[skdking]

Originally Posted by sumeethaldankar

....

Meanwhile still sitting on the fence whether to fix the CNG or not even at today's fuel prices heart does not want to go back to run the Civic on the alternate fuel. .......

Dear Sumeet,

Heartiest Congratulations on this landmark occasion. Wish you many many more miles.

Also, are you not on CNG?

When and why did the switch back to petrol happen?

Sorry to have missed your switch back related posts.

[sumeethaldankar]

Originally Posted by skdking

Dear Sumeet,

Heartiest Congratulations on this landmark occasion. Wish you many many more miles.

Also, are you not on CNG?

When and why did the switch back to petrol happen?

Sorry to have missed your switch back related posts.

Thanks, The CNG kit has been kaput for the last 3 - 4 months. Running on Petrol as of now. The kit is still installed in the car.

[sumeethaldankar]

Had given the car to Honda for a brake and a clutch oil change. Both the oils had become dirty and warranted a change. Also got a inspection of the mounts done and Honda came back saying that the main front mount had become weak *again*. I guess even the re-designed mount is no good.

The total bill came to ~ 1200 Rs. I have seen a improvement in the brake feel. Earlier the brakes felt a bit weak but the pedal feel has improved significantly. The pads were inspected and were found to be adequate and did not need a change. Meanwhile I am exploring after market mounts instead of Honda's 10k wallet eater since it did not last as much as it was expected.

Edit: Also got the throttle body cleaned and idle learning done via the HDS scan. The car was having idle issues especially while coming to a stop which has been resolved now.

After the clutch and brake oil I observed significant improvement in the clutch and brake pedal feel. Didn't know such a simple and cheap job could prove so effective in improving the driving factor.

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by sumeethaldankar

After the clutch and brake oil I observed significant improvement in the clutch and brake pedal feel. Didn't know such a simple and cheap job could prove so effective in improving the driving factor.

My experience mirrors yours. My car went through its first brake fluid change when it was about 5-6 years old, luckily Pune has low humidity except in the monsoons. Nevertheless the difference in clutch and brake feel was noticeable immediately. IMO changing the brake/clutch fluid every 3-4 years is a good practice for Pune weather. For more humid climes it may require more frequent replacement. The last thing one needs is rusting or moisture in the brake system.

My car will have the same service done during its annual service later this month or next.

[saket77]

Originally Posted by sumeethaldankar

Had given the car to Honda for a brake and a clutch oil change. Both the oils had become dirty and warranted a change.

The total bill came to ~ 1200 Rs. I have seen a improvement in the brake feel. Earlier the brakes felt a bit weak but the pedal feel has improved significantly. The pads were inspected and were found to be adequate and did not need a change. Meanwhile I am exploring after market mounts instead of Honda's 10k wallet eater since it did not last as much as it was expected.

Originally Posted by R2D2

IMO changing the brake/clutch fluid every 3-4 years is a good practice for Pune weather. For more humid climes it may require more frequent replacement. The last thing one needs is rusting or moisture in the brake system.

My Civic had the clutch and brake fluid changed last month. Received an identical bill amount.

What I must add is that I had gotten that changed after more than 3 years. Although the oil looked clean in the brake/ clutch oil reservoir in the top, but it wasn't so inside. This we got to know when they pumped the clutch pedal while bleeding it. During pumping the same, the clutch pedal sank completely and refused to come up. We suspected a jammed clutch master cylinder and it was taken out. After opening it completely, a lot of brown muck came out; nothing like the clear fluid that was in the reservoir. It had rusted the metal spring inside and the spring had broken from 2-3 points; reason for clutch pedal not returning back.

A new master cylinder costs Rs. 6K at Honda, they arranged a spring and charged Rs. 1500/- for the same. Lesson learnt, changed the fluid in every 2 to 2.5 years.

Regards,
Saket.

[R2D2]

@saket77, your experience just proves one thing - we car owners should worry more about what can't see than what we can see. There are so many parts in a car that aren't visible but those parts experience wear & tear or even corrosion as you experienced with the spring in the clutch MC.

Observing (or exceeding) manufacturer recommended maintenance schedules is a sure way to extend the life of those parts and experience trouble free service.

