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Quote:
Originally Posted by vrprabhu
(Post 1310155)
I remember reading an article in Autocar by Hormazd Sorabjee during his visit to one of the Arabian countries where there were plenty of Skodas and the Octy in which he was travelling from Airport to hotel had more than 100,000 kms on the odo and the car was as good as new!
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It was 650,000 or was it 560,000km. I think all manufacturers do end up with some defects. The issue is how they are addressed and attended to. here it is a case of accident repairs being done by the dealership/A.S.S. using fake parts, and the fiasco thereafter. Customer satisfaction / experience are vital except that some people seem to forget the adage, 'The Customer is always Right'.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vrprabhu
(Post 1310155)
I remember reading an article in Autocar by Hormazd Sorabjee during his visit to one of the Arabian countries where there were plenty of Skodas and the Octy in which he was travelling from Airport to hotel had more than 100,000 kms on the odo and the car was as good as new! Don't think a person like Hormazd will make a statement like that unless he was very sure of it.
All these posts here makes me recollect "Wheels" of Arthur Hailey - in Detroit those days, the cars built on Mondays and Fridays were generally to be avoided; and supervisors allow an occassional "lemon" to pass through - the latter must be still happening now a days at Skoda too! May be they are "no longer obsessed with quality"!
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Well there are many possibilities such as
1. Thousands of a vehicles of single make does not change anything , There were thousands of Amby and Padminis till early 90s and some of them were as good as new so does it mean they were extreamly reliable make.
2. what if the car was overhauled just before Me. Sorabjee took the ride
3. By rules of probability even worst manufacturer with highest defects per million parts can make an occasional sturdy vehicle and what if Mr. Sorabjee boarded such a taxi. look at the Padmini and Amby example.
4. It is not necessary what they sell in that particular country and what they sell in India are same.
I can go on an on listing down possibalities but crux of issue is what kind of service people in India are getting and lets not digress. Changing timing belts at 45000 KM for 10,000 Rs when other brands do the same under 1000Rs close to close to 1 lakh KM and changing flywheel and clutch for 50,000 Rs at roughly 50K Km is not a good example of reliability. Fleecing cutomers by selling Bosch fuel pump available at 18,000Rs in open market by selling at 55000 is not being customer friendly.And to top this putting fake parts at exorbitant price and entangling customer in long court cases can not be called service.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sgiitk
(Post 1310210)
It was 650,000 or was it 560,000km. I think all manufacturers do end up with some defects. The issue is how they are addressed and attended to. here it is a case of accident repairs being done by the dealership/A.S.S. using fake parts, and the fiasco thereafter. Customer satisfaction / experience are vital except that some people seem to forget the adage, 'The Customer is always Right'.
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a search on youtube or metacafe for skoda milage would give you videos of Fabia doing a 300,000 km on the odo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sgiitk
(Post 1310210)
It was 650,000 or was it 560,000km. I think all manufacturers do end up with some defects. The issue is how they are addressed and attended to. here it is a case of accident repairs being done by the dealership/A.S.S. using fake parts, and the fiasco thereafter. Customer satisfaction / experience are vital except that some people seem to forget the adage, 'The Customer is always Right'.
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I agree with you. Its the way the A.S.S. staff / dealership solve the problem rather than creating more / bigger issues.
Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26
(Post 1310268)
I can go on an on listing down possibalities but crux of issue is what kind of service people in India are getting and lets not digress. Changing timing belts at 45000 KM for 10,000 Rs when other brands do the same under 1000Rs close to close to 1 lakh KM and changing flywheel and clutch for 50,000 Rs at roughly 50K Km is not a good example of reliability. Fleecing cutomers by selling Bosch fuel pump available at 18,000Rs in open market by selling at 55000 is not being customer friendly.And to top this putting fake parts at exorbitant price and entangling customer in long court cases can not be called service.
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I am afraid spare parts pricing and service intervals and / or life of parts is not the lone issues. What counts is honesty. When the company makes it upfront clear that official parts will not be available for sale in the open market, it is fair enough. When the company makes it clear that part X will last only N miles, while similar parts in other cars last N^N miles customers should not be heard complaining, because you know it before hand.
What is at issue are (1) delaying warranty jobs (2) covering up dishonest practises by dealers (let us admit - dealers for other makes too indulge in the occasional malpractise). (3) Unexpected low life of certain components which are likely to outlast the lifetime of a car from other manufacturers. (4) inability of certain models / variants to cope with Indian conditions (I mean the fabia's sensitivity to Indian fuel quality) (5) inadequate dealer and service network.
