[RahulNagaraj]

A new study conducted by Graz University of Technology in collaboration with Brussels-based Transport & Environment (T&E) found that real-world data suggest that plug-in hybrids emit more pollutants than claimed.

Anna Krajinska, Vehicle Emissions Manager at Transport & Environment states that "PHEVs are sold as the perfect combination of battery and engine usage, however, real-world testing shows this to be a myth."



As part of the study, researchers at the university tested 3 new plug-in hybrid vehicles in real-world conditions in Graz, Austria: BMW 3-series, Peugeot 308 and Renault Megane. The results of the study showed that all three vehicles struggled to match their WLTP all-electric range estimates, while also emitting significantly higher pollutants than indicated.

With the batteries of the three PHEVs fully charged, researchers found that the Megane emitted 20% more CO2 than its claimed figure, the 308 emitted 70% more while the 3 Series' real-world emission was a massive 300% more than the WLTP estimates. In terms of its electric-only range, the Megane PHEV was the only one which matched its claimed range, with the 3 Series and the 308 achieving only 74% and 50% of its claimed zero-emissions range, respectively.



When the batteries were depleted, all three cars reportedly emitted between 5% - 7% more than what they are supposed to.

Krajinska stated that PHEVs should not be treated as zero-emission vehicles and that at the very least, the incentives should be based on real-world pollution. She went on to add that governments should end all purchase subsidies for PHEVs and instead encourage the use of battery electric cars.

Source: T&E Twitter

Link to Team-BHP news

[SKC-auto]

PHEVs are not best of both world's, it's worst of both world's, with increasing EV infra, no doubt people are shying away from buying PHEVs.

[COMMUTER]

This appears to be a propagandist hit-piece on Toyota. Toyota only stood up against this EV myth by correctly pointing out that the mineral inputs are not enough to cater to the number of battery cars needed to replace ICE. Studies are easy to spin out these days. link . It is the application that will make those who blindly believe in the dogma to be left stumped.

[ritesh_44]

So these numbers are worse than they claim. For a thorough comparison they should compare results with equivalent ICE car.
They have done selective comparison of 55km drive, but if someone is just running car in only ev mode daily, won't the emission zero.

[ajayc123]

Sad to see that highly educated people are so vulnerable to publish agenda based reports. Not just are they diluting credibility of universities, but also misleading people.

I really think there are use cases where PHEVs are good, and there are other use cases where they are not as useful. Making blanket statements like these are avoidable.

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by ritesh_44

They have done selective comparison of 55km drive, but if someone is just running car in only ev mode daily, won't the emission zero.

Most people buying PHEVs don't install chargers at home, they don't rely on public chargers, the result is no EV range, and poor petrol range. There is a good video by Rory Reid about this problem. PHEVs work only when there is a charger setup at home and regularly charged.

https://youtu.be/PsQORFOUgTY

[avira_tk]

PHEV is just another grift that caters to the insatiable appetite for virtue signalling. Earlier, it was diesel that could save the planet, one installment a month, now it's hybrid/ gas stoves or eating fake meat or something, it changes every few days.

The average phev car is a company paid perk, don't bother with charging ,as ANPR systems allow you to drive into the urban center purely on the basis of your vehicle classification. Pollute endlessly as fuel consumption skyrockets when you carry around a heavy battery and then no taxes as you personally are helping save the planet.

This would be funny if it weren't so tragic, the NGO that created this report is part of the propaganda arm of the EU, unelected commissars who want you to eat fake meat, live in a pod and own nothing. This is the kind of problem with having unemployable arts majors taking about technical subjects they know nothing about.

[Cresterk]

Originally Posted by SKC-auto

Most people buying PHEVs don't install chargers at home, they don't rely on public chargers, the result is no EV range, and poor petrol range. There is a good video by Rory Reid about this problem. PHEVs work only when there is a charger setup at home and regularly charged.

https://Youtu.be/PsQORFOUgTY

Agreed. There was another study where it turned out that most plug-in hybrids were fleet purchases by businesses for the government incentives and were driven by their employees. The employees also received a fuel card or some sort of fuel rebate for filling up but nothing for electric bills for charging the car. Thus most people never bothered plugging the car in and they just ended up being used as a heavier, less efficient petrol car.

