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Old 30th September 2019, 16:11   #1
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Default McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

The McLaren F1 team will be using Mercedes-AMG engines in their race cars from 2021 till at least the end of 2024.

McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021-mclaren.jpg

McLaren last used Mercedes engines in 2014, before shifting to Honda engines in 2015. At present, the team uses Renault engines. In the 2019 season, Mercedes-AMG engines are used by the Mercedes works team, Racing Point and Williams F1.

McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021-00m206121080x805.jpg

McLaren used Mercedes engines from 1995 to 2014. During this period, the team won the World Constructors' Championship in 1998 with Mika Häkkinen and David Coulthard as its drivers. Mika Häkkinen also took the World Drivers' Championship in 1998 and 1999 with McLaren. Lewis Hamilton won the 2008 World Drivers' Championship with McLaren.

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Last edited by ChiragM : 30th September 2019 at 16:16.
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Old 1st October 2019, 02:41   #2
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

I can't make up my mind if this is a good decision. Mercedes has certainly dominated the modern V6 turbo era but their customer teams aren't doing too well. Williams is downright last and Racing Point is kinda hanging out at the back or middle (mostly back) of the midfield. Ironically, Mclaren with the Renault engine is performing better than the Renault F1 works team.

I guess we'll only know in 2021 if this was a good decision when the new rules take effect.
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Old 1st October 2019, 07:36   #3
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

Comes a full circle, huh? McLaren with its Mercedes engines was once one of my favourite teams (glory days of Hakkinen). But this also means that McLaren has accepted "no. 2" position at best. Mercedes will never let them win a championship with its engines.
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Old 1st October 2019, 12:08   #4
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

Renault went into the 2019 Formula 1 pre-season making bullish noises about its engine's progress. But if those claims prove hollow, it wouldn't be the first time in recent years that a hoped-for Renault breakthrough failed to materialize.

Honda also has made a lot of progress on their power unit this year, that they have even won GP's. For one, Renault are focused on trying to get their works team back to the front. The Renault engine is a step up on the Honda, but only marginally, and it’s reliability has been disappointing.

Mclaren has made significant gains on chassis side but Renault engine is letting them down. In many of the races we have seen all 4 Renault powered cars getting lapped which is unacceptable by a team like Mclaren.

An alliance with Ferrari was not on the cards, given they are a competitor on the road and unlikely to supply them anyway, so Mercedes was the best solution.

I think Mclaren made the right move by switching to Mercedes power from 2021. That gives McLaren and Mercedes a little under one-and-a-half years to get reacquainted with each other and plan for the 2021, something which is critical as that coincides with the dramatic new aerodynamic regulations set to be introduced into F1.
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Old 1st October 2019, 15:07   #5
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
But this also means that McLaren has accepted "no. 2" position at best. Mercedes will never let them win a championship with its engines.

If that were the case, the works Renault team would be doing much better than McLaren and would be 4th in the championship right now. McLaren, with the same Renault PU has managed to extract more from their car (because of tuning, aero etc) than Renault. Red Bull, a customer team finished 3rd in the championship last year with Renault's PU, again, ahead of the works Renault team.

Does Mercedes have control over what a customer team does with its engines?

Not quite, no. Mercedes supplies the exact same engine to Racing Point and Williams (The telemetry shows this); it's up to the customer teams like McLaren to make the most of it.

Let's be optimistic about this, after all, seeing a team like McLaren winning races again will be great for all of us!

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Old 3rd October 2019, 08:33   #6
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There are two scenarios that can become a reality in the long term, neither a good one for F1. One, possible exit of Renault from F1, beyond 2021. With just the works team running the Renault engines, and also the fact that the current engine is being carried over to the next era, I do not think Renault is going to be in a position to win a championship in F1. Very unlikely. Also, in terms of financial viability, being in F1 makes the least sense for Renault. What they do is to manufacture compact hatchbacks and cross overs in Europe. And they have never been firm with their F1 commitments. They left, came back, stayed only as an engine supplier, then finally got a works team. And have not made progress at all. Not even to the extent of matching up to the RBR Honda.

Second scenario, Mercedes leaves F1! I know its a distant possibility, but they have now won 6 championships, nothing much to prove. So they stay on as an engine supplier, but let McLaren be the front running Mercedes team like the 90s.