[sumeethaldankar]

My Civics clutch was juddering intensely in rear and first at slow parking speeds. I could also feel I can’t describe in rights words but say at 5th gear at 1.5 to 1.9k rpm I will feel the car will struggle to accelerate a bit on a smooth straight road. I believe this is a symptom of the clutch slipping and that the flywheel was on its way out as well since it was juddering at lower gears so I decided to do away with both.

Bought the clutch and flywheel from a local parts shop after Honda informed me that they will be draining my bank account of around 30k if I wanted their genuine parts and service. (15k for the flywheel and rest for clutch plate and labor). Got a quote of around 6.8k from my parts shop just for the flywheel and 4.3k for the Daikan clutch plate and 900 for the release bearing. I placed the order in the morning and the shop delivered around 3 PM the new flywheel and plate. These things are heavy and in case anyone wants to go shopping for these make sure to get a vehicle with you for transport. Definitely not something you can just go to a shop with a carry bag and buy.


Gave the car to Devabhai on sat and got it back yesterday. He charged 3.5k for the overhaul. Decent work done by his guys. The Clutch feels extremely light, the shuddering has disappeared though I can feel a mild tremble. I have only driven the car for 20 kms after the change and will report any further observations. I got the work done at half price at what it would have cost at Honda. Pai motor extorted 13.2 for just the overhaul. I remember going back to the owner few days after the overhaul was done back then with the shuddering problem. He turned his back on me after saying it will go away after 500km of driving which it didn’t and today I ended up replacing the stuff he had put in all over again.


I wonder how long I can continue with this car. I have replaced/fixed many stuff twice in the last 6 years and 60k + kms that I have done on this car. Considering it’s a used one I hope this is normal.
Mount – Replaced 2 (And the second one is on its way out)
Front Suspension –Overhauled twice (Only the struts remain of the first overhaul)
Rack & PS – Repaired twice. The real chink in the armor. My long term holding on the Civic depends on these components. Such critical parts should not need so much attention.
Tyres- Replaced twice. First the Turanza ER60 oversized and now the T001 running stock size.
Clutch – Twice now
A/C Cooling coil – Now on the second one.
I really hope this stop as I am getting more and more inclined at letting the Civic go if such issues keep happening again and again.

The items came packed as below.






The Clutch components. Made in Japan Daikan Exedy






The Release bearing. Nachi Japan.



The new flywheel. OE Honda (as per parts shop owner)




The old clutch and flywheel. As per my garage guy CNG puts extra stress on the clutch components etc as it runs more hotter than normal petrol and leads to more wear and tear. One more reason not to run the car on CNG.




The flywheel had marks on its side.

[kunal_kaushal]

Originally Posted by sumeethaldankar

I really hope this stop as I am getting more and more inclined at letting the Civic go if such issues keep happening again and again.

Hi Sumeet

I really hope that this is the last time you are getting it changed in your ownership of Independence.

Maintenance cost going through the roof coupled with the unprofessional and unethical behaviour at HASS were the only reasons I had to let go my priced possession. :(

Regards
Kunal

[sumeethaldankar]

After the clutch overhaul I was feeling the steering had become a bit heavy especially at the right turn. Now Deva’s mechanic had poured in an 3 year old power steering oil which was lying in my car and which was kept for emergency purposes. He had confirmed with me so he was not to blame here. While driving to office the next day the steering definitely felt heavier on turns though it will be on and off. At times it would feel ok and at time at turns it would feel a bit stiff.


Decide to troubleshoot step by step. First checked for any leakage and drop in the oil levels of the PS reservoir. There was none for 2 days. Once it was more or less confirmed that there is no major leakage Off the car went on the third day for wheel balancing and alignment to rule out that issue. The alignment guys came back saying that there is nothing wrong with the alignment as such but they also felt that the steering feels heavier while turning and that I should show it to the mechanic. Meanwhile I had informed Deva of the issue who asked to bring the car to him. But before I did that I wanted to replace the ageing PS oil that was used so sent the car to Honda for a PS fluid flush.


Honda mentioned that they will do the job requested but that such an issue usually means the rack needs an overhaul. Got the car back from Honda today and again I felt the same that the steering is becoming heavier on right turns. So it means I will probably have to overhaul after again confirming with Deva. For now I will be leaving it as it is. I am in no mood to spend more money on this car except fuel so I will see later when the rack should go for its third overhaul.

[skdking]

Originally Posted by sumeethaldankar

....


