[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

Friends,

Need some urgent help here. The car is still at the A. S. S. They stick on to the point that all rubber parts are chargeable and he now says the suspension arm is damaged. But since my car had met with an accident once (after which the windshield, cross member etc had been changed) he says I'l have to pay for it. But I checked the entire accident repair bill and the suspension was untouched! And I've never had any uneven tyre wear or alignment issues thereafter. Do i still have to pay for that?

If the parts are mentioned in extended warranty book then why don't you show to the engineers there and get it repaired?!

Has the suspension arm had become bad suddenly? I mean when the car was given to MASS for service and they did the brake overhaul and etc, why was the suspension issue not reported to you? Why is being done at a later date?! Something is fishy here. Go there and get serious about the matter.

Originally Posted by limited-edition

#1. Accident do not count.
You must have fixed the car from maruti ASS itself, rite ? So it was their job to find out if the suspension bar was broken during the incident and get it changed under the insurance claim if needed.

They should have but. .

Originally Posted by limited-edition

My Guess, they are just trying to get some money out of you, stand your grounds and get parts replaced under warranty. If you can't, then pay the money now, and file a complaint in consumer court.

I agree to this but I don't think MASS is being fair here. I'd the pays that are a problem are mentioned in the extended warranty book then they jolly well replace it free of cost.

Anurag.

[freakmuzik]

Originally Posted by limited-edition

I am not very clear about your situation or history, these are just my thoughts.

#1. Accident do not count.
You must have fixed the car from maruti ASS itself, rite ? . So it was their job to find out if the suspension bar was broken during the incident and get it changed under the insurance claim if needed.

My Guess, they are just trying to get some money out of you, stand your grounds and get parts replaced under warranty. If you can't, then pay the money now, and file a complaint in consumer court.

Originally Posted by a4anurag

If the parts are mentioned in extended warranty book then why don't you show to the engineers there and get it repaired?!

Has the suspension arm had become bad suddenly? I mean when the car was given to MASS for service and they did the brake overhaul and etc, why was the suspension issue not reported to you? Why is being done at a later date?! Something is fishy here. Go there and get serious about the matter.



They should have but. .



I agree to this but I don't think MASS is being fair here. I'd the pays that are a problem are mentioned in the extended warranty book then they jolly well replace it free of cost.

Anurag.

Thanks a lot for your inputs. I got my car back, sans the suspension repair work being done.

I had told them specifically to not do any "extra" stuff as they usually do. I'l put down the contents of the bill:

Parts:

1) Filter Assy, OIL - Rs. 78.60
2) MGO Castrol 5W30 - 2.9 L - Rs. 815.54

Total - Rs. 894.14
with tax - Rs. 1023.79

Labour

1) ZA37L0 Pick up and drop - Rs. 120
2) ZE12L0 Paid Service (30k/50k/70k/..) - Rs. 960
3) ZA74Z0 Tech-2/ SDT parameters checking - Rs. 400
4) MK06R01 - CALP CYL SLIDEBSH OR DUST B.SID R7R - Rs. 350
5) Vehicle Wash - Rs. 0

Total - Rs. 1830
with tax - Rs. 2056.19

NET - Rs. 3080/-

I asked them not to do Wheel Balancing and alignment as I wish to do it myself. He first included a Pollution check and charged Rs. 120 more. But since I never asked him to do it and since I did the same very recently, I said I will not pay for that and he agreed.

I do not know what item (3) (seems like some diagnostics which I thought should be part of the charge for 30k Periodic service) and item (4).

Coming to the suspension issue, initially he told me that only the bush needs to be changed and when I asked why is it prematurely wearing, he said it's natural for all cars at around the 3 year time. It's later today that I was informed that the arm needs to be replaced. I called up their Engineer to talk about the warranty. He too started stating the same story saying since my car was repaired twice under insurance (one was a little major cost wise needing replacement of the windshield, front bumper and bonnet denting and cross member replacement as I mentioned earlier where as the second one was a minor dog hit by a driver for which the bumper was replaced) I will not be eligible for a warranty claim. But I told him what all was replaced and how these things are not anywhere related to the suspension itself and that it's been 1.5 years since the repair and till now nothing has shown up or has been mentioned by them. He kept on resisting and finally he said that "Sir, it maybe an external hit that caused the pin and some ball joint to crack n stuff".

