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Old 25th August 2009, 10:00   #1
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Default VW CRDi engines Vs Toyota CRDi engines

(A) I came across this comment in a Thai forum on the Fortuner:

"any european made diesel will beat Toyota in any department - size, power, torque, economy..."

(B) I was wondering why has Toyota used in its official site the word "type" before Common-Rail?

"Fuel Supply System: Common-Rail type"

Any comments from members on (A) & "B"?
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Old 25th August 2009, 11:48   #2
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No comment on (A).

As for (B), there are a few ways of fuelling diesels. Indirect, Direct, Common Rail and VW's Pumpe Duse.
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Old 25th August 2009, 11:53   #3
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For comment A, its just that Europeans have a history building diesels and Japanese don't.
But still, when Honda did their first diesel (and their only one!) it was up with the best. So cant hold good forever.
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Old 25th August 2009, 12:12   #4
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Daihatsu has made some good diesel engines since long, especially for the Marine applications.

Last edited by 1100D : 25th August 2009 at 12:17.
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Old 25th August 2009, 12:32   #5
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VW engines are generally more torquier than the Toyota engines, that doesnt mean that they are considered inferior. Going by the numbers the torque figure is always slightly higher due the fuel design and turbo design in VW engines. VW are using Garrett and Lately they have used IHI turbo in new tsi petrol engines. VW does modify/design the new flanges, compressor wheel of the turbo they use before they launch a new engine. Along with this fuel system, turbo pressure, engine internals, ecu and other parameters help it to develop more sturdy torquier engine.
For example their 1.8 tubo petrol engine doing which was available in their Octavia vRS here did 150hp with BorgWarner KO3 turbo, the same engine was available in europe with 180, 225hp version. The difference was only the turbo design. The same KO3 turbo was used in 180hp version with new design in compressor wheel and the flanges and they called it the KO3S turbo. The 225hp engine used completely new turbo "KO4" which had slightly bigger housing, new redesigned flange and comp. Wheel. Their KO4 turbo was capable enough to develop upto 400+NM of torque and 270hp. That's much more of torque than the HP it could develop. As we see using the same engine and fuelling system, different power range engines were made with different turbo design. Going by the numbers one will will always see more torque & HP results with VW engines. Even their 1.9 tdi pd was available with different power range from 105, 130, 160hp, this was achieved just by using the same turbo with changes to compressor wheel of the turbo and little bigger housing in 160hp version.
Having more torque figure also means more pulling power even at higher gear, which means less frequent gear change, thus slight better fuel economy. Somehow VW engines have always developed more healthy torque than HP figure than the competition.

Toyotas engines are again considered to be very frugal, with good amount of power and torque but I guess VW engines or for any European maker tend to have a slight upper hand where diesel engines are concerned.

Last edited by Invinsible : 25th August 2009 at 12:41.
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Old 25th August 2009, 21:13   #6
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With regards to power and smoothness VW diesels rock, I had the pleasure of having a drive in my friends VW Golf Gti diesel, absolutly phenominal, i thought i was in a petrol car, as idle NVH was atleast 80% less than in my Safari and 50% less than in my Ford Focus TDi, the acceleration was somthing else 0-60 Mph is somewhere around 7.5seconds and the vehicle still returned, even driven hard 50+MPG which is somewhere around 16/17KMPL. The Japanese have taken a long time to adopt diesel, I don't think Honda even have a diesel car as yet, although i might be wrong there.
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Old 25th August 2009, 21:42   #7
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VW engines are right now putting out good specific outputs internationally. Yes, the VW engines are more powerful, but that does not mean they are better. Toyota diesel engines are known to run a lot without any issues. Toyota diesel motors are not the one to put out highest power or torque, but they are very very reliable. Example is Innova.

One more thing, any toyota engine with "D" eg D4-D means its direct injection.

Toyota has taken share in Isuzu that is known to produce good diesels.

Last edited by aaggoswami : 25th August 2009 at 21:58.
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Old 18th September 2009, 13:00   #8
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Chevrolet Cruze has a terrific diesel engine. I wonder how it compare with the VW CRDi which is likely to power the new Jetta, Yeti and Tiguan?
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Old 18th September 2009, 17:22   #9
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To A) Yep the VW group does have a significant lead on diesel technology, but they were not the first on the CRDI platfrom and it's just their awareness of turbos etc that enables them to make better diesel, The toyota Diesels are reliable but noisy(even in common Rail form).

to B) Referring to the common rain type of desels which the latest type from them, they do not use an accronym like Dicor, CRDI etc that is self indicative of the type, so their D4D is itself the Common rail type.
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Old 20th September 2009, 22:24   #10
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Honda does sell a 2.2 diesel in Europe, but VW diesel's are in general better than their Japanese counterparts. I think BMW makes the best diesels. I had a pleasure of driving the 335D (3L, 265hp) and it was awesome!
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