[Thad E Ginathom]

Germany has rules over rules haha. We even have rules for the rules! Especially in the automotive industry (concerning traffic in general, transport of children, safety issues,

What are you going to say the first time you see a family of five on a motorbike?

And I too am a fan of German cars: I'd drive an Audi if I could afford it, but I never have been able to. I did get to drive a VW Golf, company car, for two years, and its reliability was not quite as solid as they would have us believe, but It didn't put me off.

[Blue Thunder]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

..... factories all of which are in china, ....

this maybe partly true for consumer goods/electronics manufacturing but definitely not so for the automotive manufacturing industry .

[navin]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

PS: Can anyone recall the case where an Indian sued opel (?) because his car had the engine/drivetrain from Detroit Diesel (?) of GM and NOT german engineering? I'll google and post back in a day or so.

Opel Astras sold in India either came with South African or Australian (Holden) engines.

[Mayavi]

Originally Posted by gt_mustang

@mayavi why am i comparing a 30 year car to say that RELIABILITY does exist on these americans hey they are still on the road na!!!! compare that with a german

It is like saying India is the worlds largest economy because 250 years back they had 25% of the worlds GDP.
If a car made 30 years back is reliable it only means that they used to make reliable cars 30 years back, not even 29 years back. Japanese made reliable cars 30 years back and they still make reliable cars. Mercedes always built their cars like tanks, rarely break down, still no one touches a 2002- 04 C class in the used market. Those 3 years gave them such bad rep that Merc went on an aggressive Design and marketing campaign to launch the newer C.

Nos:

Did you ever drive a German or an American car? How can even you say that German cars are boring to drive? And giving an example of Corvette? Dude, talk about everyday cars.

[gkrishk]

Every nation, every region, has a collective psyche. But that does not mean a nation or a region is not heterogenous. Don't we all know that one Mallu (or Panjabi or Tamil) is different from another Mallu or Panjabi or Tamil, yet they are similar in manner, tastes, behaviour, and so on in such a way that it distinguishes their regional identities. Similarly the Japanese, German and American cultures and thought-processes must affect their automotive (and other) products. If Tata buys Jaguar/Landrover they will try their best not to change the character of the marques - they must remain British cars or they will lose their USPs. Just because Opel is owned by GM doesn't mean its not German. Anyway cars these days are often designed in one country by engineers hired from many places, built in different plants all over the globe and sold all over the globe. That they have an identifiable national identity at all is indeed surprising!

[phamilyman]

Originally Posted by Blue Thunder

this maybe partly true for consumer goods/electronics manufacturing but definitely not so for the automotive manufacturing industry .

Absoloutely spot on. Point taken. But you'd still agree that everything is too global to really say that something is truly a German car.

Originally Posted by navin

Opel Astras sold in India either came with South African or Australian (Holden) engines.

Oops, whihc is why i was apprehensive. but doesn't anyone recall the case? Came in mags then. Don't recall the specific details and google isnt helpful. :(

[vintagepoint5]

I am using Chevrolet Caprice 1986 for 10 yrs, I find this car very economical to maintain with less trouble. In Saudi Arabian car market
Caprice cars were very popular and still 80's cars were running on roads.
It's V8 engine is powerfull for sudden pickup and good
handling even in city roads and highway drive is very comfortable.

German cars or European cars were of very good quality workmanship as well, they are luxourous no doubt, but here in KSA it is expensive to maintain it, spare parts & repairs were expensive compared to American cars. Those who want average maintainance cost will not prefer European cars, but for wealthy segment these cars have very good customer base in Middle-East.

Among American Cars, Caprice, Ford were cheaper to maintain, where as
Cadillac, Crysller, Chargers were little expensive.

Japanese cars in KSA market, Toyota: Camry, Cresida, Corolla is popular
and have resale value, cheaper to maintain. Where as Lexus is expensive
to maintain, but it has quality. Japanese & Korean cars after 15-20 years all plastic parts bumpers, etc. will come off the car, where as German, American, cars after 15-20 yrs still in place in much better shape.
Mazda 929 is successful cars of 80's, Mazda 626, 323 series were not successful. Mitisubishi Galant was good, Honda Accord, Civic were excellent cars, Toyoto Landcruiser & Prado were excellent.

Korean cars in KSA, sometime it is observed that cars prices were less but
they recover in spare parts, ie. they make spare parts expensive.

Among German cars: Mercedes, BMW, Porshe is most popular here, Audi, VW is less. But all very expensive spare parts & maintenace in cost.

I also have latest Ford Mercury Grand Marquis latest, it is good, but not
strong as old Caprice. Ground clearance is less, plastic bumpers, old Caprice has steel bumpers, ground clearance is good enough to climb even
footpath if needed.

GMC is popular for transportation taxis or big family, MPV, SUV.

Hummer2 & 3, Porshe, Mini Cooper, VW, Ford Charger, Mercedes, BMW, etc. Sports cars, popular for youngster.

Regards,

[Tstag]

I think the Germans have had it all their own way for a long time. Their cars have handeling, power, the interiors feel very well engineered. They have heritage and they have charisma. The only brand to get close globally was Lexus but they have been a relative flop in Europe.

American luxury cars are really Ford or GM cars. They have poor plastics, poorly designed interiors, woefull handeling, and return poor MPG/ performance. They are also total flops internationally.

I think the challenge to the German car companies is coming. But not from the USA. Alfa Romeo is starting to catch up, and their styling is first rate. SAAB's improved and Volvo is doing OK too. I think the biggest challenge over the next decade may come from Jaguar and Land Rover. Jag has been battered by the Germans in the last decade but from adversity often comes sucess. Consider the following things about Jag:

- Reliablity better than the Germans and matching Lexus
- Jag's new XK and XF are seriously great cars (XF had 10,000 pre-production orders!)
- Jag has brand strength in Europe unlike Lexus
- Jag dealers rated as high as Lexus dealers
- Handeling rated highly on new XF
- XF and XK are contemporary, and have established new Jag design language.
- 15 years ago the XJ as the sales leader in it's class. So Jag can do well!
- New pant wetting E type Jaguar on the way
- Also new XJ and XK 4 door

Now bottle all this up and bundle company with Land Rover, who's sales have only ever gone up by the end of each decade. Land Rover is possibly considered the best premium SUV brand in the world and has new models in the pipeline, just like Jag. Land Rover hasn't even tried to tap new markets like India yet.

If the Germans are going to see competition I think it will come from Europe and Japan but not America. And judging by the reaction to the new XF then I think Jaguar may turn out to be the greatest comeback kid of all time! Mark my words Jaguar is coming out guns blazing with the bit between it's teeth. And it's not just words, if you live in Britain and want a used BMW 5 series, your best bet for a deal is a Jag dealer..... now ask why?

[Xehaust]

I for one would like to know Why?

[AMATMO]

Originally Posted by Mayavi

It is like saying India is the worlds largest economy because 250 years back they had 25% of the worlds GDP.
If a car made 30 years back is reliable it only means that they used to make reliable cars 30 years back, not even 29 years back. Japanese made reliable cars 30 years back and they still make reliable cars. Mercedes always built their cars like tanks, rarely break down, still no one touches a 2002- 04 C class in the used market. Those 3 years gave them such bad rep that Merc went on an aggressive Design and marketing campaign to launch the newer C.

Nos:

Did you ever drive a German or an American car? How can even you say that German cars are boring to drive? And giving an example of Corvette? Dude, talk about everyday cars.

exactly very true

looks as if you have never driven one NOS