[theEnd]

Originally Posted by crackingride

This begs the question (again), how is it making the thing here does not seem to reflect in a lowered price for a similar spec??

If the plastics and bits are cheaper here, why have they changed the lights on the Polo?

In fact when hot-shot Patankar commented on the Polo drive in Sardinia, he first said the jutting lower lip will go for the India spec version. Well, we seem to have that still, only everything aft of the front bumper has changed!

Unfortunately our auto journalists have a much louder voice than ours.

Top Gear's India editor Vardan Khanvilkar (I'm sure I mangled the spelling) finished his review of the Polo by saying that VW should price it below the Fabia and at par with the Swift. He also called for beige interiors (ack!) and dismissed DSG as too expensive for India and the LED indicators on the mirrors as unnecessary as they're likely to be scraped off in traffic.

As an aside, in that very same issue he reviewed the Jazz. On the first page he mentioned that the Jazz is priced higher than the City in other countries and that the higher price is justified due to various things (interior space, adaptability, A/C controls). He also says that the Jazz should have the 1.5iVtec in it. At the end of the same article he complains about the high price of the Jazz and implores Honda to reduce it! Talk about inconsistency.

If these are the people that the manufactures are listening to, we no longer have to wonder why we get cars that have inferior features compared to the same models sold abroad.

Edit: Just thought of a name for these intrepid auto journalists in India: "the Beige Brigade".

[AyAn!]

Originally Posted by theEnd

As an aside, in that very same issue he reviewed the Jazz. On the first page he mentioned that the Jazz is priced higher than the City in other countries and that the higher price is justified due to various things (interior space, adaptability, A/C controls). He also says that the Jazz should have the 1.5iVtec in it. At the end of the same article he complains about the high price of the Jazz and implores Honda to reduce it! Talk about inconsistency.
.

Yes but 'other countries' and India are vastly different markets in terms of maturity.Here VFM rules.Nobody will buy a Jazz if its more expensive than the City,1.5 iVtec or not!

What he meant was with respect to India the price is a little high.
And moreover that was a first drive of the Jazz.

But in the later issue Girish Karkera did a detailed test and justified the high price tag.

I respect Vardhan as an auto hack and will stand by what he wrote on the Polo.

[crackingride]

Originally Posted by AyAn!

What he meant was with respect to India the price is a little high.

With due respect, methinks this applies to every vehicle on the road here. Us Indians are only happy paying for freebies, and nothing more. We are cheap because we want to be, not because we cannot afford it.

If we were to pay the true cost of vehicle ownership (including the roughly one lakh ten thousand it costs for training and getting a driving license in the UK), there would be less foolhardy people in the dealerships suggesting going for non-ABS variants, and on the roads. Those that do pay the true price would be more respectful of the privilege they have. Think Singapore, for example. You have to buy the right to buy a car at an auction.

If government were not so keen on a "one time' fleecing of an automotive sale by way of taxes, and spread the revenue generation out over traffic fines, issuing of permits and licenses and the like, they would be better able to reduce excise duties, do away with stupid sub 4 meter and sub 1.2 liter rules, and still be making enough money to put back into infrastructure. But why fine idiots jumping red lights and into your path when you can get easy money from someone buying a car for double what it costs elsewhere?

And how can Vardhan Kondvikar suggest positioning the VW below the Skoda?
What does it mean for the brands in terms of relative position in the rest of the world? Will VW position itself below Skoda worldwide because some indian auto journo thinks so? Is there any idea how much work and money goes into brand strategy and brand positioning? (But then again, most Indians think branding means logo de-jine) This is the biggest joke I've heard in a long time.

Hacks ( respected or otherwise) seem to be taking their duties too lightly. Not enough hacking at greedy governments and auto majors, too much slacking at press rides. I said it before and I say it again, they are the first of the breed of freebie-clutching Indians who have not used their collective or even individual voices to get us a better deal. And why would they? Anyone see Sirish Chandran driving to work in "his" (long term loaner) BMW? Damn proud of it he was, too. I doubt they are thinking of excise duties and fuel efficiency and whether the cost of the vehicle is too high for India.

[AyAn!]

Originally Posted by crackingride

And how can Vardhan Kondvikar suggest positioning the VW below the Skoda?
What does it mean for the brands in terms of relative position in the rest of the world? Will VW position itself below Skoda worldwide because some indian auto journo thinks so? Is there any idea how much work and money goes into brand strategy and brand positioning? (But then again, most Indians think branding means logo de-jine) This is the biggest joke I've heard in a long time.
.

