[C300]

Originally Posted by vinodv001

We feel Maruti is trying something similar with the ERTIGA, from the looks and description about the design.

IMO Ertiga is in different category altogether.

As some of the posters have stated, its the image and the usability aspect of station wagon that doesnt go well with Indian buyers.

Buying a Sedan is still a status symbol in our country and very few buyers prefer their Sedan to look like a big hatch/goods carrier.

[condor]

Originally Posted by vinodv001

I hope the attitude may change with the launch of Ertiga, as its a maruti, acceptance will be much better and its more practical with more seats.

@Vinod, what makes you say that the Ertiga & the Dacia MCV are SW's / Estate Cars ? Dacia name itself says it is not a SW (see the MCV part in the name).

Reg Maruti, the last & only SW they had in India was the Baleno Altura. The Ertiga will be in the MPV category, like the Innova is.

Originally Posted by C300

IMO Ertiga is in different category altogether.

[mayankk]

Originally Posted by condor

@Vinod, what makes you say that the Ertiga & the Dacia MCV are SW's / Estate Cars ? Dacia name itself says it is not a SW (see the MCV part in the name).

Reg Maruti, the last & only SW they had in India was the Baleno Altura. The Ertiga will be in the MPV category, like the Innova is.

Ertiga is definitely a SW.
saw it, and its a small SW to boot (pun unintended).
Nowhere near the innova, and that's just for the size of it.

[condor]

@Mayankk, pls dont go by size. Ertiga is called as a mini-MPV / compact-MPV, and not a SW. Pls google

A SW - also called an Estate car - is a sedan with the roof extended to give that extended space for cargo /luggage.

Examples of SW's we have had in India - Tata Estate, Indigo Marina, Baleno Altura, the Padmini Safari, and earlier - the Standard Companion.

[shankar.balan]

An Estate car or Station Wagon simply doesnt cut it here because people prefer a 3 box sedan to show that they have "arrived" in some sense.
Also, there isnt enough space in the third row for proper seating because an Estate Car's roof is lower compared to an SUV.
Of course, people who like to seat 4-5 in comfort plus a lot of luggage OR their pet dog, may opt for a Station Wagon, but such people are relatively few and far between.
Chances are also, given our roads, that such people may prefer to opt for an SUV on account of its higher GC and higher, commanding driving position, in comparison to a Station Wagon.

[W.A.G.7]

Maybe the station wagons failed because of

1. the perceived difficulty of parking the car.
2. using the car in a town/city with narrow roads.
3. not many people were convinced of their utility value.
4. higher price maybe(?)
5. not many families would need that extra space at the back.

That said, I cannot resist posting a picture of one of the best looking station wagon. I did not know the Octavia Combi came in VRS version also ! Look closely at the grille and you will see the VRS logo.

[vinodv001]

@condor
Dacia or Maruti call their products mcv or mpv, but the fact remains that these products are made similar to SW in construction with slight modification. They have lowered the floor at the 3rd row by keeping spare under the body to accommodate 7 seats and call it MCV or whatsoever.
That is an innovation - by altering a body structure slightly to create an all new variant. Otherwise dacia mcv structure looks the same any SW, ertiga too looks very much like a SW but with a wider rear door and some minor changes.

[condor]

Originally Posted by vinodv001

Dacia or Maruti call their products mcv or mpv, but the fact remains that these products are made similar to SW in ..

then how about extending that logic to more vehicles ? We can then say that a SW is similar to a MPV, which is similar to a cross-over, which is similar to a SUV. But SUV's have been successful and so are MPV's. So now, the original question of the success of SW's is no longer valid.

The Industry defines a SW and a MPV differently, and this thread is about SW's - like the examples mentioned in this thread.

EDIT:
Vinod, should we have a discussion (if such a thread is not already there on TBHP) - about why a car should be defined as a SW or a MPV or something else ?