All of the above and the attitude of the company. 'You customers make any amount of noise. We care a foot for you' Attitude. That seems worst.
I would like to add another point to the whole discussion. The companies and their dealerships work in a monopolistic way by keeping service documentation and spares under lock and key. In my view this is patently an illegal monopolistic practice. I have every right to maintain my vehicle the way I see fit, and the vendor is duty bound to make information (Workshop Manual) and spares available to me at reasonable price.
This closed shop is highly profitable for the duopoly and probably needs legislation / courts to break open.
@sgiitk - very valid point. In fact, several countries have brought in legislation to deal with such practices in automobile sector. And AFAICT, (from google), there is a suggestion / demand in IPR related circles to do away with design protection for automobile spares - thus enabling fair competition.
Agreed. I will love to see some initiative in this direction in India. Maybe TBHP cantake the lead in campaigning.
Maruti was an exception in that the service documentation was available from the dealerships and spares could be bought over the counter. I heard recently from CrackedHead that the practice of selling spares over the counter has now been discontinued. I am not sure about the current status regarding manuals. I hope that Haynes Manuals are made freely available (they have an operation in india - Chennai?). Most reputable spare dealers are able to get spares but in smaller towns like mine this may take 3-4 days.
Honda refused to sell parts
Haynes manuals are not all that great - half the time, the instruction for assembly is " follow the procedure for dismantling in reverse"
Well it seems that "on popular demand" the red vRS has been replaced by a rotating header picture. Although I don't mind the change, I was in support of the vRS because it drove home the point we are trying to make i.e. Skoda does make some really desirable cars, it's not that the foru is against the brand altogether, it's the after-sales service and attitude towards customers that needs to change.
Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingspur
(Post 1312894)
Well it seems that "on popular demand" the red vRS has been replaced by a rotating header picture. Although I don't mind the change, I was in support of the vRS because it drove home the point we are trying to make i.e. Skoda does make some really desirable cars, it's not that the foru is against the brand altogether, it's the after-sales service and attitude towards customers that needs to change.
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agree: Fully support the red vRS on top, nothing even comes close to that car in terms of performance, fun in that price bracket.
I personally feel we should be against
Skoda's Aftersales, Service, Support & Dealer Attitude issues. Not against there cars!
My dad's got an Octavia not the vRS but the 1.8 TPi & it always manages to get grin on my face irrespective of my mood. My cousin also has an Octavia 1.9TDi December 2003, with 1 lac plus Kms on the clock, around 6-8 outstation trips, it still feels new, absolutely rattle free, everything works perfectly. Our car is about a year & a few months old. The difference between my dad's car & my cousin's car is not much except the diesel clatter, headlamp brightness, a few odd scratches & dents.
We've had our share of problems with 2 out of the 3 dealer's in Delhi & Gurgaon (Whom I visited for Aftersales service & support)
But I noticed a funny thing that many Skoda owners have never even seen the service stations, the cars are bought in by their respective chauffeurs who are hardly bothered with whats happening with the car, evan the payment is made by the chauffeurs using the owners card. So who is to blame The Owner, Chauffeur, Dealer, Skoda ??
On a personal note I feel the discussion should be focussed more on
Skoda's Aftersales, Service, Support & Dealer Attitude issues.
Because the people (within skoda) making the cars are different from the ones indulging in malpractices in the service & sales departments!!
BTW, the new Laura is launched, they can't seem to put their A.S.S in order and keep spoiling good products.
Skoda Laura
Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingspur
(Post 1312894)
Well it seems that "on popular demand" the red vRS has been replaced by a rotating header picture. Although I don't mind the change, I was in support of the vRS because it drove home the point we are trying to make i.e. Skoda does make some really desirable cars, it's not that the foru is against the brand altogether, it's the after-sales service and attitude towards customers that needs to change.
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Flyingspur,
Just to clarify - we always intended to have a shuffling image as the header for the forum (it has been this way from day one on the portal team-bhp.com/web/), however some technical difficulties prevented us from applying the same to the
forum header at that time.
Also, the vRS is still one of the cars show. Please see this thread for more discussion on this :
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/shifti...um-header.html
cya
R
Thanks for the clarification, R !!
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