Talking about relative positioning of brands,this is India,where the 1.8 petrol and the 2.0 diesel Laura is a wee bit more expensive than the Jetta 1.6 petrol and 1.9TDI respectively.Both cars are based on the same Golf platform.And moreover I read somewhere that VW is contemplating slashing Jetta prices.So technically here the VW positions itself below the Skoda.Which isn't the case in UK.

This is not the west,where Skoda used to be the butt of jokes. Here it is perceived more as luxury brand.Why can't VW position itself just below/alongside a Skoda in India? This is not Toyota/Lexus or Nisaan/Infiniti.Its just that VW is the parent brand.

In all probability VW will postion the Polo alongside the Fabia.Or maybe slash Fabia's prices.But never above the current Fabia's price!

[suhaas307]

Originally Posted by crackingride

This is probably the Fabia 1.9 TDI PD Sport version. Cant think of any other variant. Maybe it will launch in time to rain on the Polo's parade. For all we know, it might have decent spec levels, and at a decent price. Max power is around 105 BHP (internationally), but dont take the sport tag seriously. Its a Fabia with some body kit and sporting pretensions.
Only downside would be the PD engine, but given that the Polo is going to land with a 1.2 CRDI, will we miss much!!?

Now I've been told that VW and all brands under it is planning to scrap the PD motors all together! The technology, apparently, is inferior when compared to the common rail motors and multi-jet diesel motors present in umpteen cars today. The PD motors are extremely noisy, score very low on refinement and NVH and do not deliver to expectations. So I'm not entirely sure if any new car that rolls out of a VW/Skoda/Audi/Seat plant would have a PD motor nestled under the hood.

Originally Posted by theEnd

Unfortunately our auto journalists have a much louder voice than ours.

Top Gear's India editor Vardan Khanvilkar (I'm sure I mangled the spelling) finished his review of the Polo by saying that VW should price it below the Fabia and at par with the Swift. He also called for beige interiors (ack!) and dismissed DSG as too expensive for India and the LED indicators on the mirrors as unnecessary as they're likely to be scraped off in traffic.

As an aside, in that very same issue he reviewed the Jazz. On the first page he mentioned that the Jazz is priced higher than the City in other countries and that the higher price is justified due to various things (interior space, adaptability, A/C controls). He also says that the Jazz should have the 1.5iVtec in it. At the end of the same article he complains about the high price of the Jazz and implores Honda to reduce it! Talk about inconsistency.

If these are the people that the manufactures are listening to, we no longer have to wonder why we get cars that have inferior features compared to the same models sold abroad.

Edit: Just thought of a name for these intrepid auto journalists in India: "the Beige Brigade".

Well, although he has a point there, I don't agree with him completely. Yes, the DSG 'box, LED indicators, expensive badges, et al, are a bit unnecessary when you consider their value in the Indian market. The mirrors and badges in particular are favourites among thieves in New Delhi and Bangalore.

But on the other hand, I think VW should price the Polo, on par with the Fabia and i20. And yes, the Jazz should get the same 1.5 vtec motor that's in the City. The price of the current Jazz needs to be dropped at least by a lakh (It's just to expensive IMO) and the 118 bhp variant should be just about 9 lakhs on road.

I wonder when Car Manufacturers are going to take us seriously. It's not just about new launches and new cars, it's about the variants and options we get too! Look at Honda for instance. When the Civic was launched, it came with one variant that didn't have a few features that customers really wanted. And later, Honda launched a variant that had all those little bits everyone wanted and that ticked off many! Ditto with the City. We have a new variant of the City with alloy wheels and so on, as standard fitment. What is with Honda?

[chncar]

Originally Posted by crackingride

And how can Vardhan Kondvikar suggest positioning the VW below the Skoda?
What does it mean for the brands in terms of relative position in the rest of the world? Will VW position itself below Skoda worldwide because some indian auto journo thinks so? Is there any idea how much work and money goes into brand strategy and brand positioning? (But then again, most Indians think branding means logo de-jine) This is the biggest joke I've heard in a long time.

Slightly off-topic, but nevertheless:

I agree that VW is worldwide in a better segment than Skoda and should remain so.

India however is some kind of special case, where VW didn't enter the market till recently, Skoda was pushed as some kind of premium brand, and basically Skoda was valued as a way to get the VW level of tech and values whilst VW was not available.