Having said that, I will now say that SW's was/were a model that were created long time back, even before we had proper SUV's (perhaps). The styles have since evolved, and the lines are much blurred. A MPV is more in today's style & requirements, and it does not make sense to put today's model into yesterday's category - and then try to discuss if it will succeed or not.

[vinodv001]

Originally Posted by condor

Vinod, should we have a discussion (if such a thread is not already there on TBHP) - about why a car should be defined as a SW or a MPV or something else ?

That will be better.

My logic is - Ertiga or LOgan MCV are made from the extended chassis of their hatch or sedan; not a totally different MPV platform.

[rohanjf]

If a vehicle is an MPV, it should be able to carry a lot of load too (like a pick up truck). In that sense, it should be a rear wheel drive and built on ladder-on-frame chassis.

I don't think Ertiga will be able to carry as much load as, say, an Innova or Aria can. And MSIL knew they couldn't just extend the back of Ritz/Swift because such body styles of failed. So what did they do? They raised the height and that gave the car a different shape. Now you have a station wagon that does not look like station wagon. Now the could invent a new term to market it (or use a term that most Indians are not familiar with), along with adding a new row of seats.

[Rahulkool]

Originally Posted by W.A.G.7

Maybe the station wagons failed because of

1. the perceived difficulty of parking the car.
2. using the car in a town/city with narrow roads.
3. not many people were convinced of their utility value.
4. higher price maybe(?)
5. not many families would need that extra space at the back.

That said, I cannot resist posting a picture of one of the best looking station wagon. I did not know the Octavia Combi came in VRS version also ! Look closely at the grille and you will see the VRS logo.

Attachment 895102

I think it came in vRS version only. Near my office one guy has two of them one red and one silver and both looks amazing. Much better than sedan version IMO. Guess i have something for station wagon, like almost all of them

[MARCUS_520i]

Originally Posted by Rahulkool

I think it came in vRS version only. Near my office one guy has two of them one red and one silver and both looks amazing. Much better than sedan version IMO. Guess i have something for station wagon, like almost all of them

The Octavia Combi was sold in India only between 2005 and 2007, if I remember correctly and was offered in vRS as well as L&K trims with a 1.8 turbocharged petrol and a 1.9 TDi respectively.

The vRS had the fancy sporty bumpers and spider alloys, while the L&K had standard bumpers and alloys.

The seats were different too and I like the pure leather ones on the L&K more than the black and grey on the vRS.

All in all, both them models were smokin' hot and had the perfect image of the rich man's weekend rides. Love the combi!

[haldar_siliguri]

This is a personal query that has rigged me since many years. I've always loved the idea and wanted to own an Estate car. If designed right, I love their proportions, stance and practicality. In fact some Estates look so much better than their sedan siblings and also do so much more. No matter they are so popular in most markets worldwide especially Europe.

Some of my personal favorites include

1. Ford Mondeo Estate
2. BMW 3 and 5 Series Touring
3. Volvo V60 and V70
4. Audi A6 Avant/ and that amazing RS6 rocket few years back
5. Opel Insignia Sports Tourer
6. Mazda 6

As for my question:

Why has the Estate never been successful in India so far?
Is it lack of its proper advertising, lack of its knowledge amongst the masses, or is it somehow (and very weirdly) 'impractical' or 'unlikable' to the buyers?

Regds

[silverado]

In our market a car with boot is considered to be Premium rather than a estate.This i feel is the prime reason why estate's never took off

Also apart from slightly increased practicality ( some space above rear boot ) i want to understand how can a estate version of car be sold by manufacturers ( what could be the selling point )

I feel a estate version of car should have reclining rear seats or seats which turn in to a semi-bed, this if possible can really make a good estate version IMO

[a4anurag]

Estates are BIG and in a country where place is a major concern Estates won't fit into the pictures.

Moreover, Kitna deti hai question arises. The mileage being major concern will not help estates sell in high numbers.

Seeing the market trend Hatchbacks ONLY will sell. Smaller the better (some exceptions are there).