[LandCruiser]

Did not know that my "value" shot up so much. Thinking of alternatives how much would it cost to import (including all the duties to be paid) a LC from somewhere else in the world where it is relatively cheaper?

Since Toyota has a plant in India they could have taken a CKD approach or something which can produce the car for a lesser price. At least for a company that doesnt have a big manufacturing plant it is fine to go with CBU. Probably this is the point most of the forum members think when they are surprised (or shocked) about the price.

[Sawyer]

Come to think of it, the mystery is why there is such a big difference between the Prado and the LC. I think the Prado is a CBU too. It has a great petrol engine, so an equivalent diesel equipped version cannot be priced a lot more? In the case, can someone shed light on the capability/reliability difference between the LC Prado and the LC 200? Does it justify the huge price difference?

[DKG]

Originally Posted by Sawyer

Come to think of it, the mystery is why there is such a big difference between the Prado and the LC. I think the Prado is a CBU too. It has a great petrol engine, so an equivalent diesel equipped version cannot be priced a lot more? In the case, can someone shed light on the capability/reliability difference between the LC Prado and the LC 200? Does it justify the huge price difference?

Having used both extensively (albeit in their former iterations) I can say confidently that the difference was apparent but to an extent where you could say the bigger LC was NOT dramatically better. The Prado is an outstanding SUV by any standard and in those days when it sold for AED 110000 the LC GXR was at 121000.

Having said that the new LC in diesel guise has been refined to a large extent. Its now far more luxurious than it ever was. But I'd reckon at best a 15-20 lakh difference is justifiable. They may be charging a 10-15 lakh premium thinking they'd cash in on the image. It will drop down to the 70-75 lakh range in a years time I should hope.

Once again my perspective is now dated, so I am open to understanding how the bigger LC gets differentiated so much more.

[balenopower]

Tried and tested..Gr8 vehicle and its not really overpriced considering wht its offering. The only thing missing like Mclaren said above was brand value, but even on that front its not doing too bad. Offroad only a Landcruiser can defend it or match it, but not too many who will buy in India will test it offroad, Presence too it has in oodles while reliabilty is never an issue with Toyota.

[Sawyer]

Just read the review in CAR India - pretty decent feature on the car. What blows my mind is how Toyota maintains the reliability of all the complex systems that are installed in the vehicle. Knowing a little of how they work, they would not add anything that will also not be reliable, so this is a significant engineering achievement, and I guess the price needs to be seen in that context too.
"Most preferred vehicle of the Taliban" - now that I am sure is one endorsement that Toyota will not be publicising!

[Caramelo]

i am just wondering. if they price the toyota lc at this price 81 lacs. then what will be the price of lexus suv. (luxed up landcrusier) i forgot the model. but you know what i mean. any thoughts on that?!!

[GTO]

Originally Posted by Sawyer

What blows my mind is how Toyota maintains the reliability of all the complex systems that are installed in the vehicle.

The Landcruisers appeal is in its long-term reliability & durability. Toyota insists that "A landcruiser never breaks down". The combination of electronics + reliability is a factor that the Germans - including Audi, BMW & Mercedes - can only dream about. When your flashy SUV breaks down in the middle of nowhere, that's when you start valuing reliability a little more . I see a Landcruiser as a companion for life...you buy it once, never to sell it again.

After seeing the 200 series in person, I do think that the 100 is a better looker though (more proportioned?). Whether its the simple Toyota front end or the LX470 conversion jobs.

[extreme_torque]

The LC has started to grow on me due to the sheer virtues it represents.. I just wish the price tag was sensible.

How about German reverse engineering a Toyota? They might learn a lesson or two in packaging electronics so that they are reliable.

[Sawyer]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

How about German reverse engineering a Toyota? They might learn a lesson or two in packaging electronics so that they are reliable.

How do you reverse engineer a culture that is all pervasive in the company, its suppliers and its dealers? That is where Toyota is unbeatable as of now, even though everyone knows what they do. It is one thing to know, quite another to do, and what you see is the result of endless continuous improvement cycles, bit by little bit, for decades. Hard to copy in a hurry, and so, a huge competitive advantage. A phenomenal company, and a rarity in any industry. In the LC performance/reliability, you see all of that displayed as a showcase. I would not rank its brand presence and virtues below any other SUV in the world.

[akj53]

I think Toyota is also copying Honda's strategy of pricing its cars in India, at a high premium. Anybody paying that kind of money will consider a Range Rover. I dont know when Toyota will stop treating India like a small market and start assembling Camry and other high end models in India.

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by Sawyer

How do you reverse engineer a culture that is all pervasive in the company, its suppliers and its dealers? That is where Toyota is unbeatable as of now, even though everyone knows what they do. It is one thing to know, quite another to do, and what you see is the result of endless continuous improvement cycles, bit by little bit, for decades. Hard to copy in a hurry, and so, a huge competitive advantage. A phenomenal company, and a rarity in any industry. In the LC performance/reliability, you see all of that displayed as a showcase. I would not rank its brand presence and virtues below any other SUV in the world.

When you talk about the pervasive culture entrenched in not just the company, I assume you are talking about the resultant quality and the depth of engineering where everyone is committed to the larger good.

Now keeping that in mind, coming to the Germans, their R&D capabilities are regarded as one of the best, if not the best, brands like Mercedes Benz and BMW spend more on R&D than any other brand on the planet and invented most of the tech that we see in todays automobiles and they are as serious about quality as any japanese maker of premium cars, most probably even more so... so what could be the reason?

[Sawyer]

I think that a LC would keep going a long time after the RR has given up the ghost. If I were to choose between the two for the same price, I know what my choice would be.

[Sawyer]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

Now keeping that in mind, coming to the Germans, their R&D capabilities are regarded as one of the best, if not the best, brands like Mercedes Benz and BMW spend more on R&D than any other brand on the planet and invented most of the tech that we see in todays automobiles and they are as serious about quality as any japanese maker of premium cars, most probably even more so... so what could be the reason?

If I were to choose one reason above all, it would be their unmatched ability to mobilize more of the hearts and minds of more of the people in their organizations in continuously improving what they make. While not giving up on gains made in the past. And only adopting technology once they are satisfied about its reliability. That is also why their cars are never cutting edge - because cutting edge and reliability cannot go hand in hand.

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by Sawyer

I think that a LC would keep going a long time after the RR has given up the ghost. If I were to choose between the two for the same price, I know what my choice would be.

And why would you say that.... gut feel?? I think the older Mercs were better than any Jap when it comes to longivity and reliability.

[Sawyer]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

And why would you say that.... gut feel?? I think the older Mercs were better than any Jap when it comes to longivity and reliability.

No, not gut feel. One, I have dealt with Toyota in India and know a little of how they work. And ten years ago in Singapore, I had asked the taxi guys there as to why all of them drove Toyotas and not Mercs. A couple of the articulate ones told me that the longevity of the Toyota where it mattered to them was way ahead of that of the Merc in the taxi environment - typically engines would go 2.5 times as long as the Mercs without rebuilds. And that was ten years ago. Also, Toyota is very customer focused. They will not over engineer the car purely for the engineering satisfaction of it. Finally, they know that they have to meet all of their customers needs - including the one for a price that makes sense.