I also agree that in India VW should not be in a lower segment than Skoda. However I don't agree about VW pricing or positioning itself higher than Skoda in India either for e.g Polo above Fabia, not because it shouldn't be but because in India Skoda cars are already overpriced rip-offs and using that as a benchmark for VW will lead in poor VFM and VW will not be able to complete.

Skoda is a horrible deal, it's vehicles are overpriced, reliability is poor, safety is suspect (one TBHPian had the airbags not deploy on a major accident), and forget about good customer service, customers are treated like beggars.

Skoda in India at least in recent times is an unmitigated disaster and it needs to be junked and taken off the market, and VW needs to replace it. The Indian customer wanted VW from day 1 anyway.

So rather than Fabias with their crap diesel engine selling for 9 Lakhs, the VW Golf should be sold around that price, and the Polo can perhaps make up the 5.5-7 L bracket like the Puntos.

[abhibh]

I think VW came to India before Skoda!

Originally Posted by chncar

Slightly off-topic, but nevertheless:

I agree that VW is worldwide in a better segment than Skoda and should remain so.

India however is some kind of special case, where VW didn't enter the market till recently, Skoda was pushed as some kind of premium brand, and basically Skoda was valued as a way to get the VW level of tech and values whilst VW was not available.

I also agree that in India VW should not be in a lower segment than Skoda. However I don't agree about VW pricing or positioning itself higher than Skoda in India either for e.g Polo above Fabia, not because it shouldn't be but because in India Skoda cars are already overpriced rip-offs and using that as a benchmark for VW will lead in poor VFM and VW will not be able to complete.

Skoda is a horrible deal, it's vehicles are overpriced, reliability is poor, safety is suspect (one TBHPian had the airbags not deploy on a major accident), and forget about good customer service, customers are treated like beggars.

Skoda in India at least in recent times is an unmitigated disaster and it needs to be junked and taken off the market, and VW needs to replace it. The Indian customer wanted VW from day 1 anyway.

So rather than Fabias with their crap diesel engine selling for 9 Lakhs, the VW Golf should be sold around that price, and the Polo can perhaps make up the 5.5-7 L bracket like the Puntos.

[theEnd]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

Yes, the DSG 'box, LED indicators, expensive badges, et al, are a bit unnecessary when you consider their value in the Indian market.

...

the Jazz should get the same 1.5 vtec motor that's in the City. The price of the current Jazz needs to be dropped at least by a lakh (It's just to expensive IMO)

...

I wonder when Car Manufacturers are going to take us seriously. It's not just about new launches and new cars, it's about the variants and options we get too! Look at Honda for instance. When the Civic was launched, it came with one variant that didn't have a few features that customers really wanted.

I'm a little confused.. you don't want DSG, LED indicators and "expensive badges" on the Polo... but... you're upset that the Civic initially didn't have enough features?

You want a bigger engine in the Jazz... but... you say the price is a lakh too high?

Originally Posted by chncar

...rather than Fabias with their crap diesel engine selling for 9 Lakhs, the VW Golf should be sold around that price, and the Polo can perhaps make up the 5.5-7 L bracket like the Puntos.

Once again... you cant have your cake and eat it too. The reason why we don't get good cars is that a lot of people (such as yourself) want a Golf for 9 lakhs. Why not just go to a bank and present a cheque for 9 lakhs and ask for 12 lakhs in cash? Yes, the Golf retails for between GBP 14,075 (Rs. 10.4L) and GBP 21,770 (Rs. 16.1L) in the UK, without options.

Same goes for the VW Polo. Internationally, this is a higher quality car than a Punto, or an i20. It should be priced accordingly.

However, if VW listens to opinions such as yours, they will launch cheapened versions of their cars in India. We will buy them and fool ourselves into believing that we've bought a high quality European car when in essence the end product (after the replacing of "unnecessary" parts) is closer to a Maruti than a VW. In exchange VW will get itself a few additional sales in India but cheapen their brand proposition worldwide.

[chncar]

Originally Posted by theEnd

I'm a little confused.. you don't want DSG, LED indicators and "expensive badges" on the Polo... but... you're upset that the Civic initially didn't have enough features?

You want a bigger engine in the Jazz... but... you say the price is a lakh too high?



Once again... you cant have your cake and eat it too. The reason why we don't get good cars is that a lot of people (such as yourself) want a Golf for 9 lakhs. Why not just go to a bank and present a cheque for 9 lakhs and ask for 12 lakhs in cash? Yes, the Golf retails for between GBP 14,075 (Rs. 10.4L) and GBP 21,770 (Rs. 16.1L) in the UK, without options.