The suspension issue came up very recently, maximum a month maybe and in the past two months my car was never put to any bad roads or poor conditions for sure! To our knowledge there has never been any hit or anything at all to cause such a damage. After sometime of arguing he started telling me that even a small stone could cause this! I stopped talking and said I'l call later. These guys just keep dodging around. The part hasn't arrived yet. I'm planning to mail their Customer care for sure.

My points are:

1) Initially, what they informed me was about a worn bush being the culprit
2) 2 days later, they say it's the suspension lower arm that's damaged and needs replacement. And while talking to the engineer he says the arm joints (some pin, ball joint) have cracked. If this is true, this should have been observed right on the day they inspected the suspension on Saturday and not 2 days later. Something fishy here.
3) The accident repair was done at a MASS
4) No issues were reported regarding the suspension either during the Accident repiar or during my 20k service
5) Even the accident repair bill was so damn high (around 35k) and I know it was an inflated bill but since the car was under warranty and almost everything was covered under insurance, I decided to opt for it.

I'm confused as to how to proceed further!

[ajaycv2k]

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

In our family, we have 3 Ritzs and 4 WagonRs, all doing fantastic job for their owners. Thats why I said, fix up your requirements and priorities first. Both are superb cars although Ritz is a better highway handler than WagonR. If budget is not a constraint, go for Ritz ZXi.

We have pretty much decided on going with the Wagon R....but somehow I feel the Ritz gives a better comfort. I would like to know if it worth going with the ABS variant of Wagon R. Please advice.

Thanks,
Ajay.

[BoneCollector]

Originally Posted by ajaycv2k

We have pretty much decided on going with the Wagon R....but somehow I feel the Ritz gives a better comfort. I would like to know if it worth going with the ABS variant of Wagon R. Please advice.

Thanks,
Ajay.

Definitely. I've experienced ABS on a few occasions and I'll tell you, it does help a lot. Dont think on the money part, think on the safety part. On the hindsight, I feel we should have gone for Ritz Zxi but then, at that time I was not aware of TeamBHP.

[ajaycv2k]

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

Definitely. I've experienced ABS on a few occasions and I'll tell you, it does help a lot. Dont think on the money part, think on the safety part. On the hindsight, I feel we should have gone for Ritz Zxi but then, at that time I was not aware of TeamBHP.

Ok Thanks. Is it an advantage to go with dark colour paint for the car over the lighter shades?

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

3) ZA74Z0 Tech-2/ SDT parameters checking - Rs. 400

Does your car have a problem pertaining to the ECU or some such stuff? Have you observed and warning lights flashing when the car was given to service? Was it mentioned by you on the job card?

I'm surprised that your charged for the parameter checking add it is a routine in the regular service and most not be charged. In my 1L+ kms clocking I gave never asked for this checking specifically but they have checked it themselves and not charged.

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

4) MK06R01 - CALP CYL SLIDEBSH OR DUST B.SID R7R - Rs. 350

I'm clueless on this but I feel it is:
'Caliper cylinder slide bush'. Will check and revert if I can get this part name.

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

I will not be eligible for a warranty claim.

Get another opinion from another MASS. I don't think a owner has restrictions for warranty claim if all the services and repairs are carried out at MASS.

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

He kept on resisting and finally he said that "Sir, it maybe an external hit that caused the pin and some ball joint to crack n stuff".

They are making it up. I don't this it is cranked so easily.

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

I'm planning to mail their Customer care for sure.

Please do so.

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

2) 2 days later, they say it's the suspension lower arm that's damaged and needs replacement. And while talking to the engineer he says the arm joints (some pin, ball joint) have cracked.

I'm sorry but please give that SA and your engineer a piece of mind and ask them to be practical. The parts manufactured by Maruti are made for India and is great roads. We keep hit potholes of all sizes and speed breakers so by the statement of your engine we all owners should keep replacing the joints extra.

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

If this is true, this should have been observed right on the day they inspected the suspension on Saturday and not 2 days later. Something fishy here.

Exactly my point. Very fishy. Get a second opinion. If this was the issue then it would have reflected on the car when you were driving to the ASC. But since you have not reported it when giving for service then the guys at MASS are making it up to earn money.

