F1 2009 : Turkish Grand Prix

petrohead · 26th May 2009, 11:28

By the time the Turkish Grand Prix was added to the Formula 1 calendar in 2005, the paddock’s initial enthusiasm for the modern Hermann Tilke-designed tracks was beginning to wane.

The feeling was that the new circuits’ mix of long wide straights, tight corners, and the odd flowing sequence was becoming too formulaic and predictable, and few expected any surprises from Istanbul.
So the new Turkish track was a breath of fresh air.

Varied, undulating, and packed with overtaking opportunities, it had a much more ‘natural’ feeling about it than the other new circuits, and instantly became a firm favourite with drivers.

The never-ending turn eight, a 150mph, multi-apex sweeper, is rightly regarded as the track’s highlight.

Kimi Raikkonen dominated the inaugural race in 2005, but was unimpressed to see his McLaren team-mate Juan Pablo Montoya hand second place to Raikkonen’s title rival Fernando Alonso after tangling with a backmarker.
Since then the Turkish GP has been all about Felipe Massa.

The Brazilian took his first pole and win at Istanbul Park in 2006, and repeated that performance at the circuit in both the next two years.
The 2008 race was his toughest Turkish challenge yet, but he managed to overcome Lewis Hamilton on strategy despite losing the lead to his McLaren rival early on.

muralisk · 26th May 2009, 11:36

From what I saw in Monaco, Ferrari did have better package compared the earlier races and hope they will improve their performance and topping the charts.

KRf1 · 26th May 2009, 17:29

Ferrari will be back in Turkey . Kimi seems to have rediscovered his 2007 form and the way Massa was sliding and pushing his car in Monaco he seems to be as fast as ever . Assuming Ferrari can do normal pitstops , this race could start the begning of the end of Brawn dominance . Fingers crossed .

topedgemonk · 26th May 2009, 19:14

The pic posted by petrohead shows a Fastest Lap time held by Kimi and a Lap Record held by Montoya. There is almost a 2 sec difference. Both seem to be referring to the times over the life span of the track and not just previous year.

Could somebody please throw some light on what is the difference between the two?

anachronix · 26th May 2009, 20:21

The Lap Record is basically the fastest time possible through the track. Possibly during the FPs or Qualifying or even during the race.

The fastest lap is what you see during a race!

ron_9191 · 26th May 2009, 22:53

I guess 2 seconds means 2 cylinders, coz as far as i can remember, JP Montoya did that lap on a V10 engine car and Kimi on a V8

akrish01 · 27th May 2009, 20:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by ron_9191

I guess 2 seconds means 2 cylinders, coz as far as i can remember, JP Montoya did that lap on a V10 engine car and Kimi on a V8

Yes, i too thought that was the reason.

im_srini · 27th May 2009, 21:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by ron_9191

I guess 2 seconds means 2 cylinders, coz as far as i can remember, JP Montoya did that lap on a V10 engine car and Kimi on a V8

Quote:

Originally Posted by akrish01

Yes, i too thought that was the reason.

Most lap records of the "traditional" circuits are held by cars from the 2004 season, specifically the F2004

In 2005, while the cars still had the V10 engines, tire-changes were banned during pit-stops resulting in much harder compounds & hence slower lap-times. The engines also had to be detuned a bit since they had to last 2 races.

The F2004 was a great car (winning 15 of 18 races ?) & Schumi made full use of it. I remember reading somewhere that the current A1GP cars from Ferrari are actually based on the F2004 !

Rocky_Balboa · 28th May 2009, 12:03

Ferrari gained almost a second at Monaco from Melbourne, but I wouldnt count on them to win the Turkish GP. Redbull and Toyota had a bad day in Monaco and sure would be back on top.

Stefano, Kimi and Massa already confirmed that the car is lacking downforce which didnt surface much in the streets of Monaco. But Turkey is a different game, and I would count Ferrari in the top three only and only if they bring the new floor and the triple decker.

Bubby · 28th May 2009, 12:09

When is D thing due for Ferraris???

The Ferraris will become a lot more quicker after the car eqipped with diffusors arrive.

anachronix · 28th May 2009, 12:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubby

When is D thing due for Ferraris???