Same goes for the VW Polo. Internationally, this is a higher quality car than a Punto, or an i20. It should be priced accordingly.

However, if VW listens to opinions such as yours, they will launch cheapened versions of their cars in India. We will buy them and fool ourselves into believing that we've bought a high quality European car when in essence the end product (after the replacing of "unnecessary" parts) is closer to a Maruti than a VW. In exchange VW will get itself a few additional sales in India but cheapen their brand proposition worldwide.

I think the basic Golf should be in the ballpark of 9-10 lakhs if made locally and sold here, keep in mind that the UK price is for imports and also UK taxes are very heavy.

Since you are keen on international prices for cars sold in India, lets have an equally international perspective on what those brands are worth. I am sick and tired of all this BS being peddled in India with Skoda being positioned as premium brand, Honda/Toyota supposed to be 'premium' and now VW. None of these are premium brands and a VW in Europe commands a slight premium over Honda/Toyota, thats all. In America VW has a bad reputation for reliability and the much trumpeted Indian 'exec car' (Jetta) will make you an object of ridicule if driven by a man as it is considered to be a chick car. Their attempt to make a luxury sedan (Phaeton) under VW brand turned out to be colossal flop because people laughed at the idea of shelling out that much money for a VW regardless of how good it was.

VW is not a premium brand, and I dont see what is special about it or why I should pay a premium. I don't see why I should pay a premium for VW or any other car over a Hyundai that performs equally well, just because some they are European or have a snobbish attitude. I hope the market will agree, and reject overpriced cars just like they have the Fabia. And FWIW, I don't think the Fabia flopped because it was expensive, it flopped because at 9 Lakhs, its engine is much worse than an Indica/Swift/Palio costing 4.5 lakhs. Sure it has some fancy gadgets but there is only so much that lipstick can do for a pig.

[shankar.balan]

VW - Volks wagen - people's car

its only in india with our starved mentality, often skewed priorities and general confusion that cars of this kind fall into the "premium" space.

but the points made in these posts are well taken.
if the price is to be made less, then there has to be a high level of indigenization - this leads to other quality, fit and finish niggles - as we can see in the case of several manufacturers.

take the examples of Skoda/ Chevy Captiva/ CRV / Tucson/ Outlander and other "SUV's" - none of these are really premium outside India - but we chaps have to live with 20-30 lac price tags! yes, when you convert to other currency it doesnt seem much and indeed, out there a large number of 'common' people still prefer public transport. also, since we guys arent earning in GBP, USD and Euros, there's always going to be discrepancy in pricing etc.

having said this, VW make pretty solid cars in comparison with the Japanese and Korean vehicles and therefore, since the whole benchmarks of quality have been raised, we are forced to pay a higher price for such quality.

we are like this only...

Originally Posted by chncar

I think the basic Golf should be in the ballpark of 9-10 lakhs if made locally and sold here, keep in mind that the UK price is for imports and also UK taxes are very heavy.

Since you are keen on international prices for cars sold in India, lets have an equally international perspective on what those brands are worth. I am sick and tired of all this BS being peddled in India with Skoda being positioned as premium brand, Honda/Toyota supposed to be 'premium' and now VW. None of these are premium brands and a VW in Europe commands a slight premium over Honda/Toyota, thats all. In America VW has a bad reputation for reliability and the much trumpeted Indian 'exec car' (Jetta) will make you an object of ridicule if driven by a man as it is considered to be a chick car. Their attempt to make a luxury sedan (Phaeton) under VW brand turned out to be colossal flop because people laughed at the idea of shelling out that much money for a VW regardless of how good it was.

VW is not a premium brand, and I dont see what is special about it or why I should pay a premium. I don't see why I should pay a premium for VW or any other car over a Hyundai that performs equally well, just because some they are European or have a snobbish attitude. I hope the market will agree, and reject overpriced cars just like they have the Fabia. And FWIW, I don't think the Fabia flopped because it was expensive, it flopped because at 9 Lakhs, its engine is much worse than an Indica/Swift/Palio costing 4.5 lakhs. Sure it has some fancy gadgets but there is only so much that lipstick can do for a pig.