I wish neither happens, because F1 needs big manufacturers to stay. Mercedes, Ferrari, Renault and Honda need to be in F1. No other manufacturer like BMW, Ford or Toyota is ever going to come back. There was VW looking at F1 few years back, but now they have firmly made up their mind not to enter F1.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 11:44   #7
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Comes a full circle, huh? McLaren with its Mercedes engines was once one of my favourite teams (glory days of Hakkinen). But this also means that McLaren has accepted "no. 2" position at best. Mercedes will never let them win a championship with its engines.
Partly true, because considering the chassis aspect of the parternship, that is something that McLaren has always been superb at.
Even in 2019, with the Renault Engine, McLaren seems to perform better than the Renault Works Team. And in 2014 as well, even with the Mercedes Powertrain, they were on par, if not better than the Mecredes Works Team.

McLaren has always been let down by thier engines, unreliablity et all. And Mercedes is known for making reliable powertrains, read Hamilton's crazy streak of not having a breakdown, or Racing Point's and William's (barring the last to last weekend). Therefore, this to me seems like the best possible strategy that McLaren could adapt to see a future World Championship.
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Old 4th October 2019, 11:38   #8
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

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If that were the case, the works Renault team would be doing much better than McLaren and would be 4th in the championship right now.
No man. Renault isn't a championship winning team and hence, there is no contest between the two.

Mercedes however is the no.1 right now. There is no way they'll supply an engine to McLaren and have them beat itself in races. If & when McLaren become a challenge, the factory team will always have the superior / more powerful engines.

At least in the recent past, I cannot remember any season where the factory team was no.2 in the championship and its customer the 1st.
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Old 4th October 2019, 11:49   #9
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

If i may opine, probably Mercedes is looking for a second team much like Red Bull has Torro Rosso and Ferrari has Alfa Romeo. With the competition on the rise, they would need teams to act as barriers between them and the competitors. Considering Racing point and Williams are both not able to come close to the top tier teams these days and Mclaren on the rise recently, Mercedes sees this advantage out of this partnership.

There are multiple explanations floating around on why Zac Brown agreed to now be a customer team like Mclaren's resistance to share parts like Gearbox with Renault but we all know Mclaren under Ron Dennis would never have accepted this arrangement.

Then there is also this news about Lando Norris now being managed by Mercedes which is being touted as an arrangement by Lando's father who essentially brokered the deal between Mclaren and Mercedes.

The actual reason is something which would eventually come in open in future seasons, but i feel that Mercedes needed this to happen more than Mclaren and the current Mclaren was more than Happy to accept it.
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Old 4th October 2019, 12:14   #10
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

The Royal Pairing recovers.
This was the only way for them to go in search for the best engine. There was some talk on random F1 sites of a Ferrari pairing, but that would have been blasphemy!!!

So what do they need now?
1. Driver lineup. These are the guys brought the current dominator to F1. Do they have someone pumping up at Woking in a secret white walled lab, with a matrixy connector, saying "I know Kung-Baku-Fu"? A return of there being something in the air tonight, when the stars were bright.....Fernando?
2. Adrian Newey: Why is he not bored yet at RBR? Albeit, McLaren with its clinicality is not really a visit to the Appu Ghar, but surely Adrian must feel some longingness. No?
McLaren is making a fair bit of money nowadays. It’s definitely more than what they made in 98-00, or till 2014. Should help in getting the whole package together, wouldn’t it?
Let’s see what the ‘21 season brings out.

At Sochi, when that orange nose came up almost to get by Hamilton, I was shocked. A bit of joy too, but then thankfulness when it went right back. But it was mostly good.
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Old 6th October 2019, 11:32   #11
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Default Re: McLaren F1 to get Mercedes engines from 2021

Mercedes have announced that they will stop development of IC engines. I am wondering how that will tie into their future in F1. Why would they continue pouring money into this sport when they are looking into electrifying their entire lineup in the near future?

I feel many manufacturers are hoping for Formula E to become bigger and many will spend more on that. Mercedes has a team already. They will spend more there as the regulations are relaxed for teams to have more bespoke components in their cars.
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