worse in rainy weather and night driving conditions. When there's more moisture in the air, it just makes everything worse because the light assemblies can’t breathe properly. They end up trapping all that humidity and high heat inside, which is exactly when you need your headlights to perform the best. Instead, it leads to those yellowing LEDs and reduced light output, especially when driving at night or through wet weather. It's a design flaw that only makes sense in the short term but causes a lot of problems in the long run.

[anb]

My MG ZS EV’s drl has a slight yellow colour now. The drl’s of 10 year old BMW F30 is still white. I haven’t noticed any yellow on the Seltos drl as well.

[BhayanaV]

This issue has been discussed extensively in other threads as well. But why only DRL's are going yellow, not any other LED lights. And why only in few cars and not 100%. Replacing DRL's/headlights will not be a solution unless we are sure new one are fool proof and will not turn yellow.

[SR5471]

Most cars are not designed to endure the extreme and very random climate of India. Here in Kerala you can expect a heavy shower even on a very hot day. This will cause rapid aging to plastic,rubber and paint.

Then there is the case of poor quality control and manufacturing. These issues are slightly manageable if uv resistant sealers are used.

If cars are under warranty, it is best to claim and replace the faulty part. The chances of yellowing,degradation and peeling is still present in future.

[GeeTee TSI]

Excellent thread!

The yellowed DRL always looked (horrible) like a decayed tooth. While it does not affect night time illumination of the road, it is a sorry sight for owners and onlookers alike.

From my limited exposure to videos on older cars, I have not come across this as a known problem associated with the model across markets. Headlights cost a bomb nowadays and so do DRLs, especially if one cannot stand the sight of it.

A related gripe, the moisture/droplets inside headlamp housing (taillights too) monsoon season irrespective of the segment of the car.

[vignesh207]

Wow, this thread is surprising for me. I had yellowing issue on my Verna's DRL and has them replaced under warranty recently. But didn't know so many cars were affected by this issue.

If the issue is due to the heat or bad QC from manufacturer, i guess it'll get yellow again over time and I've to again get them replaced.

One thing I note in my Verna is, the DRL is on full brightness when headlamps are off. When headlamps are turned on, the DRL brightness reduces. May be making the DRL brightness less always will help save it?

[SideView]

Is this a manufactured issue?

Are DRLs really needed? (Other than low light/visibility situations) Any other advantage other than aesthetics? (Night time anyhow lights are there)

+

Fog lights for low visibility.

[.HEM]

I just saw this in my IRVM, came to my office and opened team-bhp and there is a thread on this. I saw a VW with left side yellowish DRL and right was bright white. I do not now if this is a quality issue, but thought it may be because of the heat created by the usage of headlights.