Team-BHP - Formula 1: The 2018 Japanese Grand Prix
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Porcupine (Post 4472955)
And let's say they have reliability issues, knowing Mercedes the max extent of it would be one DNF or a grid penalty, at this point that would only be a minor dent.

And let's not forget, Suzuka last year was arguably the nail in the coffin for Vettel when a £52 spark plug caused him to retire in lap 4, so a Ferrari reliability issue would more or less just wrap up the year.

As seen yesterday, its not just strategy, qualifying pace and race pace. Theres also Max Verstappen. :Frustrati

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajmat (Post 4474363)
Their strategy and operations are messed up. The last thing he wants to do is become an Alonso - great driver, wrong team!

Well! That's where Peter Bonnington will come into play. And it will take effort, surely!

Also, recall Alonso and Ferrari lost two titles by just a whisker in 2010 and 2012. Again with a car which was thereabouts! Clearly punching above its weight.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajmat (Post 4474363)
He's comfortable where he is. My bet is that he will stay with Mercedes, he is too well integrated with them and in a better position to fight Verstappen.

Yes, Lewis currently is. But then superiority in F1 is always like that. One will think that there is no stopping 'the champions' when a new combination comes and wipes the floor. Think of the all conquering teams from Ferrari, RedBull and now Mercedes in the recent past.

Not saying it is going to happen. :D But I won't be surprised if it does. From Ferrari's standpoint, why not? Lewis + Leclerc for the future!

And when a someone is operating at the highest level like Lewis is at the moment, its easier to convince them of a new challenge. And there is money and pride to go with it. Truck loads!

Edit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fullrevs (Post 4474387)
It is quite a possibility deetjohn, but most likely will happen in about 2 or 3 years from now. He is signed till 2020 at Mercedez right? If Lewis is going to win titles for the next couple of years then it is quite unlikely. The guy is what?....33 years old now??

Ferrari is desperate!! And this has to happen by next year if it does. And Lewis will be 34. Still in his prime I suppose.

Is breaking contract a big deal? Happens all the time in the world of football. Surely, there has to be a get out clause. And when one looks at the big football transfers these days, Lewis should feel like a bargain for Ferrari.

https://mobile.twitter.com/F1/status...93316169777152

"If I don't go for that gap and the gap was there, might as well stay at home", quips a frustrated Vettel. Well, he should have known when to go for the gap and when not to go; the race is not won only by being aggressive but should be shrewd enough to know when to attack and when to defend.

In the last 7 races, Lewis has scored 168 points of a possible 175 points and that is a telling stat and how he has tilted the WDC in his favour.

On the contrary, Vettel is keen on making mistakes and effectively put an end to his WDC aspirations.

Below link list out the mistakes of Vettel in 2018, where he could have avoided most of them.

https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12...el-and-ferrari

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jpcoolguy (Post 4473970)
Just a question, is Bottas not guilty of leaving the track similar to what Alonso and Stroll had done earlier? And no investigation and penalty for that?

Well, Max has indeed highlighted this point as seen in the video at the start of the below article. "Well, next time I will just do as what Valterri do like just cut the track and will not get 5 second penalty", he said.

http://www.espn.in/f1/story/_/id/249...d-suzuka-clash

Quote:

Originally Posted by deetjohn (Post 4474391)
Not saying it is going to happen. :D But I won't be surprised if it does. From Ferrari's standpoint, why not? Lewis + Leclerc for the future!

Next year may provide an answer, based on Leclerc's performance and see if he can do what Ricciardo had done to Vettel earlier in RBR. However, both Lewis and Vettel don't like an equivalent co-drivers (Nico and Ricky respectively) and are happy with the "wingman" Bottas and a run-my-own-race Kimi.

I feel Lewis may retire at the end of the 2020 campaign, whatever happens in these two years. I don't think he will move to Ferrari either, he will end his F1 career with Mercedes.

2021 will see the advent of new rules, new cars and anything may happen. Mercedes may be trumped by some other team in development. Plus, he will be two years older and may not want to retire in obscurity if things don't go their way.