Do you remember the odometer reading when the car was given for service? Check for it after collecting the car after service. May be when the car was test driven it would have been man-handled and may be that part was damaged by them and they are trying to pass it on you.

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

4) No issues were reported regarding the suspension either during the Accident repiar or during my 20k service

Has this part been replaced or yet to be? If NO, then go the service centre and put your car on the ramp and with any other 'normal' WagonR. Check for the part condition in your car and that car. If it is OK then ask the service manager what this non-sense of replacement is.

Anurag.

[freakmuzik]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

Does your car have a problem pertaining to the ECU or some such stuff? Have you observed and warning lights flashing when the car was given to service? Was it mentioned by you on the job card?


I'm surprised that your charged for the parameter checking add it is a routine in the regular service and most not be charged. In my 1L+ kms clocking I gave never asked for this checking specifically but they have checked it themselves and not charged.

Nothing at all! Nothing was mentioned. I was thinking the same too.

I'm clueless on this but I feel it is:
'Caliper cylinder slide bush'. Will check and revert if I can get this part name.



Get another opinion from another MASS. I don't think a owner has restrictions for warranty claim if all the services and repairs are carried out at MASS.

They are making it up. I don't this it is cranked so easily.

Exactly! I don't ever think the parts are so flimsy. My nano has seen worser roads in the city and still it's running perfectly fine!

Please do so.



I'm sorry but please give that SA and your engineer a piece of mind and ask them to be practical. The parts manufactured by Maruti are made for India and is great roads. We keep hit potholes of all sizes and speed breakers so by the statement of your engine we all owners should keep replacing the joints extra.



Exactly my point. Very fishy. Get a second opinion. If this was the issue then it would have reflected on the car when you were driving to the ASC. But since you have not reported it when giving for service then the guys at MASS are making it up to earn money.

Do you remember the odometer reading when the car was given for service? Check for it after collecting the car after service. May be when the car was test driven it would have been man-handled and may be that part was damaged by them and they are trying to pass it on you.


Has this part been replaced or yet to be? If NO, then go the service centre and put your car on the ramp and with any other 'normal' WagonR. Check for the part condition in your car and that car. If it is OK then ask the service manager what this non-sense of replacement is.

Anurag.

I was away for a while so coulnd't update the thread. Really sorry. The SA hasn't called me back yet. I'm calling him tomorrow for sure. In the mean time I got a call from Popular Motors HO and I told them that the part hasn't arrived and about the warranty claims. They told me they'l call back but have not yet!

And the worser part:

1) Coolant is hovering at the "low" level.
2) Windshield washer was empty!

I just got damn angry looking at this! Isn't this the most simple routine check? Now should I start doubting whether they even changed the engine oil or not?
I'l update the thread as soon as I finish the talk tomorrow!

[freakmuzik]

So some little updates here.

I called the SA on 2nd November, but since he was on leave, I talked to another person and told him the details and asked him to call me back after checking whether the spare has arrived. He didn't call me all these 2 weeks and even after telling him, he didn't call me back. Then I called the spare parts division myself and got to know that the spare has arrived. That means, these guys never bother to call.

I had received a call from Popular Motors HO a week back (I think I mentioned it earlier).I had told them all these issues and even they did not call back later.

And on 2nd November, seeing no response to the mail I sent to the Maruti Customer Care, I called up their toll free number and registered a complaint and explained everything in detail. The lady who i was talking to noted down everything patiently and clearly and immediately lodged a complaint. It was one LONG phone call though! So today, I got a mail from Popular Motors HO stating they received the mail and apologizing for the issues. Got a call from the same Customer Care executive of Popular who mailed me. He told me that the issue has been noted and has been forwarded to the Engineer and some other people and told me to expect a call regarding it tomorrow.

In the mean time, I'm taking my car to a local mechanic whom I know to check the suspension and get a clear idea. Hope that will help.

[freakmuzik]

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

So some little updates here.

I called the SA on 2nd November, but since he was on leave, I talked to another person and told him the details and asked him to call me back after checking whether the spare has arrived. He didn't call me all these 2 weeks and even after telling him, he didn't call me back. Then I called the spare parts division myself and got to know that the spare has arrived. That means, these guys never bother to call.

