[Mpower]

Originally Posted by GTO

Thats like saying that my Mahindra or the old HM Ambassador is the safest vehicle on planet earth because it will never reach a speed that is deemed anything close to dangerous

May not be logical, but I recall when we were in college, the public perception was that RX100 was dangerous because it was fast and HeroHondas (CD100) were safe because they were slow.Unfotunately this was confirmed by accident statistics as well. Made my life really difficult getting my folks to buy be a Yamaha.

[Gurkha]

Originally Posted by Mpower

Dosent the Gurkha have simple leaf springs? What makes its full floating. Safari with coil should have more wheel travel.

There is a difference between full floating and independent suspension, full floating means two piece axles with divorced transfer case on a swing arm, the Gurkha also has control guide arms as well as anti roll bars, all these forming a sort of cradle help it have a superior control and ride even with leaf springs and live axles as in the case of Gurkha, also the transmission gets way less shock due to the two piece axle absorbing most of it and the swinging transfer case absorbing the rest. As for travel, it is way higher than Safari of for that matter many other 4WD, front as well as rear.

The utility Toyota Land Cruiser sold in Aus and Africa also uses this system, so does the upcoming Front Runner.

[suman]

Thanks Steeroid. So are you finally entering the Raid de Himalaya which is just round the corner? Will await a detailed report from you if you do since a lot of the route is familiar territory and would like to know how the Dicor behaved.

Gurkha, thanks for your feedback, it helps.

[Gurkha]

Suman,

You are most welcome, however as Steeroid suggests, do test drive all the other options thoroughly before making the final choice. They all have their plus points and minus, it is finally up to your priority.

[suman]

Originally Posted by Gurkha

Suman,

You are most welcome, however as Steeroid suggests, do test drive all the other options thoroughly before making the final choice. They all have their plus points and minus, it is finally up to your priority.

Have already driven the Endy & the Dicor, really do not see any other options; the Tucson & CRV are basically saloon cars in disguise (oh I know I'm going to be clobbered for this!!), the Grand Vitara though a 7 seater is a no-no since petrol, not much else left as the X Trail is way too expensive

Will be a two way tussle and a few more drives before the best one wins. In the meantime, will await more feedback from Dicor owners (and some from Endy owners, do we not have ANY???!!!)

[nitinbhag]

Have test-driven all three vehicles in the title in the past few weeks.. Currently I am tending towards the Dicor 4x4 LX/EX.. Observations:

- Innova offers a brilliant ride and interiors. But, I dont want a van.
- Scorpio rear seat hopeless. No 4WD. Handling & braking downright scary. It crossed 3 lanes when trying an emergency stop from 100+ kmph !!
- Dicor will be an elephant to handle on Blr roads. VX way too expensive (LX+options or EX being evaluated). But what the heck. Its the only SUV this side of 10L INR.

Need to decide within a week. Any opinions/inputs welcome.

Thanks
Nitin

[suman]

You would need ABS to prevent braking being equally less scary in the Dicor from what I read in the Autocar; wouldn't get that in the LX/EX would you? Check out Steeroid's link as well to read about downhill braking experiences

[nitinbhag]

True.. ABS is very desirable on the Dicor.. But, quite simply, I cant afford the VX and the dealers are not confident of fitting ABS to the LX/EX..
Actually, my experience of braking on Dicor was quite OK. It needs some distance to stop, thanks to its bulk. But, it does not go haywire on the road when braking from a 100Ks like the Scorpio. The feel of the steering at speed is quite nice too. There is a bit of oversteer, specially, on rough roads with sharp turns, but thats easy to get used to and apply correction.

Thanks
Nitin

[Steeroid]

Originally Posted by suman

Thanks Steeroid. So are you finally entering the Raid de Himalaya which is just round the corner? Will await a detailed report from you if you do since a lot of the route is familiar territory and would like to know how the Dicor behaved.

Read my post - I said Raid de Himalaya NEXT YEAR. It would be foolhardy to take brand new, unbroken vehicle on that ride. Besides I want to do some modifications and I want to give the vehicle time to adjust to those mods and settle down before I try any stunts.