He is already setting up an alternate life in music and fashion and may want to go out on a high.

Time will tell and we shall be around to witness history :)

Cheers

Quote:

Originally Posted by deetjohn (Post 4474391)
Ferrari is desperate!! And this has to happen by next year if it does. And Lewis will be 34. Still in his prime I suppose.

Is breaking contract a big deal? Happens all the time in the world of football. Surely, there has to be a get out clause. And when one looks at the big football transfers these days, Lewis should feel like a bargain for Ferrari.

I think we aren't giving Sebastien enough credit. The team has been on an incline since the two dud years with Alonso. I agree its highly frustrating to be a fan, get high hopes of winning and then for it all to crash due to immature sad decisions and strategy calls.

Ferrari seeking Hamilton for next year will be an outright Ferrari "bending the knee in front of him" scenario. Way too much pride within the Scuderia to do that. They fast tracked Schumachers resignation...remember that? Michael wanted to wait out till end of the year to extend to 2007 but it was a no-go for Jean Todt. Jean Todt was under so much pressure and in the end he managed to win it by 1 point and won the constructors because of "spy gate".

I think Ferrari will approach Hamilton only once his contract expires. Lewis probably doesn't see the promise of breaking his contract at the silver arrows and jumping ship to Ferrari right now.

I personally feel Lewis will wear Ferrari overalls before he leave F1.

So much talks about Lewis joining Ferrari, I completely disagree with any points linking him with Ferrari. He has been with Mercedes throughout his racing career.

I remember an interview where he was saying that he wants to go out as a Mercedes champion and wants to spend his post retirement days with the Mercedes fraternity.

Mercedes has been his home, I will never want to see him in a Ferrari livery.

Quote:

Originally Posted by deetjohn (Post 4474391)
Ferrari is desperate!! And this has to happen by next year if it does. And Lewis will be 34. Still in his prime I suppose.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpcoolguy (Post 4474483)
Next year may provide an answer, based on Leclerc's performance and see if he can do what Ricciardo had done to Vettel earlier in RBR. However, both Lewis and Vettel don't like an equivalent co-drivers (Nico and Ricky respectively) and are happy with the "wingman" Bottas and a run-my-own-race Kimi.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyborg (Post 4474503)
I feel Lewis may retire at the end of the 2020 campaign, whatever happens in these two years. I don't think he will move to Ferrari either, he will end his F1 career with Mercedes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fullrevs (Post 4474550)
Ferrari seeking Hamilton for next year will be an outright Ferrari "bending the knee in front of him" scenario. Way too much pride within the Scuderia to do that. They fast tracked Schumachers resignation...remember that? Michael wanted to wait out till end of the year to extend to 2007 but it was a no-go for Jean Todt. Jean Todt was under so much pressure and in the end he managed to win it by 1 point and won the constructors because of "spy gate".

I think Ferrari will approach Hamilton only once his contract expires. Lewis probably doesn't see the promise of breaking his contract at the silver arrows and jumping ship to Ferrari right now.

I personally feel Lewis will wear Ferrari overalls before he leave F1.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FURY_44 (Post 4474563)
So much talks about Lewis joining Ferrari, I completely disagree with any points linking him with Ferrari. He has been with Mercedes throughout his racing career.

I remember an interview where he was saying that he wants to go out as a Mercedes champion and wants to spend his post retirement days with the Mercedes fraternity.

Mercedes has been his home, I will never want to see him in a Ferrari livery.

I think it's too soon to speculate on Hamilton's move to Ferrari. It won't happen just because he might want to end his career in a certain team, he's smarter than that. If that was his only motivation he'd still be in McLaren, it's where he grew up.

I think it will depend on various factors such as whether Mercedes can still provide him with a championship winning car - which they have so far but it can change as soon as next year. the progress Ferrari made this year in terms of development was remarkable and they can have the edge next year.

Secondly, Leclerc and Sebastian's equation is crucial in deciding Vettel's future. There always remains an outside chance that Leclerc fairs better than Vettel in the Scarlet Scuderia and Vettel wants out, similar to what happened when Ricciardo outperformed him in their one year together at Red Bull. Leclerc and an empty seat in car number 1 could see Ferrari come knocking on Lewis' door whether he has a Mercedes contract or not.

