[Jaggu]

I am big Rossi fan since day 1 and why i think he is still up there is

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3_1zgv1pNo

Vs this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SznXDEqZvno

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

I am big Rossi fan since day 1 and why i think he is still up there is

Sorry Jaggu. He had his leg out. Ergo, trying too hard.

[killjoy]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

I am big Rossi fan since day 1 and why i think he is still up there is

Dude, I am one of the biggest supporters of Rossi and hoping with everything I got that he will take one more championship this year but you just cannot take away from Marc!!! Watch this please -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcEk6QC4W2Q

[MonsterPatrol]

Originally Posted by killjoy

Dude, I am one of the biggest supporters of Rossi and hoping with everything I got that he will take one more championship this year but you just cannot take away from Marc!!! Watch this please -

A very old video n a topic to be discussed.. But anyways since it was brought up, I would say taking nothing away from marc that it was just pure fluke by him.
A motogp bike has the maximum lean angle of 64 degrees on tracks like Aragon from where it can power out of the corner consistently lap after lap without the rear edge grip giving away.This was officially tested by Yamaha Motogp team in 2013 with the assistance of Hiroshi Yamada of Bridgestone. If the telemetrics were right then this was around 68 degrees which is physically impossible.Now people might start with their bullcrap that marc's riding is beyond the understanding of physics n blah blah but the truth is it was just pure fluke. Ask him to do it again n he would just laugh it off. I have and I'm sure many of us too have seen him crash in much more simpler situations where he shouldn't have.
Technical aspect, the 2014 Factory RCV 213V had superior rear grip exiting corners which would've helped him escape the crash.They made that Bridgestone work well especially with the new added heat resistant layer. But the bottomline is it was just a fluke,a one off event but nevertheless an amazing one.One we would not see again.Much like the famous Roberto Carlos freekick.
Moreover this happened at one of the testings last year where riders generally push beyond their limits to find the perfect settings for the next year's bike.Will certainly not happen in a high pressure race situation.

The Honda of 2014 which Marc rode to victory 13 out of 18 times was on some other level really. Then came Gigi Dallag'na with his GP15 and his brutal horsepower if you know what I'm talking about.Nakamoto seemed upset n he wanted more.But credit to Lin jarvis and the lot for finally sorting out their braking/corner entry with the new seamless gearbox.
Although leap years behind Honda they have finally caught up and the results are to be seen.Rossi n Jorge leading the charts. To be honest, I found Rossi's save at Mugello last week to be more of a shocker,a stunner and outright skill to stay on the bike.

[killjoy]

I wont argue that at all but I find Rossi to be way up there on a talent scale and the only other person close to him at the moment is Marc!

[MonsterPatrol]

You really cannot say that, in my opinion the entire grid is equally skilled atleast the factory riders. The difference is mental strength, race fitness, tyre conservation, offtrack rider input and most importantly consistency.

Only in 2016, we shall discover real rider talent when the entire grid will have to use the same spec software supplied by Dorna. Also the new tyre supplier Michelin will play a huge part. This is where you will see riders like Aleix Espargaro show his real talent who at the moment is hugely underrated. The man is seriously talented. Put him on a factory Yamaha somebody!

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

This is where you will see riders like Aleix Espargaro show his real talent who at the moment is hugely underrated. The man is seriously talented. Put him on a factory Yamaha somebody!

I would give a factory ride to Crutchlow first. No one deserves it more in the current non factory lineup. Or would do more, if given one.

[MonsterPatrol]

Originally Posted by ebonho

I would give a factory ride to Crutchlow first. No one deserves it more in the current non factory lineup. Or would do more, if given one.

Crutchlow's ride is already quite similar to the factory honda.They even have the new updated swingarm now. Most likely difference is Santi Hernandez can deliver a better setup to Marc with factory backing than Lucio can with his limited data/financial backing.But that said, Crutchlow is riding better with the Honda engine/chassis combination than he did with Tech3 Yamaha where he struggled. Honda's hard braking and early exit suits him.He would struggle even on a factory yamaha.Corner speed is not his style. IMO Crutchlow is in a perfect place now, no pressure to deliver and a podium once in a while will keep him going.Nevertheless it's still early days for him at Honda but for now he needs to finish races most importantly.

Crutchlow is a great rider but I dont think he deserves a factory ride currently.He's quick alright but he's seriously inconsistent. Sometimes,in the morning practice he's quick and afternoons he struggles vice versa.Factory teams want that consistentcy and race finishes.DNF is a disaster for them. I think he struggles more with a full tank of gas at the start (like pedrosa). But he's a perfect satellite rider. With the likes of Jack Miller,Maverick Vinales and raw talent of Fabio Quartararo coming through the ranks, Crutchlow has no chance of securing a factory rider in the future unfortunately.

Where as Aleix Espagaro is in prime form.Is extremely quick n aggressive.He rode the wheels of that ugly underperforming piece of crap NGM Forward Yamaha last year n competed with factory bikes in the early part of the races n dominated many practice sessions.This year stefan bradl is barely making it into points finish on the same bike,so you see the talent.Aleix is perfectly suited for Yamaha and has the hunger. He needs a factory yamaha soon,he isnt getting any younger and the motogp world is missing something good.On the other hand suzuki are doing well for their first year but it'll be a long time before they catch up with the other three factories.