The Ferraris will become a lot more quicker after the car eqipped with diffusors arrive.

Bubby, the diffusers are already there in the F60. Its a prototype version and I have been reading that the Full version of the DDD is coming in Turkey. New floor, KERS cooling upgrade and new gearbox casing is also on the cards. But there is no concrete source for this info.

Just got the info from another thread

petrohead · 28th May 2009, 12:26

Possible Developments:

McLaren: Fully New integrated DDD, some minor aero tweaks.
Ferarri: New rear suspension and fully integrated DDD. New Chassis for Felipe Massa.
BMW Sauber: Anything, it cant get any worse, can it??? In reality, DDD First version and a non-superconductor KERS, probably a lot more aero tweaks.
Renault: Lots of aero tweaks, and a new front suspension and front wing/nosecone. Updated KERS system.
Toyota: Finally putting all the tweaks from the last 3 races together and getting a cohesive package with them, and starting to hone it.
STR: Sticking plaster DDD as used by RBR at Monaco, and some other small aero tweaks. Possible running of the Ferrari KERS system on one car.
Red Bull: Full new rear end to incorporate fully integrated DDD and Pull Rod suspension.
Williams: General aero update.
Force India: General aero update, and same as Toyota, make package cohesive and hone it.
Branw GP: General aero update with some new mechanical updates.

The track has lots of overtaking opportunities, whitch i feel KERS will have lots of input on this track, but the DDD cars will have the aero advantage i feel.

Its a long track that requires a good overall aero balance for the slow parts at the end of sector 1 and 3, the fast corners in sector 2, and the high speed back straight that i can see cars doing 310kmph+. Also a good mechanical set-up is also requires as well, and bonding it well to the Aero set up to make the ultimate package, suits a more aggressive driving style as Massa has won here for the past 3 years, so Rubens should do well here as well.

Thats my rather long analogy of the race, at the moment.

Bubby · 28th May 2009, 12:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by anachronix

Bubby, the diffusers are already there in the F60. Its a prototype version and I have been reading that the Full version of the DDD is coming in Turkey. New floor, KERS cooling upgrade and new gearbox casing is also on the cards. But there is no concrete source for this info.

Just got the info from another thread

are gonna dissappear from current front runners soon.

Ferrari DDD is coming in Turkey.

Just cant wait to see Ferrari back at the top.

petrohead · 28th May 2009, 12:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubby

Just cant wait to see Ferrari back at the top.

Lets keep our fingers crossed.

But most probably its gonna be a Brawn massacre again! ( Unless Rubens hit Button on the back and both get sprung out of the track.

)

Bubby · 28th May 2009, 12:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by petrohead

Lets keep our fingers crossed.

But most probably its gonna be a Brawn massacre again! ( Unless Rubens hit Button on the back and both get sprung out of the track. )

And this is caused as Vettel bhai hits Rubens bhai from behind

A pile up of three cars

26th May 2009, 11:28	#1
petrohead BHPian Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bangalore Posts: 106 Thanked: 0 Times View My Garage	F1 2009 : Turkish Grand Prix By the time the Turkish Grand Prix was added to the Formula 1 calendar in 2005, the paddock’s initial enthusiasm for the modern Hermann Tilke-designed tracks was beginning to wane. The feeling was that the new circuits’ mix of long wide straights, tight corners, and the odd flowing sequence was becoming too formulaic and predictable, and few expected any surprises from Istanbul. So the new Turkish track was a breath of fresh air. Varied, undulating, and packed with overtaking opportunities, it had a much more ‘natural’ feeling about it than the other new circuits, and instantly became a firm favourite with drivers. The never-ending turn eight, a 150mph, multi-apex sweeper, is rightly regarded as the track’s highlight. Kimi Raikkonen dominated the inaugural race in 2005, but was unimpressed to see his McLaren team-mate Juan Pablo Montoya hand second place to Raikkonen’s title rival Fernando Alonso after tangling with a backmarker. Since then the Turkish GP has been all about Felipe Massa. The Brazilian took his first pole and win at Istanbul Park in 2006, and repeated that performance at the circuit in both the next two years. The 2008 race was his toughest Turkish challenge yet, but he managed to overcome Lewis Hamilton on strategy despite losing the lead to his McLaren rival early on.
	() Thanks