Lastly, it would depend on how many Championships he has till then. This will be number 5, if he wins 2019 and 2020 he will have 6-7 titles, tying Schumacher's record. Will he want to go for an 8th with the team that has given him all the titles he have or make that move and take a gamble with Ferrari?

I think these are the things that will matter to him, and not the money or the desire to wear red overalls. And if none of that happens, as Cyborg said he's already set up an alternate life in fashion that takes up more of his time than his F1 schedule anyway!

Quote:

Originally Posted by deetjohn (Post 4474391)
Well! That's where Peter Bonnington will come into play. And it will take effort, surely!

Also, recall Alonso and Ferrari lost two titles by just a whisker in 2010 and 2012. Again with a car which was thereabouts! Clearly punching above its weight.


I think its forgotten that in 2010 Alonso came to Abudhabi with a 15 point lead over the eventual WDC , Vettel. Vettel was only 3rd in points behind his team mate Webber.

Only Ferrari could manage to squander such a situation.

Alonso managed to loose that lead to Vettel and the title , again because of the strategy calls from Ferrari . They wanted to cover the wrong driver and that let the title dreams vaporize painfully over 44 laps for Alonso.

Another Vettel incident. Ferrari is probably more frustrated than Vettel. Too many mistakes & incidents - Germany being the big one, Baku another. All of this making everyone believe that he can't seem to win from the back. Something all WDCs in recent history have done - except maybe Rosberg & Vettel. Rosberg to his credit won against Lewis, while Vettel had Webber, & he was the golden boy at RBR.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jraj (Post 4474704)
I think its forgotten that in 2010 Alonso came to Abudhabi with a 15 point lead over the eventual WDC , Vettel. Vettel was only 3rd in points behind his team mate Webber.

Only Ferrari could manage to squander such a situation.

Alonso managed to loose that lead to Vettel and the title , again because of the strategy calls from Ferrari . They wanted to cover the wrong driver and that let the title dreams vaporize painfully over 44 laps for Alonso.

That's not entirely true though.

True - they did pit to cover Webber, but he wasn't the 'wrong' driver per se, Vettel was some 8-10 points behind Webber and mathematically had less of a chance. Also both Webber and Alonso had to pit because of flat sports or clipping a corner or something of that sort (my memory fails me about which one it was), and they were stuck behind cars on older tyres that they couldn't overtake. Vettel sort of inherited the lead and subsequent championship because he could manage his tyres better. So yes, while it was a wrong time to bring Alonso in, I don't think they were wrong covering Webber instead of Vettel, or wrong in assuming that Alonso would overtake the cars that eventually held him up and cost him the title.

Also since its been brought up, I'm also pretty sure Ferrari used team orders at some point in the season to move Alonso ahead of Massa and give him the win. Again I don't remember which exact race it was, but it was somewhere in Europe. I think Silverstone or Germany.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Porcupine (Post 4474847)
Also since its been brought up, I'm also pretty sure Ferrari used team orders at some point in the season to move Alonso ahead of Massa and give him the win. Again I don't remember which exact race it was, but it was somewhere in Europe. I think Silverstone or Germany.

Germany - Hockenhiem I think. They sent a coded message - "Felipe, Fernando is faster than you. Do you understand?"

Well, the entire world understood lol:

I have been a Ferrari supporter this year. Not because I blindly love the team or anything. Got bored of seeing Mercedes winning quite easily over the last few years. So as a team who could stop their dominance, I started supporting Ferrari from last year.

First part of 2018 season looked quite promising as a Ferrari fan and looked like this time they would take at least the drivers title. But I am deeply disappointed now after seeing mistake after mistake being made by the team/drivers and making it too easy for Hamilton and Mercedes. :Frustrati

For some reason, I didn't like Hamilton until now. But looking at how he has driven this season and how Mercedes performed as a team is mind blowing.
Lewis didn't put a foot wrong on most occasions. Performance especially during pressure cooker situations were clinical. Slowly I have become a Lewis Hamilton fan just by seeing his consistency and how he performs flawlessly in high pressure situations. The way he could shut out everything, focus and perform race after race even after having lots of distractions with his music/fashion engagements is truly phenomenal.

