Sumo Grande - will it Kill Scorpio ?

pgsagar · 23rd February 2008, 20:24

What is this new Winger thing? I saw only one car on the road and that too just a week back. Where did this one spring up from and when? Tata Motors generally advertise a new car launch , however bland or commercial it may be. Even Tata 407, 207 and even Ace pick up were advertised. No such thing with Winger. No Tv or print media coverage, nothing. Even auto mags were silent about Winger. Why? The vehicle looked good though. Can anyone provide some pics , driving impressions, riding impressions? No, I am not interested in buying one but would still like to know more about a new car ( if I can call it a car ) anyway. In the absence of any dedicated thread on Winger, I am having to borrow some space on this Sumo grande thread.

condor · 23rd February 2008, 22:15

@pgsagar, looks like you missed these two threads:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...est-drive.html
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ta-winger.html

pgsagar · 24th February 2008, 12:16

Thanx Condor! I really did somehow miss out on Winger. Thanx for leading me to those threads.

Palio_2005 · 25th February 2008, 12:02

No way can Sumo Grande beat the Scorpio in the looks department. I had the opportunity to view one closely last week and I found it to be too rounded and bulky. Won't appeal to everyone. Also with that overhang, I don't think you can think of any offroading.

This is more of a MUV rather than a SUV. Essentially a people mover for the larger families who don't like the looks of the Innova or the Tavera.

jaysmokesleaves · 25th February 2008, 12:19

Sumo grande is NOT for off roading.

zenx · 25th February 2008, 12:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Palio_2005

This is more of a MUV rather than a SUV. Essentially a people mover for the larger families who don't like the looks of the Innova or the Tavera.

Exactly. A lot of people wanted to be able to ferry larger families in decent comfort, and couldn't afford the Innovas, and didnt really need any offroad capabilities etc. The Grande fills that need brilliantly. Of course, from the pics - is probably not a looker itself though less offensive than the Innova.

I do think is addresses a large, untapped market.

kpbhatt · 25th February 2008, 12:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by zenx

Exactly. A lot of people wanted to be able to ferry larger families in decent comfort, and couldn't afford the Innovas, and didnt really need any offroad capabilities etc. The Grande fills that need brilliantly. Of course, from the pics - is probably not a looker itself though less offensive than the Innova.

I do think is addresses a large, untapped market.

To put it in a different perspective -- I had got so used to my Grand Voyager Minivan while in US and found that the category does not exist -- till the Innova was launched -- that too was way above my budget for a four wheeler and so i settled for an Indigo -- however if I have to buy something resembling the minivan that I had the Sumo Grande comes pretty close in terms of interiors \utility and styling and probably at a price point lower than the Innova. The tatas should start positioning it as a mom and pop vehicle rather than a SUV

condor · 25th February 2008, 12:37

Quote:

Palio_2005

: No way can Sumo Grande beat the Scorpio in the looks department.

Looks are Subjective. There will be people who will swear by the Grande, and others by the Scorp. How successful a model is, will depend a lot more than what a single parameter can do to a vehicle's sales.

Rotorhead · 25th February 2008, 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Palio_2005

No way can Sumo Grande beat the Scorpio in the looks department. I had the opportunity to view one closely last week and I found it to be too rounded and bulky. Won't appeal to everyone. Also with that overhang, I don't think you can think of any offroading.

This is more of a MUV rather than a SUV. Essentially a people mover for the larger families who don't like the looks of the Innova or the Tavera.

Totally agree. Got a chance to see the Grande in orange color a couple of days back near silk board flyover and didnt find it as appealing as the scorpio. It looks too boxy and probably the color had a lot to do with me not liking it as much.
But well looks are subjective .....so i will stick to the scorpio on the looks...but when it comes to performance , with 120 bhp under the hood I am sure this thing can move and going by the TD report by our fellow BHP ian , I am sure this one is a good VFM and does pack in a punch to take on the scorpio head-on on the sales.

anupmathur · 25th February 2008, 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rotorhead

.....so i will stick to the scorpio on the looks...but when it comes to performance , with 120 bhp under the hood I am sure this thing can move and going by the TD report by our fellow BHP ian , I am sure this one is a good VFM and does pack in a punch to take on the scorpio head-on on the sales.

That extra 5 bhp would require exceptionally well chosen gear ratios to translate into better drivability/performance. Otherwise it might actually feel less than the Scorpio!

ranc · 25th February 2008, 15:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by anupmathur

That extra 5 bhp would require exceptionally well chosen gear ratios to translate into better drivability/performance. Otherwise it might actually feel less than the Scorpio!

