[designersf]

Originally Posted by justwheels

Rightly said, infact that was the very point when I brought live this discussion. I myself am not a very great fan of a few designs in this segment but the utility part keeps me interested. With utility I don't necessarily mean cargo utility but also family utility. Tweak the design may be and bring it on!



I am not sure if this design is more of a panel van or a complete MUV (in the sense of an Innova). And also not sure if Nissan is really in any mood to introduce this before getting its dealership network on track.

The ford one shown in one of the post above is more closer to the winger concept, thats a full grown up van. Now you might not have families buying full grown vans in India, but the berlingo or the doblo make a lot of sense. Even the voting has 70% people for a yes. That surely says something.

Also the SAIC van shown is more closer to the Eeco which is basically a peoples carrier, although it sells as a family vehicle too.

I think they are bringing the NV200 in collaboration with Ashok Leyland. Mules have been caught undergoing testing. You might want to check other threads on this.

Originally Posted by arvi86

Spot on! But the sad fact is whenever a manufacturer tries to do something out-of-the-box, it fails miserably and nobody dare touch that segment after that. The very best example would be Station Wagons. Maruti, Opel and Fiat tried their level best to popularize that segment with the Altura, Corsa Swing and Siena Weekend/Adventure but we all know the fate of those models. Tata tasted moderate success with Indigo Marina though.



Very true. Tata Winger would classify as a Panel Van in India, but then again the same reason as I stated above made sure that it was not a huge success.

I feel Tata Winger is doing well. You can find quite a few in Chennai at least. Not sure about other places. However, one disadvantage of Winger is the lack of boot space of any kind - one must use unoccupied seats.

[GTO]

These kinda vans are very popular in Europe, no? Unsurprising, as the European market rates practicality very highly (they buy hatchbacks out of choice, not budget).

I don't think the Indian market will accept a 10+ lakh rupee panel van yet. Remember, this body style is about practicality & utility over style; our million rupee purchases are typically driven by brand, looks, features, "feel good" factor etc. However, if 5 - 8 lakh rupee panel vans are possible, while matching similar priced hatchbacks & sedans in features & equipment, I think it might be worth a shot.

Personally though, I wouldn't be caught dead in one of those. They are simply too ugly.

[justwheels]

Originally Posted by GTO

These kinda vans are very popular in Europe, no? Unsurprising, as the European market rates practicality very highly (they buy hatchbacks out of choice, not budget).

I don't think the Indian market will accept a 10+ lakh rupee panel van yet. Remember, this body style is about practicality & utility over style; our million rupee purchases are typically driven by brand, looks, features, "feel good" factor etc. However, if 5 - 8 lakh rupee panel vans are possible, while matching similar priced hatchbacks & sedans in features & equipment, I think it might be worth a shot.

Personally though, I wouldn't be caught dead in one of those. They are simply too ugly.

The very point that I want to discuss is what you said in your first line. I have always seen the way European markets react to various car categories. They are highly utility conscious. But whats with us where we have become recipients of strange marketing by companies. "Tested on Indian Roads" was more of a mocking statement than a serious one I think. Same goes with car categories. We are being loaded with umpteen options of the same category. Even I am not to the liking of most of the panel van designs but I still feel they can give a variety to the auto segment in India.
I know its the way we have made the market look like, but wish we could really change that. We really miss a lot on practical choices just because of this.

[vb-saan]

Someone who is looking for a family car may never look at the option of buying a car derived from a panel van. Reasons are (1) they look ugly, and (2) the utility image. And I guess manufacturers are aware of this as well. Look at Skoda Yeti – just on the design, it looks like an upmarket derivative of Skoda Roomster (which have a panel van kind of styling)

[ajay0612]

Originally Posted by parsh

I thought WagonR came quite close to this. Just a bit extended and it will surely fit in this category, WagonREx. BTW, was it Doblo, or Diablo? I remember seeing a different version in UK with the eyes sunken in kind of design. Or as some suggest a compressed Xylo would probably fit in this category. Another B+ segment. Would surely find some market here.

Right. As such Wagon R does not have as much utility factor as it can't carry more than 2+2 (a small family), too tall (as compared to width), not enough GC. While there may be small advantage due to flat hatch door and tallboy design, the resulting fuel efficiency penalty mitigates that.

Unless the vehicle is able to offer basic USPs as extra (higher GC, more passenger carrying ability, more power, etc.) it is not going to succeed. That is why upcoming Maruti R3 is such a practical vehicle. It is going to be a roaring success. Mini-Xylo is also one such vehicle.

[TaurusAl]

Originally Posted by GTO

These kinda vans are very popular in Europe, no? Unsurprising, as the European market rates practicality very highly (they buy hatchbacks out of choice, not budget).

I don't think the Indian market will accept a 10+ lakh rupee panel van yet. Remember, this body style is about practicality & utility over style; our million rupee purchases are typically driven by brand, looks, features, "feel good" factor etc. However, if 5 - 8 lakh rupee panel vans are possible, while matching similar priced hatchbacks & sedans in features & equipment, I think it might be worth a shot.

Personally though, I wouldn't be caught dead in one of those. They are simply too ugly.