I had received a call from Popular Motors HO a week back (I think I mentioned it earlier).I had told them all these issues and even they did not call back later.

And on 2nd November, seeing no response to the mail I sent to the Maruti Customer Care, I called up their toll free number and registered a complaint and explained everything in detail. The lady who i was talking to noted down everything patiently and clearly and immediately lodged a complaint. It was one LONG phone call though! So today, I got a mail from Popular Motors HO stating they received the mail and apologizing for the issues. Got a call from the same Customer Care executive of Popular who mailed me. He told me that the issue has been noted and has been forwarded to the Engineer and some other people and told me to expect a call regarding it tomorrow.

In the mean time, I'm taking my car to a local mechanic whom I know to check the suspension and get a clear idea. Hope that will help.

Guys,

A positive update. Today, I got the car checked by our trusted mechanic. There is no sign of any hit nor has the arm broken. The issue is that, the ball joint at the end of the arm has worn and that's what is making the suspension noisy and not function properly! So all these days, the stories about the under-body hit and the arm being broken is all utter nonsense. I realised the level of trust i can keep on the A. S. S.

Also, got a call from the Popular Customer Care manager today asking me to bring the vehicle to their A. S. S for discussion with the engineer and for the replacement. When asked about the warranty, he said we'l check about it tomorrow.

I called the old S.A to again confirm the part and he told me that it has arrived. Just for the sake of knowing, I asked him again what the issue was with the suspension. He told me that some joint has "worn" out. I asked him again whether it's worn over time and he said "yes"!

So, I again asked him whether he remembers what he had told me 2 weeks back, and he said no. I narrated the whole thing and he started blabbering and told me something else also has been cracked and crap and crap .
Thanks a lot @a4anurag and @limited-edition for your valuable inputs!!
So I'm sure footed now. Will take the car tomorrow and hopefully that's the end of the war!

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

A positive update. Today, I got the car checked by our trusted mechanic.

Good news, I am happy as the root cause is found.

Had the car not been under warranty you could have bought the part Over-the-Counter and replaced it at your mechanic's garage rather than going to MASS and wastig money and time.

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

There is no sign of any hit nor has the arm broken. The issue is that, the ball joint at the end of the arm has worn and that's what is making the suspension noisy and not function properly!

How was it diagnosed?

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

Also, got a call from the Popular Customer Care manager today asking me to bring the vehicle to their A. S. S for discussion with the engineer and for the replacement. When asked about the warranty, he said we'l check about it tomorrow.

Is this call for the ball joint replacement or are MASS still trying to find the source of the problem?

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

So I'm sure footed now. Will take the car tomorrow and hopefully that's the end of the war!

All the best and please update as soon as the part is replaced with the details.

Anurag.

[freakmuzik]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

Good news, I am happy as the root cause is found.

Had the car not been under warranty you could have bought the part Over-the-Counter and replaced it at your mechanic's garage rather than going to MASS and wastig money and time.



How was it diagnosed?



Is this call for the ball joint replacement or are MASS still trying to find the source of the problem?



All the best and please update as soon as the part is replaced with the details.

Anurag.

1) Yes. Was thinking the same. If it was not under warranty, could have easily fixed it in the workshop itself.

2) The Diagnosing part - The mechanic removed the wheel and checked the suspension movement. There was no sign of damage on the arm or any other part. But the rubber boot covering the ball joint is torn and the action of the ball joint wasn't working properly, hence making the noise. So that's due to the wear of the ball joint according to the mechanic.

3) MASS is stating that the ball joint and the rubber boot and the arm come together as a single part. Hence replacement would be the whole arm.

Todays update:

I went to the A. S. S at 9.45 and as directed by the Customer Care manager, I contacted Mr. Arun, Service Engineer of Popular. He was the same engineer to whom I had talked on 21st october. He didn't know that I had complained to Maruti and stuff. So I explained the whole thing, how they were dodging with words and about not topping up the Coolant and Windshield washer and everything. He said he'l check the suspension again. I requested him to call me when they put the car on ramp as I wanted to check it myself and discuss. So once they put the car on ramp, a few engineers came and took pics of the suspension. Later they called me and on inspection, I observed the following.