[crackingride]

VW worldwide commands a premium of around 10-15% over comparable category peers on the basis of its brand reputation (tattered in parts or otherwise) built over the years. What is a brand after all, other than a promise of something in return for more money than you would otherwise pay?
Going forward, VW are looking to possibly reduce that premium (see the post I made on what VW is planning strategy-wise for the US, and by implication for us here). This is primarily to focus on markets like Russia, China, and India.
So, part of a brand proposition says one is buying into a premium offering ( people's car or otherwise, that is historical- at that rate Lambo is a tractor manufacturer). Yet they are beginning to re-think and change that proposition themselves.
VW has a brand positioning problem across brands and also within brands. The Jetta is a case in point, doing well only in the US.
That said, VW will always maintain the premium over Skoda (and Seat) if not for anything else than Euro politics.
The Fabia is going to see a price reduction. No two ways about it. The Polo will occupy its slot in the price structure.
Whether it comes with a reasonable amount of bells and whistles ( enough to justify a VFM tag, or to meet expectations of those of us hoping for an international quality hatch) remains to be seen.
But there is a lot of work to do in terms of meeting expectations : some of us feel the VW justifies the premium if it comes with the attendant features. Some of us are questioning the premium of a VW even before it gets a toe-hold.
Once VW decides its brand position, and brand proposition, only then will they be clearer on what differentiation they bring to the table, and only then will they be able to clearly communicate it to us customers.
The Skoda by virtue of being first to market has been allowed by its management in cahoots with advertising and marketing to position the brand much higher than its true relative position. This must, and will change. Its a different matter that they cannot match that positioning with a compelling brand experience, relying on the individual brilliance of the product.
As far as all these vehicles falling into the "premium" bracket in the first place: we are fed on a diet of maruti 800s and saddled with inane tax structures. No wonder then that everything costs so much, and that manufacturers cheapen and cut away options mercilessly to make the sticker palatable.
I for one find the Skoda pricing ( especially now) pretty VFM. The sore point is the engine range as far as hatches go. One cannot fault the engines in the Laura and the Superb, nor the appointments.
So if the Polo were to take the place of the Fabia with better engines and decent spec ( and improved after sales, 'natch) it might find more than a few takers.

[blackasta]

Originally Posted by chncar

Since you are keen on international prices for cars sold in India, lets have an equally international perspective on what those brands are worth. I am sick and tired of all this BS being peddled in India with Skoda being positioned as premium brand, Honda/Toyota supposed to be 'premium' and now VW.

+1 to that 'premium' stuff. If you tell anyone in US that Honda / Toyota/Nissan/Mazda/VW/Mitsu is 'premium', they shall either think you are mad or go mad themselves!
BUT, when the staple cars on road are M800 and Alto ,then a Honda City (not even available in US), or a toyota corolla surely seems to be oozing luxury. Why? Because they have the BASIC features which should be present in an automobile for human safety and comfort, and which has been blatantly ignored by Indian auto makers (maybe for price/technology/emerging car market/whatever else reasons)

Originally Posted by chncar

VW is not a premium brand, and I dont see what is special about it or why I should pay a premium. I don't see why I should pay a premium for VW or any other car over a Hyundai that performs equally well, just because some they are European or have a snobbish attitude. I hope the market will agree, and reject overpriced cars just like they have the Fabia. And FWIW, I don't think the Fabia flopped because it was expensive, it flopped because at 9 Lakhs, its engine is much worse than an Indica/Swift/Palio costing 4.5 lakhs. Sure it has some fancy gadgets but there is only so much that lipstick can do for a pig.

Snob value for the badge - thats why!
If people did not care for snob value, and hyundai did their marketing right - the sonata would have outsold many other cars in its class.


pig?? lipstick??

[suhaas307]

Originally Posted by theEnd

I'm a little confused.. you don't want DSG, LED indicators and "expensive badges" on the Polo... but... you're upset that the Civic initially didn't have enough features?

You want a bigger engine in the Jazz... but... you say the price is a lakh too high?



Once again... you cant have your cake and eat it too. The reason why we don't get good cars is that a lot of people (such as yourself) want a Golf for 9 lakhs. Why not just go to a bank and present a cheque for 9 lakhs and ask for 12 lakhs in cash? Yes, the Golf retails for between GBP 14,075 (Rs. 10.4L) and GBP 21,770 (Rs. 16.1L) in the UK, without options.

Same goes for the VW Polo. Internationally, this is a higher quality car than a Punto, or an i20. It should be priced accordingly.

However, if VW listens to opinions such as yours, they will launch cheapened versions of their cars in India. We will buy them and fool ourselves into believing that we've bought a high quality European car when in essence the end product (after the replacing of "unnecessary" parts) is closer to a Maruti than a VW. In exchange VW will get itself a few additional sales in India but cheapen their brand proposition worldwide.