I completely agree with GTO. Atleast in India, there are very few who consider the vehicles practicality over its looks. The passion is on high spirits while buying cars. We see people who dont have a clue of off-roading, buying 4X4s to commute in city, dont we ?

[designersf]

Originally Posted by ajay0612

Right. As such Wagon R does not have as much utility factor as it can't carry more than 2+2 (a small family), too tall (as compared to width), not enough GC. While there may be small advantage due to flat hatch door and tallboy design, the resulting fuel efficiency penalty mitigates that.

Unless the vehicle is able to offer basic USPs as extra (higher GC, more passenger carrying ability, more power, etc.) it is not going to succeed. That is why upcoming Maruti R3 is such a practical vehicle. It is going to be a roaring success. Mini-Xylo is also one such vehicle.

I believe WagonR has enough ground clearance to tackle our roads. And the K10 endows it with more than enough power for its size.

Apart from that, speaking of 10 lakh panel vans, the Innova is happily selling even when the top-end variant costs close to Rs 12-13 lakhs. I would really look at a panel van in that range as an alternative. And think of the cab operators, panel vans might just satisfy their need.

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by designersf

Apart from that, speaking of 10 lakh panel vans, the Innova is happily selling even when the top-end variant costs close to Rs 12-13 lakhs. I would really look at a panel van in that range as an alternative. And think of the cab operators, panel vans might just satisfy their need.

Thats a wrong comparison. Innova is an MPV, and is in a completely different segment from panel van derived cars. Panel van derived cars are not really considered as people movers (even in the markets where these cars are really established). Just having similar price points cannot be a reason for comparison.

[misquitas]

Originally Posted by GTO

Personally though, I wouldn't be caught dead in one of those. They are simply too ugly.

But GTO, don't some of those 'panel vans' make good-looking hearse vans?

There was an interesting post earlier on this thread that suggested that the Indian market hasn't really accepted these type of vehicles. If I recall correctly, the Mahindra Voyager and Maruti Versa, did not do well, even though they offered maximum space on wheels per sq foot.

[man23ish]

Originally Posted by GTO

Personally though, I wouldn't be caught dead in one of those. They are simply too ugly.

I second GTO on that thought... These are simply too ugly and there seems to be a competition on who is more uglier with more and more manufacturers coming up with similar models.

Personally, i would like to see our very own Matador come out with refined plush interiors and a powerful engine and safety standards..

Remember what the volkswagon did to the Beetle, if the same thing can be replicated on the Matador, we have a winner on hand...

Drool on this picture...

[kothamasi]

Originally Posted by ACM

Voted Yes

In many ways they are simply the intermediate segment to the Wagon R on one side and the omni/echn/venture on the other side.

Somehow have never felt comfortable getting into the rear seat of one of these though on paper it seems to imply that these are more comfortable.

Sorry ACM, have to disagree on the comparison with Wagon-R/Omni. I dont know whether you refer to omni/wagon R when you say never felt comfortable getting into the rear seat. These are actually quite spacious (1800 mm width) and comfortable at the front and rear. This design is in fact a very popular one in Europe and almost all major manufacturers (Renault, Peugeot, Citroen, VW, Fiat) have it in their inventory. These are regular 3-box family cars with plenty of space for 5 passengers and a lot of luggage. I am amazed why this design has not been offered in India by any Car maker.

[apachelongbow]

Originally Posted by vb-san

Someone who is looking for a family car may never look at the option of buying a car derived from a panel van. Reasons are (1) they look ugly, and (2) the utility image. And I guess manufacturers are aware of this as well. Look at Skoda Yeti – just on the design, it looks like an upmarket derivative of Skoda Roomster (which have a panel van kind of styling)

I drove around in the roomster for a month when in Brussels. The biggest problem with it was excessive body roll starting as low as 40 kmph. .even going around traffic circles it felt the outer wheels may just get airborne...not a good idea to have such cars in India..we have the unsafe Eeco already.

[blackwasp]

Don't know if this is the right place to post, but I have spotted a white Ford Transit with 66CCxxxx number parked outside a used car dealership in Vashi. Unfortunately I did not have my phone with me so didn't take pictures, but I will if I pass through it again. It looks quite appealing parked amongst SUVs and MUVs.

[subraiyr]

Originally Posted by man23ish

Remember what the volkswagon did to the Beetle, if the same thing can be replicated on the Matador, we have a winner on hand...

Drool on this picture...

Yeah - This is one drool worthy van and reminds me of "the carry on series" where it was featured a lot.
To me panel vans are more prevelant in Europe thanks to low income families still managing to take long trips across as a family. I am not too sure if this is the case in India and hence the missing panel van. Wagon R came close. I thought Ashok Leyland's Stile came closer still. Evalia was there and then no more.
Yes this seems a fairly unexplored series and whoever makes a good proposition and a model to back it can win it.
Would you call the Duster a panel van excepting for its swinging doors now

[Accent Martin]

I foresee these vans to take the image of being 'Cargo vans' . If the manufacturers think there is a big market for these vans by business enterprises like cargo or distribution, then they could launch them for capitalizing on that segment. But in my opinion, soon people would walk away from these vans as they wouldn't wanna buy a cargo van. Just like they say about few cars that have image of cabs.