1) The rubber boot (the rubber part covering the ball joint) and the ball joint comes above the arm and within the wheel. So it's not something that gets damaged easily by an external hit.

2) The inner area of the rubber boot (area away from the front) was torn vertically. They say its due to an external hit and the ball joint got damaged due to dust settling in.

3) I checked the Front Right suspension and there was some wear in that too. Very minor though. They were stating that these components do not get worn at all. When i pointed this out, they said that must also be due to an external hit.

3) I defended completely and inspected another wagon-r in the yard and showed them the same pattern of wear as on ma R-suspension. They went mum. Later I told them that such a part has very less chances to get damaged by an external hit. And, since the boot gets compressed and expanded everytime the suspension moves, this is something of a natural wear or could have happened due to an inferior rubber quality. He couldn't say a NO.

4) Later he stated that it could have happened due to an offroading attempt or multiple accident damage and crap and crap and crap. I asked him to show me any indication of that on the underbody. My car's underbody was neat with no hit marks anywhere! He went mum again. He said he can only consider this as an external hit and will forward it like that to Maruti. I said fine, and took the pics and told him I will do what I can from my side. I told him that I don't mind paying for the rubber boot since they say its a rubber part. But noway am I going to pay for the arm. He said he'l contact me asap. They topped up the coolant and the windshield washer.

On the 30k bill, there was one item named "SDT - 2 parameters check" which I had posted a few weeks back. I asked him what that was and he said it's a parameter check done to know the engine status and stuff and its done on almost all vehicles coming for service. I asked him whether its mentioned in the 30k service particulars but he repeated the same. I told him its no where mentioned in the service booklets nor in the bills of other Maruti owners, to which his answer was that we're more advanced in regard to the equipment and that's why its being done. I told him to stop blabbering. I never mentioned him to do such a check nor was it informed to me before being done. And its not been mentioned anywhere in the service schedule either. So demanded a refund of the amount to which he obliged.

Its not only the matter of 400 rupees here but the way these people loot customers is saddening.

attaching the pics of the suspension arm.


This is the rear of the front left suspension rubber boot that covers the ball joint. You can notice the vertical tear.


The front (road facing) part of the same rubber boot where there's no hint of damage.


Front right suspension arm rubber boots - except for minor wear (they say these parts don't wear off) i couldn't find anything.




This is the condition of road to their service station for over 1.5 km. This is the worst road I've driven through. So for the last two services, i had used their pick up and drop facility. I asked him whether, in case if it was an external hit, it could have caused when the driver of the ASS was testing the vehicle or while ferrying the vehicle to and from the A. S. S. He agreed.

[freakmuzik]

Guys, it's time to change the tires as one tyre just got torn due to some issue. The two options that I have right now are MRF ZV2K and Goodyear GT3 (both 155/65 R14). I had been using the GT3 till date and it was fine. How is MRF? Since I frequently drive in the bad roads of Kerala, I strictly prefer a more reliable option. Plus since the GT3 was torn, I am a little skeptical about GT3. I hope to change them today. Hope someone could help. Thanks in advance .

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

Guys, it's time to change the tires as one tyre just got torn due to some issue. The two options that I have right now are MRF ZV2K and Goodyear GT3 (both 155/65 R14).

In the two choices it is MRF bit why don't you look at Bridgestone?

They are reliable too and last long.

Anurag.

[freakmuzik]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

In the two choices it is MRF bit why don't you look at Bridgestone?

They are reliable too and last long.

Anurag.

Bridgestones don't come in that size. I'm not so keen of upgrading the tyres since it'l cost a bomb to upgrade the wheels to. The stock size comes only from Apollo (generally pretty bad opinion? ), MRF and Goodyear

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by freakmuzik

Bridgestones don't come in that size. I'm not so keen of upgrading the tyres since it'l cost a bomb to upgrade the wheels to. The stock size comes only from Apollo (generally pretty bad opinion? ), MRF and Goodyear

Apollo's are noisiest if I am not wrong and if the choices are between MRF and Goodyears, I still stand on my choice of MRF.

Are you sure the tyres that you mentioned in your earlier post are not available in Bridgestones?

Have a look at the below screen shots:





The website says in 155/65 R14 - Turanza AR20 is there!

Anurag.