26th May 2009, 11:36	#2
muralisk BHPian Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Hyderabad, Bangalore Posts: 711 Thanked: 13 Times View My Garage	From what I saw in Monaco, Ferrari did have better package compared the earlier races and hope they will improve their performance and topping the charts.
	() Thanks

26th May 2009, 17:29	#3
KRf1 BHPian Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: NCR / BLR Posts: 339 Thanked: 3 Times	Ferrari will be back in Turkey . Kimi seems to have rediscovered his 2007 form and the way Massa was sliding and pushing his car in Monaco he seems to be as fast as ever . Assuming Ferrari can do normal pitstops , this race could start the begning of the end of Brawn dominance . Fingers crossed .
	() Thanks

26th May 2009, 19:14	#4
topedgemonk BHPian Join Date: May 2008 Location: TRV Posts: 66 Thanked: 9 Times	Fastest lap and lap record- difference? The pic posted by petrohead shows a Fastest Lap time held by Kimi and a Lap Record held by Montoya. There is almost a 2 sec difference. Both seem to be referring to the times over the life span of the track and not just previous year. Could somebody please throw some light on what is the difference between the two?
	() Thanks

26th May 2009, 20:21	#5
anachronix Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Madras Posts: 3,286 Thanked: 1,336 Times View My Garage	The Lap Record is basically the fastest time possible through the track. Possibly during the FPs or Qualifying or even during the race. The fastest lap is what you see during a race!
	() Thanks

26th May 2009, 22:53	#6
ron_9191 BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 388 Thanked: 294 Times	I guess 2 seconds means 2 cylinders, coz as far as i can remember, JP Montoya did that lap on a V10 engine car and Kimi on a V8
	() Thanks

28th May 2009, 12:03	#9
Rocky_Balboa BHPian Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Namma Bengalooru Posts: 676 Thanked: 358 Times View My Garage	Ferrari gained almost a second at Monaco from Melbourne, but I wouldnt count on them to win the Turkish GP. Redbull and Toyota had a bad day in Monaco and sure would be back on top. Stefano, Kimi and Massa already confirmed that the car is lacking downforce which didnt surface much in the streets of Monaco. But Turkey is a different game, and I would count Ferrari in the top three only and only if they bring the new floor and the triple decker.
	() Thanks

28th May 2009, 12:09	#10
Bubby BHPian Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: New Delhi Posts: 503 Thanked: 168 Times	When is D thing due for Ferraris??? The Ferraris will become a lot more quicker after the car eqipped with diffusors arrive.
	() Thanks

28th May 2009, 12:26	#12
petrohead BHPian Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bangalore Posts: 106 Thanked: 0 Times View My Garage	Possible Developments: McLaren: Fully New integrated DDD, some minor aero tweaks. Ferarri: New rear suspension and fully integrated DDD. New Chassis for Felipe Massa. BMW Sauber: Anything, it cant get any worse, can it??? In reality, DDD First version and a non-superconductor KERS, probably a lot more aero tweaks. Renault: Lots of aero tweaks, and a new front suspension and front wing/nosecone. Updated KERS system. Toyota: Finally putting all the tweaks from the last 3 races together and getting a cohesive package with them, and starting to hone it. STR: Sticking plaster DDD as used by RBR at Monaco, and some other small aero tweaks. Possible running of the Ferrari KERS system on one car. Red Bull: Full new rear end to incorporate fully integrated DDD and Pull Rod suspension. Williams: General aero update. Force India: General aero update, and same as Toyota, make package cohesive and hone it. Branw GP: General aero update with some new mechanical updates. The track has lots of overtaking opportunities, whitch i feel KERS will have lots of input on this track, but the DDD cars will have the aero advantage i feel. Its a long track that requires a good overall aero balance for the slow parts at the end of sector 1 and 3, the fast corners in sector 2, and the high speed back straight that i can see cars doing 310kmph+. Also a good mechanical set-up is also requires as well, and bonding it well to the Aero set up to make the ultimate package, suits a more aggressive driving style as Massa has won here for the past 3 years, so Rubens should do well here as well. Thats my rather long analogy of the race, at the moment.
	() Thanks