Let me clear this out for you. The Polo is a super-mini in Europe but when launched in India,it would be a premium hatch like the i20, Jazz, etc. Now When you are a person looking around for a fairly decent high end hatch, you'd expect value (there are a few exceptions who choose quality over quantity) and value would mean that the hatch should have a good amount of features for a price that is not too expensive, yet pricey enough to make you feel like your money is well spent. A hatch that is priced close to a car with a boot will not sell as well as a hatch that has similar features and is priced lower. Simply because Indians want more for less. And if they feel they can spend more, they want it bigger. If they feel that hey can spend around 8 lakhs for a hatch, they might as well spend it on a car that is bigger and preferably with a boot. Indians are obsessed with size. This is precisely why the Fusion and the SR-V didn't sell. And also, these cars were launched way ahead of its time. When the average hatch-back buyer would prefer to pay anything between 4-6 lakhs for a hatch.

When you can spend 12 lakhs on a car in India, you'd expect a few creature comforts and more variants for the price you pay. The Jazz would have been better if it came with the more powerful 1.5 Vtec engine from the City and if it was priced lower. And the Polo would be targeted at the average high-end hatch-back buyer and he would expect his buy to be VFM. And adding the DSG 'box and LED indicators would make it too expensive.

Now like I said in my earlier paragraph, VW will listen to such comments and launch a car that they feel would cater to the Indian market. And DSG in a hatch-back doesn't cut out for a market like India. Most high-end hatch customers would expect good VFM like I said. And that's why we're constantly shortchanged. The fact that we can't have our cake and eat it too is true as well. We shouldn't expect too much for too less. And maybe it is wrong for me to expect the Jazz to be priced cheaper and also be available with a larger motor simultaneously.

[theEnd]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

Let me clear this out for you. The Polo is a super-mini in Europe but when launched in India,it would be a premium hatch like the i20, Jazz, etc. Now When you are a person looking around for a fairly decent high end hatch, you'd expect value (there are a few exceptions who choose quality over quantity) and value would mean that the hatch should have a good amount of features for a price that is not too expensive, yet pricey enough to make you feel like your money is well spent. A hatch that is priced close to a car with a boot will not sell as well as a hatch that has similar features and is priced lower. Simply because Indians want more for less. And if they feel they can spend more, they want it bigger. If they feel that hey can spend around 8 lakhs for a hatch, they might as well spend it on a car that is bigger and preferably with a boot. Indians are obsessed with size. This is precisely why the Fusion and the SR-V didn't sell. And also, these cars were launched way ahead of its time. When the average hatch-back buyer would prefer to pay anything between 4-6 lakhs for a hatch.

When you can spend 12 lakhs on a car in India, you'd expect a few creature comforts and more variants for the price you pay. The Jazz would have been better if it came with the more powerful 1.5 Vtec engine from the City and if it was priced lower. And the Polo would be targeted at the average high-end hatch-back buyer and he would expect his buy to be VFM. And adding the DSG 'box and LED indicators would make it too expensive.

Now like I said in my earlier paragraph, VW will listen to such comments and launch a car that they feel would cater to the Indian market. And DSG in a hatch-back doesn't cut out for a market like India. Most high-end hatch customers would expect good VFM like I said. And that's why we're constantly shortchanged. The fact that we can't have our cake and eat it too is true as well. We shouldn't expect too much for too less. And maybe it is wrong for me to expect the Jazz to be priced cheaper and also be available with a larger motor simultaneously.

You're absolutely right suhaas. Especially about the few exceptions who choose quality over quantity. There's no car available for such people in India unless you have at least 40L to spend.

I think thats why some of us got quite involved in the Polo thread. Those of us who were expecting a true hot-hatch with the quality and finish to match will ultimately be disappointed. In the end, not only do you get what you pay for, but you also get what sells.

[Caramelo]

i never thought of this!!

i think when polo and the fabia are being produced in the same factory! they will share the same engines.

now as VW is no longer gonna use the PD engines. i think they will change the engines for the fabia too.

thats why they are offering the huge 57k discounts. they must have stopped production. i think they have done it, they are taking out the left out stocks. with the PD engines.

come january-march. they will launch polo at a great price and revise the price of skoda fabia just below the polo. and they will also give fabia more features. i think the face lifted fabia will be relaunched again.