[sandeepmohan]

There could be a few things going on here:

• The owners are just too lazy to be bothered about charging their little PHEV battery packs.
• There are charging infrastructure issues where these PHEV's are being used. Could be a legit issue. After all, not everyone has their own driveway.
• Users trying out a PHEV before going all out 100% EV.

If the intention of this study is to push people towards going 100% EV's and skip PHEV's, thats not going to work. A 100% EV vehicle does not suit each & everyone. Most city council abroad categorize it as illegal to charge your car straight of the wall socket. A dedicated EV charger unit is required.

Mitsubishi's new Outlander PHEV outsold the RAV4 recently. This has never happened in the history of the Outlanders innings. Its a sign that if you give consumers the option of a vehicle that is cheaper to run and is dependable, they are going to buy that vehicle.

A PHEV will be just as polluting as a gas car, if the user does not make the most of the vehicle. Should you find fault with the technology for that? No.

[fhdowntheline]

Originally Posted by avira_tk

This would be funny if it weren't so tragic, the NGO that created this report is part of the propaganda arm of the EU, unelected commissars who want you to eat fake meat, live in a pod and own nothing. This is the kind of problem with having unemployable arts majors taking about technical subjects they know nothing about.

This aptly sums up the situation. What's more dangerous is when such agenda drives world affairs, well, because certain geopolitical blocks showcase themselves as the saviours of the world. Our problem is the worlds problem, but not vice-versa.

[sathyasuri]

Originally Posted by RahulNagaraj

...
As part of the study, researchers at the university tested 3 new plug-in hybrid vehicles in real-world conditions in Graz, Austria: BMW 3-series, Peugeot 308 and Renault Megane. The results of the study showed that all three vehicles struggled to match their WLTP all-electric range estimates, while also emitting significantly higher pollutants than indicated.

With the batteries of the three PHEVs fully charged, researchers found that the Megane emitted 20% more CO2 than its claimed figure, the 308 emitted 70% more while the 3 Series' real-world emission was a massive 300% more than the WLTP estimates. ...

Doesn't this mean that the WLTP needs a review (atleast for the PHEVs) as real-world data being way off the mark of the test process's estimates?

Experts in the group do correct my inference.

[Dosanova]

Originally Posted by SKC-auto

PHEVs are not best of both world's, it's worst of both world's, with increasing EV infra, no doubt people are shying away from buying PHEVs.

I sincerely do not think there is enough lithium in the world for everyone to electrify. PHEVs are a middle ground till Battery technology matures into something better. The Maruti Grand Vitara getting 25kmpl all round mileage is proof, the mild hybrid gets 13kmpl average. this is an almost 100% improvement in mileage and cuts the fuel bill by half. Most petrol is wasted in idling. to cover 1000kms the petrol car uses 76 litres of petrol and the hybrid uses 40 litres. If the limited lithium resources are used in hybrids, it is a far more effective use of the technology which benefits more drivers than a few.

Originally Posted by SKC-auto

Most people buying PHEVs don't install chargers at home, they don't rely on public chargers, the result is no EV range, and poor petrol range. There is a good video by Rory Reid about this problem. PHEVs work only when there is a charger setup at home and regularly charged.

"Cars with seatbelts installed don't work because people don't wear them"

That's a behavioural issue that can be easily corrected.

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by Dosanova

I sincerely do not think there is enough lithium in the world for everyone to electrify.

1. There is enough lithium, that's what experts are saying, just 3 days back we have likely discovered large lithium mine, the more exploration happens we may discover more mines.

2. The report says PHEVs are giving worst mileage, even attached a video by Rory Reid who observed the same. Recommend watching the video full.

3. There is similar findings with another study by ICCT, if you never heard of ICCT, they are the organisation which caught VW and all other companies cheating in the now infamaously called dieselgate.

https://theicct.org/publication/real...hev-use-jun22/

4. You are comparing the mileage of hybrids in an urban environment, you should compare with PHEVs which carry extra 100kgs of battery weight.

Originally Posted by Dosanova

"Cars with seatbelts installed don't work because people don't wear them"

That's a behavioural issue that can be easily corrected.

Yes, behavioural issue, unlike seatbelts you cannot enforce law on someone not charging, let us know if you have any ideas, otherwise I don't think it can be easily corrected. These PHEVs only take AC charging.

Also the advantages of using PHEVs(with charging) in an urban environment are negated when used for longer distances if the mileage is worse as stated in these reports.