[aseem]

Originally Posted by Gurkha

Having driven both extensively, I can tell you this, Endeavours rear diff rep is a suspect, at least in US but then this could be a different one, it's ride is truck like, even my 69 design Jonga rides better, worse of all is the engine, severely underpowered, no matter what Ford claims, with a/c on and carrying 4 persons uphill, it wheezes, the DICOR is far more responsive in that terms, pretty close to my Jonga's performance, DICOR rides far better but would have benefited more from a full floating rear like the Gurkha's, specially for off road, but still way better than the Endeavour. As for reliability, remains to be seen, but the DICOR is based on the 407 engine so it is meant for heavy loading and therefore cope with passenger duty far better than the small 2.5 liter Mazda in the made for 6 cylinder Endeavour body. DICOR might have it's warts, but then my choice would be for it over the Endeavour any day. Best of all, TATA parts and service is way cheaper than FORD.

The other funny thing I found out about the Endeavour is that it turns off its a/c during extended idle because it doesn't have a a/c auxiliary fan for the radiator and a/c condenser, my friend had to get one installed after market. Funny on a vehicle this expensive, Ford chose to omit a basic and necessary part.

I just happen to see Ford Endevour and Dicor VX on my way to work today. To be honest, the DICOR looked like an Indian imitation of an SUV. The Ford Endy on the other hand looks and I mean LOOKS as close to a REAL SUV as can be. Also what I noticed was that although Endy was running smoothly, but the Dicor had black smoke coming out of it when revving. Lastly the 15" alloys and 255/70 tyre on Endy was way better than the cheap looking alloys on Dicor. Lastly Dicor was looking slightly less broad than the Endevour.
Although I would have gone for Endevour with my eyes closed before joining team bhp, not knowing about its power drawbacks etc. However even after knowing the drawbacks of Endy, the costlier running cost etc. I would still go for an Endy if given a choice between Endy and Dicor. My reasons:
1) Looks do matter
2) No matter how much we know about power etc. The general janta perception is that Endevour is a more costlier, more powerful and overall a better car
3) I dont want to spend 10 lakhs or close to it for a Tata vehicle as they are known for like a zillion niggling issues. Just after reading what Steroid had to go through with his new Dicor!!! In his case, he was able to convince Tata and got n number of things for free, but not everyone is like him, nor are all the dealers
4) Lastly no matter how much the head says, I will let my heart rule, and the heart says, Endevour!

[aseem]

My experience with Innova:

Daily an office Innova cab comes to pick me up. Needless to say its the base model, but here are some observations I have made about this car.
I used to love Innova's before. Used to think that the only problem with the car was its look, however have also noticed more dislikes about the car since I travel daily in it. Here they go:

1) The car's diesel engine is not as refined as a CRDI engine from say Hyundai.
2) There is engine noise when accelerating, way better than Indica, but still not what I expected from a modern diesel mill from Toyota.
3) The gear level is awkward, dont know whats wrong with it, but looks misfit
4) On bad roads or while taking turns, you do get bounced more than you would expect, I guess to do with tyre profile and wheelbase, center of gravity etc.
5) The car looks, or its my perception, but from inside I feel that the car is not as broad as a Scorpio. Maybe its caz its longer, so thats why doesnt look wide enough!
6) The interiors are great, but the AC is not as effective as I would have hoped. Specially in the base model where you have only one blower

Lastly its still way ahead of competition (Scorpio) in terms of engineering, btu you can not compare this car with Carolla comfort. Its way better than a Qualis, but not like a killer for its price. If only they had brought an SUV looking car with the same engine, than performace and these other issues could have been ignored, however caz of its looks, and on top not being state of the art engineering as claimed, I would say its just marginally better than its competition, but not a path breaking product from Toyota as percieved.

[suman]

Originally Posted by aseem

If only they had brought an SUV looking car with the same engine, than performace and these other issues could have been ignored,

They are planning to do that Aseem, the Toyota Fortuner is on the same platform and with the same engine. However, you will have a long wait for that due to production constraints - probably 2008 from what I last heard.

[cooldude1988765]

Suman are you sure it is the same engine ??? As far as i can remember the engine was 3litre devolping 150+bhp and 320+nm torque

[suman]

Originally Posted by cooldude1988765

Suman are you sure it is the same engine ??? As far as i can remember the engine was 3litre devolping 150+bhp and 320+nm torque

Oops, sorry about that.......You are correct about the engine its the platform that is the same as the Innova's

[veyron1]

@suman: nope, the fortuner is due well sooner than expected. toyota is having a hard time pushing the sales of the innova, and if rumours from the company officials are anything to go by, they want to launch the fortuner as soon as possible; could mean late this year or early next year too...

and now that the small car plans from isuzu have been scrapped and the duty sops have been given by the FM just for the small cars, i'm guessing toyota must be pretty busy working out the details for the fortuner now....