Tata Jeeps?

greenhorn · 14th June 2009, 11:05

Just a hypothetical question in my mind.

Mahindra's current crop of ugly looking vehicles is partially due to jeep complaining about the 7 slat grille used earlier on mahindras. And i think while mahindra is capable of making a vehicle which is truer to the original keep than Jeep itself, the only thing stopping it from doing it is jeep themselves.

And now the irony, their main competitor, tata can now potentially acess jeep, via fiat, which recently acquired it. Tata owns LR too, and is no stranger to making UV's . Tata can now make an authentic jeep clone in india, and get away with it

. If not as a SUV, at least as a UV to take on the likes of the MM540 and use the jeep goodwill to sell its own vehicles ?

a rather long stretch of the enemy of an enemy is a friend concept, but will it work ?

I dont think they will actually be branded jeeps, to avoid brand dilution, but if it looks good enough, that should be enough!

siedo · 14th June 2009, 11:30

I also feel tata should have a vehicle to compete with bolero . Sumo can not do that because of the people mover taxi image.

shortbread · 14th June 2009, 15:04

One of the biggest drawbacks of the JLR portfolio is the lack of a VFM rugged off roader.The Defender might be among the best in the business but with a starting price in the UK of £21k+ its not really VFM, especially taking into consideration its intended purpose. Also this car has no crash test rating in this day and age.The primary reason for the price is that its still mostly hand built, expensive and slow english labour, uses aluminium panels etc..etc... Also there is still no Land Rover pick up even when the likes of Navaras, L200s are selling like hot cakes.
This is where Tata can step in. It has decent experience with UVs on Ladder/Frame chasis. A rugged, simple (albeit crash test worthy) alternative is required to the defender. It must be made in India to save costs. They aldready have a brilliant engine in the 2.2 Dicor. A possible pick up variant as well. This should be a thorough effort and not half baked products i.e. Grande/Xenon. There is a huge market for this, and for the Unoin Jack loyalists the new Defender can be assemble on the same platform in the UK.

vinaydas · 14th June 2009, 18:36

tata's acess to fiat is only mutual and probably has some limits
i dont think tata can exploit fiat that easily.They cannot reach mahindra's reliability levels anyways

(i think im going to start a tata vs mahindra bash here)

4x4addict · 14th June 2009, 19:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by shortbread

One of the biggest drawbacks of the JLR portfolio is the lack of a VFM rugged off roader.The Defender might be among the best in the business but with a starting price in the UK of £21k+ its not really VFM, especially taking into consideration its intended purpose. Also this car has no crash test rating in this day and age.The primary reason for the price is that its still mostly hand built, expensive and slow english labour, uses aluminium panels etc..etc... Also there is still no Land Rover pick up even when the likes of Navaras, L200s are selling like hot cakes.
This is where Tata can step in. It has decent experience with UVs on Ladder/Frame chasis. A rugged, simple (albeit crash test worthy) alternative is required to the defender. It must be made in India to save costs. They aldready have a brilliant engine in the 2.2 Dicor. A possible pick up variant as well. This should be a thorough effort and not half baked products i.e. Grande/Xenon. There is a huge market for this, and for the Unoin Jack loyalists the new Defender can be assemble on the same platform in the UK.

Totally agree with you on this one. They can produce the Defender for half the price by making it in India, localizing many of the components, putting in the 4WD Safari powertrain.

Red Liner · 14th June 2009, 19:56

And definitely avoid the delphi fuel line!

.anshuman · 14th June 2009, 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Totally agree with you on this one. They can produce the Defender for half the price by making it in India, localizing many of the components, putting in the 4WD Safari powertrain.

A defender with a safari powertrain would require atleast 10year warranty in international markets,imagine a blown engine in midst of some uk army mission.

phamilyman · 14th June 2009, 23:12

Some of these pie-in-sky threads are actually quite hilarious!

Agree fully with anshuman

4x4addict · 15th June 2009, 01:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by .anshuman

A defender with a safari powertrain would require atleast 10year warranty in international markets,imagine a blown engine in midst of some uk army mission.

I was referring to a cheaper option only for the India market. For the global markets, Tata will have to find a replacement for the Ford Sourced powertrain unless they want to make payments to Ford. The current version of the Defender comes with the Ford Transit 2.4 TDCi engine and gearbox.

Quote:

Originally Posted by phamilyman

Some of these pie-in-sky threads are actually quite hilarious!

Agree fully with anshuman

Dude, a forum/blog is where people share ideas. I think you are looking for the Encylopedia Britannica.

There is a free trial if you are interested.

https://safe.britannica.com/registra...rCode=SPRING08

raj_5004 · 15th June 2009, 09:15

a TATA Jeep... nah, that doesnt sound good! tatas are better in making cheap & fuel efficient people mover/public transport.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinaydas

i dont think tata can exploit fiat that easily.They cannot reach mahindra's reliability levels anyways

(i think im going to start a tata vs mahindra bash here)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Liner

And definitely avoid the delphi fuel line!

, i agree to both the above statements.

Quote:

Originally Posted by .anshuman

A defender with a safari powertrain would require atleast 10year warranty in international markets,imagine a blown engine in midst of some uk army mission.

shortbread · 15th June 2009, 10:54

On the bright side, the product testing will be done on the UK Army not the Indian consumer.