Scorpio always had a much better engine than the Safari (more responsive), so I dont think that the 2.2 L/ 120 BHP grande engine will outdo the Scorpio engine, may be it will just match its performance and that too because it is much lighter then the scorpio. The Grande wieghs in at 1940 Kg and the Scorpio is at 2500 kgs that is a big diiference.

gowda79 · 25th February 2008, 15:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by ranc

Scorpio always had a much better engine than the Safari (more responsive), so I dont think that the 2.2 L/ 120 BHP grande engine will outdo the Scorpio engine, may be it will just match its performance and that too because it is much lighter then the scorpio. The Grande wieghs in at 1940 Kg and the Scorpio is at 2500 kgs that is a big diiference.

Buddy just check out the new Safari engine 2.2VTT Dicor and the Scorpio engine sucks in front of it.

The same engine has been used on the Grande with 120hp and i can bet it can still beat the power of Scorpio left and right.

What say Grande FANS ???????

jkdas · 25th February 2008, 16:02

Guess Scorpio should be compared against the Safari.

Only the taxi-wala Scorpio which has another engine (forgot the specs) should be compared with the Grande as these are of the commuter class.

condor · 25th February 2008, 16:13

Quote:

ranc

: ...may be it will just match its performance and that too because it is much lighter then the scorpio. The Grande wieghs in at 1940 Kg and the Scorpio is at 2500 kgs that is a big diiference.

ranc, there is a mix-up here.

The Grande's 1940 kg is the Kerb weight.
The Scorpio's 2500 kg is the GVW.

GVW of the Grande will be about the same as that of the Scorpio's, if not more. So there is, afterall, a level field.

karanraheja · 25th February 2008, 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkdas

Guess Scorpio should be compared against the Safari.

Only the taxi-wala Scorpio which has another engine (forgot the specs) should be compared with the Grande as these are of the commuter class.

You got a point to an extent. But I feel Tata is trying to put Grande against
Scorpio and the facelift Safari might compete with Innova( thats what i feel after looking at Safari 2010 spy pics) . Any comments?

23rd February 2008, 20:24	#166
pgsagar Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Vizag Posts: 2,628 Thanked: 3,565 Times View My Garage	Tata Winger---silent arrival. What is this new Winger thing? I saw only one car on the road and that too just a week back. Where did this one spring up from and when? Tata Motors generally advertise a new car launch , however bland or commercial it may be. Even Tata 407, 207 and even Ace pick up were advertised. No such thing with Winger. No Tv or print media coverage, nothing. Even auto mags were silent about Winger. Why? The vehicle looked good though. Can anyone provide some pics , driving impressions, riding impressions? No, I am not interested in buying one but would still like to know more about a new car ( if I can call it a car ) anyway. In the absence of any dedicated thread on Winger, I am having to borrow some space on this Sumo grande thread.
	() Thanks

23rd February 2008, 22:15	#167
condor Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Speed-brkr City Posts: 15,864 Thanked: 16,014 Times View My Garage	@pgsagar, looks like you missed these two threads: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...est-drive.html http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ta-winger.html
	() Thanks

24th February 2008, 12:16	#168
pgsagar Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Vizag Posts: 2,628 Thanked: 3,565 Times View My Garage	Thanx Condor! I really did somehow miss out on Winger. Thanx for leading me to those threads.
	() Thanks

25th February 2008, 12:02	#169
Palio_2005 BHPian Join Date: May 2006 Location: Pune Posts: 991 Thanked: 878 Times	No way can Sumo Grande beat the Scorpio in the looks department. I had the opportunity to view one closely last week and I found it to be too rounded and bulky. Won't appeal to everyone. Also with that overhang, I don't think you can think of any offroading. This is more of a MUV rather than a SUV. Essentially a people mover for the larger families who don't like the looks of the Innova or the Tavera.
	() Thanks

25th February 2008, 12:19	#170
jaysmokesleaves Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Mostly Mumbai Posts: 1,702 Thanked: 1,452 Times	Sumo grande is NOT for off roading.
	() Thanks

25th February 2008, 16:02	#178
jkdas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Thiruvananthapu Posts: 9,687 Thanked: 1,492 Times View My Garage	Guess Scorpio should be compared against the Safari. Only the taxi-wala Scorpio which has another engine (forgot the specs) should be compared with the Grande as these are of the commuter class.
	() Thanks