Mod Note : Please use the EDIT or MULTI-QUOTE buttons instead of typing one post after another on the SAME THREAD!

To know how to multi-quote, click here.

We advise you to read the Forum Rules before proceeding any further.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Where as Aleix Espagaro is in prime form.Is extremely quick n aggressive.He rode the wheels of that ugly underperforming piece of crap NGM Forward Yamaha last year n competed with factory bikes in the early part of the races n dominated many practice sessions.This year stefan bradl is barely making it into points finish on the same bike,so you see the talent.Aleix is perfectly suited for Yamaha and has the hunger. He needs a factory yamaha soon,he isnt getting any younger and the motogp world is missing something good.On the other hand suzuki are doing well for their first year but it'll be a long time before they catch up with the other three factories.

First of all, I have never bought into this theory that one rider doing well on a particular bike and another floundering on the same is an indication of the talent and skill of the two rider vis a vis each other. It just does not work that way. Different riders gel with different bikes. It is never a zero sum game.

Secondly, forget Yamaha. Who is the current pack of factory riders would you replace to give Espagaro his ride?

[MonsterPatrol]

Originally Posted by ebonho

First of all, I have never bought into this theory that one rider doing well on a particular bike and another floundering on the same is an indication of the talent and skill of the two rider vis a vis each other. It just does not work that way. Different riders gel with different bikes. It is never a zero sum game.

Secondly, forget Yamaha. Who is the current pack of factory riders would you replace to give Espagaro his ride?

Indication of talent? Aleix scored a factory ride with his performance at NGM Forward,whereas bradl got demoted from a satellite team of LCR honda to an open yamaha of NGM! Where he is still underperforming. By round 7 last year,Aleix had a pole position to his name and till aragon 2 podiums.Finished the year 7th in the overall championship and best open class rider last year beating 4 satellite riders including stefan bradl.Indication of talent?

Aleix doesn't need to 'replace' anyone at Factory Yamaha actually.Both Jorge n Rossi are doing/done great for their team.What yamaha can do is run a 3 bike team like Repsol honda did in 2011. Get Aleix in and completely decimate honda n ducati with Jorge n Rossi on the frontlines.All it needs is a little signature by Lin jarvis sent over to Italy.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

Aleix doesn't need to 'replace' anyone at Factory Yamaha actually.Both Jorge n Rossi are doing/done great for their team.What yamaha can do is run a 3 bike team like Repsol honda did in 2011. Get Aleix in and completely decimate honda n ducati with Jorge n Rossi on the frontlines.All it needs is a little signature by Lin jarvis sent over to Italy.

Why Yamaha?

Why not Ducati or Honda?

You did not get my previous post. Stefan Bradl not doing well on a bike on which Aleix did does not automatically mean Stefan Bradl < Aleix Espagaro. Its always bike + rider. You cannot take one part of the equation and extrapolate on to another.

a=b=x

c+b=y

x>y is not equal to a>c

[MonsterPatrol]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Why Yamaha?

Why not Ducati or Honda?

You did not get my previous post. Stefan Bradl not doing well on a bike on which Aleix did does not automatically mean Stefan Bradl < Aleix Espagaro. Its always bike + rider. You cannot take one part of the equation and extrapolate on to another.

a=b=x

c+b=y

x>y is not equal to a>c

It definitely means one thing, Aleix is a better rider overall compared to Stefan Bradl by a long way. The figures dont lie, the results don't as well. Only points matter to the teams not one lap pace or just the talent and that is exactly why Aleix got a factory ride and Bradl didn't. Aleix has shown both pace and finished well in the past. In Motogp your talent is judged by one n only one thing - 'Results' and that transforms automatically into which team you ride for whether its factory,satellite or open. A talent heirarchy basically. Bradl this year has scored only one point so far and retired in 3 races. That's terrible even compared to jack miller who's on a RCV 1000R.

Aleix is more of a Yamaha rider and he's already got a couple of years experience working with Yamaha racing. Hence he will be used to the bosses,sponsors, technicians and the whole politics of it. It'll be an easier switch for him than going to ducati or honda whose bosses are a little dictatorial to the riders' liking. Hence yamaha and not honda or ducati (from a rider's perspective not spectator).

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

It definitely means one thing, Aleix is a better rider overall compared to Stefan Bradl by a long way. The figures dont lie, the results don't as well. Only points matter to the teams not one lap pace or just the talent and that is exactly why Aleix got a factory ride and Bradl didn't. Aleix has shown both pace and finished well in the past. In Motogp your talent is judged by one n only one thing - 'Results' and that transforms automatically into which team you ride for whether its factory,satellite or open. A talent heirarchy basically.

Three words to argue the point you are making.

Stoner.

Rossi.

Ducati.

[MonsterPatrol]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Three words to argue the point you are making.

Stoner.

Rossi.

Ducati.

One word to end the argument. Stonerism. If you are familiar with the term.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by MonsterPatrol

One word to end the argument. Stonerism. If you are familiar with the term.

Every rider has his own -ism in Moto GP.

I've heard of Moanerism more often though. Are you familiar with that term?