The 2018 Singapore qualifying lap was just WOW.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Porcupine (Post 4474692)
I think it's too soon to speculate on Hamilton's move to Ferrari. It won't happen just because he might want to end his career in a certain team, he's smarter than that. If that was his only motivation he'd still be in McLaren, it's where he grew up.

I think it will depend on various factors such as whether Mercedes can still provide him with a championship winning car - which they have so far but it can change as soon as next year. the progress Ferrari made this year in terms of development was remarkable and they can have the edge next year.

Secondly, Leclerc and Sebastian's equation is crucial in deciding Vettel's future. There always remains an outside chance that Leclerc fairs better than Vettel in the Scarlet Scuderia and Vettel wants out, similar to what happened when Ricciardo outperformed him in their one year together at Red Bull. Leclerc and an empty seat in car number 1 could see Ferrari come knocking on Lewis' door whether he has a Mercedes contract or not.

Lastly, it would depend on how many Championships he has till then. This will be number 5, if he wins 2019 and 2020 he will have 6-7 titles, tying Schumacher's record. Will he want to go for an 8th with the team that has given him all the titles he have or make that move and take a gamble with Ferrari?

I think these are the things that will matter to him, and not the money or the desire to wear red overalls. And if none of that happens, as Cyborg said he's already set up an alternate life in fashion that takes up more of his time than his F1 schedule anyway!

It is nothing but speculation mate, but it is a well known fact that a lot of racing drivers would like to have some Ferrari work experience in their F1 CV. That doesn't go to say that LH will want to drive for the Italian team. On various occasions he's made it ample clear that he doesn't feel the need to drive a Ferrari before he quits the sport. So did Vettel and Alonso but things took quite a steep turn and they ended up there. That saying though, Lewis goes all out to ensure he gets to purchase a limited Ferrari. He bought 6 special Ferrari's so he could qualify to own a La Ferrari. :) It still doesn't mean he wants to drive a Ferrari F1 car but one can tell that he loves the brand. Road car or single seater racer.

In my view, Sebastien will want to emulate Schumacher and attempt to win many titles with them. He also seems to be the type to continue driving till he's 40. I also feel he'll have his work out with Leclerc as his team mate. It could possibly be a Daniel Ricciardo VS Vettel situation at Red Bull causing Seb to quit and this could be the opening for LH??? Just maybe?! LH on the other hand as you said will make it 6-7-maybe 8 titles and call it quits. Or he could even surprise everyone and quit at the end of his current contract with Mercedez. Not really caring about chasing anybody's record.

For Vettel, the sport and Ferrari are larger than him. For Lewis, he is larger than the sport and Mercedes. Thats the sort of mind-set I get from looking at their body language.

I will however say one thing. IMHO Hamilton does love the money, the cars, the girls, the celebrity status. Not a bad thing at all. Looking at his humble beginnings and how hard he's worked to get right up there. He deserves every moment in the sun.

Japanese Grand Prix: Race Highlights

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRTmuPOhaIA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fullrevs (Post 4475149)
For Vettel, the sport and Ferrari are larger than him. For Lewis, he is larger than the sport and Mercedes. Thats the sort of mind-set I get from looking at their body language.

That hits the nail on the head really. Love him or hate him, I think it's more widely accepted that this is the case, atlas off the track.

Quote:

I will however say one thing. IMHO Hamilton does love the money, the cars, the girls, the celebrity status. Not a bad thing at all. Looking at his humble beginnings and how hard he's worked to get right up there. He deserves every moment in the sun.
I think in the 2016 season, when Rosberg was about to win; Bernie made a statement along the line of because of Lewis' star power outside of F1 - hanging out with celebrities, attending mega-events, and his massive social media presence - him being the champion was better for the sport than Rosberg, because ultimately its its media and sports and that's what brings them into the limelight, and ultimately gets them more exposure.


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