Spitfire · 15th June 2009, 10:57

And it will be called Sumojee

nithinnarayanan · 15th June 2009, 13:59

Or may be called TATAJi

Spitfire · 15th June 2009, 14:17

Dont they make the 4x4 Xenon already? And the 4x4 Safari and the 4x4 Sumo and the 4x4 trucks.

Are we looking for a 80 inch wheelbase with Jeep slats, 4x4 from TATA or a LR for Indica prices or a Jaguar 4x4 for the price of the Safari.

I dont get the point of this topic?

Like someone said:

Quote:

Originally Posted by phamilyman

Some of these pie-in-sky threads

shortbread · 15th June 2009, 15:00

I Think there still is a gaping hole in the market for a replacement for the antiquated MM540. Nothing against the product, which still is perhaps the best bare basic true off roader in the country. But that also highlights the fact that there is no true competition out there, especially not one thats upto modern safety, powertrain standards.
There is also a similar void globally, with the likes of Defender/Jeep getting expensive with each upgrade. LRs know how in this segment is second to none, if Tata can combine this with their frugal engineering and pricing advantage, they have a winner in their hands. Also provided that Tata gets the quality of the product right.

14th June 2009, 11:05	#1
greenhorn Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: KL-01 Posts: 7,744 Thanked: 4,387 Times View My Garage	Tata Jeeps? Just a hypothetical question in my mind. Mahindra's current crop of ugly looking vehicles is partially due to jeep complaining about the 7 slat grille used earlier on mahindras. And i think while mahindra is capable of making a vehicle which is truer to the original keep than Jeep itself, the only thing stopping it from doing it is jeep themselves. And now the irony, their main competitor, tata can now potentially acess jeep, via fiat, which recently acquired it. Tata owns LR too, and is no stranger to making UV's . Tata can now make an authentic jeep clone in india, and get away with it . If not as a SUV, at least as a UV to take on the likes of the MM540 and use the jeep goodwill to sell its own vehicles ? a rather long stretch of the enemy of an enemy is a friend concept, but will it work ? I dont think they will actually be branded jeeps, to avoid brand dilution, but if it looks good enough, that should be enough!
	() Thanks

14th June 2009, 11:30	#2
siedo BHPian Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Pune Posts: 129 Thanked: 15 Times	I also feel tata should have a vehicle to compete with bolero . Sumo can not do that because of the people mover taxi image.
	() Thanks

14th June 2009, 15:04	#3
shortbread Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: KL 7 Posts: 2,387 Thanked: 6,267 Times	One of the biggest drawbacks of the JLR portfolio is the lack of a VFM rugged off roader.The Defender might be among the best in the business but with a starting price in the UK of £21k+ its not really VFM, especially taking into consideration its intended purpose. Also this car has no crash test rating in this day and age.The primary reason for the price is that its still mostly hand built, expensive and slow english labour, uses aluminium panels etc..etc... Also there is still no Land Rover pick up even when the likes of Navaras, L200s are selling like hot cakes. This is where Tata can step in. It has decent experience with UVs on Ladder/Frame chasis. A rugged, simple (albeit crash test worthy) alternative is required to the defender. It must be made in India to save costs. They aldready have a brilliant engine in the 2.2 Dicor. A possible pick up variant as well. This should be a thorough effort and not half baked products i.e. Grande/Xenon. There is a huge market for this, and for the Unoin Jack loyalists the new Defender can be assemble on the same platform in the UK.
	() Thanks

14th June 2009, 18:36	#4
vinaydas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Bengaluru Posts: 1,399 Thanked: 148 Times	tata's acess to fiat is only mutual and probably has some limits i dont think tata can exploit fiat that easily.They cannot reach mahindra's reliability levels anyways (i think im going to start a tata vs mahindra bash here) Last edited by vinaydas : 14th June 2009 at 18:38.
	() Thanks

14th June 2009, 19:56	#6
Red Liner Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 5,209 Thanked: 18,042 Times	And definitely avoid the delphi fuel line!
	() Thanks

14th June 2009, 23:12	#8
phamilyman Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Gurgaon Posts: 5,968 Thanked: 4,641 Times	Some of these pie-in-sky threads are actually quite hilarious! Agree fully with anshuman
	() Thanks

15th June 2009, 10:54	#11
shortbread Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: KL 7 Posts: 2,387 Thanked: 6,267 Times	On the bright side, the product testing will be done on the UK Army not the Indian consumer.
	() Thanks

15th June 2009, 10:57	#12
Spitfire BANNED Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Panaji - Goa/Bangalore - Karnataka Posts: 3,312 Thanked: 774 Times	And it will be called Sumojee
	() Thanks

15th June 2009, 13:59	#13
nithinnarayanan BHPian Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Bangalore Kannur Manipal Posts: 237 Thanked: 10 Times View My Garage	Or may be called TATAJi
	() Thanks

15th June 2009, 15:00	#15
shortbread Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: KL 7 Posts: 2,387 Thanked: 6,267 Times	I Think there still is a gaping hole in the market for a replacement for the antiquated MM540. Nothing against the product, which still is perhaps the best bare basic true off roader in the country. But that also highlights the fact that there is no true competition out there, especially not one thats upto modern safety, powertrain standards. There is also a similar void globally, with the likes of Defender/Jeep getting expensive with each upgrade. LRs know how in this segment is second to none, if Tata can combine this with their frugal engineering and pricing advantage, they have a winner in their hands. Also provided that Tata gets the quality of the product right.
	() Thanks