I wonder how long I can continue with this car. I have replaced/fixed many stuff twice in the last 6 years and 60k + kms that I have done on this car. Considering it’s a used one I hope this is normal.
......

Sumeet bhai,

Lagey raho.

You are an inspiration.

[sumeethaldankar]

So my car had to bear the brunt of a moron who decided to imprint someone’s name on my car. (More details here) Tried to get it off by using a rubbing compound “3M IA110109286 Finesse It” which was advised by Bhpian LeoShashi. He was guiding me on Wats App while I tried to rub out the marks but Shashi noticed that the compound was not helping and the primer was coming off. We decided to abandon the task. I showed the car to 3M guys who quoted 6.5k for a paint job stating that the scratches would not go and would need a repaint. Also showed it to MotoShine in Andheri listed on T-BHP directory they also said that the scratches are too deep and might not go after polishing. They quoted 6.7k for a full exterior detailing.

Finally decided to get the car painted from one guy from whom I had done a paint job earlier when my Civic had a run in with a truck back in 2012. I also decided to get the ugly dent on the same boot panel which was left by a wonderful Innova driver who failed to stop in time in Oct last year. I was quoted 2.5k for the entire paint and removing of dent. I was happy that I was getting 2 jobs done at such a reasonable low cost. Maybe the scratches were a blessing in disguise but vandalism is vandalism.

When I got the car back from the painter its check engine light was on. Someone may have double cranked the car while it was running as the CEL was on when I had bought the car on its first day since I had accidently cranked it while in traffic. The light had vanished after some time previously but this time it stayed on. So off the car went to Honda for a diagnosis who then later came back saying that there is nothing wrong as such and there is no error code. The advisor said that sometimes the oxygen sensor can throw a CEL due to a loose connection etc but there was nothing to worry about. Also got the service without oil change done for 2.5k. The car is back to its normal self now touchwood.


The Check engine light decided to light up.




While I was there at the showroom at Honda decided to check out the new City (was a bit frustrated with all my Civics problems). The City seems to be on-road 14 big ones for the more decent specs but seemed a tad smaller in size (which it is) than my Civic. Frankly don’t have the heart to downgrade and neither do I have so much moolah for a car now. I should be frank and say that I did flirt with thoughts of buying a new car whenever the Civic troubles me…but there are few cars which excite so much. The other day I was thinking of my 800. It was basically an economy car and I had tried to modify it for performance viz an air intake and a free flow exhaust all with alloy wheels and an after-market steering etc. Here I have now a fairly fast sedan enough for my enthusiasts needs and I had modified it to give economy while driving ie the CNG (which is still kaput). Also the 800 which is primarily a city car was driven more on the Mumbai-Goa highway (11 times at least) while the Civic which was bought to do such runs ended up being driven in inter city and I have only managed to go as far as Pune once and Lonavla on 3 occasions. Life is sure is funny.

[saket77]

Sumeet, if the Civic has become troublesome, why not sell the same and get another Civic!!??
Surely, any C segment sedan will feel like a downgrade after the civic. You may get more bells and whistles in newer cars but that build quality, 1.8ltr gem, safety, space and even looks will be hard to match. The new Altis is there but that will cost quite a bit.

If I were you, I might have been looking to sell the one you have and get another Civic only as it is largely a trouble free car. For some reason, yours seem to run into problems more than the average.

Regards,
Saket.

[skdking]

Sumeet,

Civic is a gem, man.

Even when you let your current Civic go, you must buy another Civic.

The pre-worshipped market has scores of mouth watering deals.

Best wishes.

Originally Posted by sumeethaldankar

So my car had to bear the brunt of a moron who decided to imprint someone’s name on my car. (More details here) Tried to get it off by using a rubbing compound “3M IA110109286 Finesse It” which was advised by Bhpian LeoShashi. He was guiding me on Wats App while I tried to rub out the marks but Shashi noticed that the compound was not helping and the primer was coming off. We decided to abandon the task. I showed the car to 3M guys who quoted 6.5k for a paint job stating that the scratches would not go and would need a repaint. Also showed it to MotoShine in Andheri listed on T-BHP directory they also said that the scratches are too deep and might not go after polishing. They quoted 6.7k for a full exterior detailing.

Finally decided to get the car painted from one guy from whom I had done a paint job earlier when my Civic had a run in with a truck back in 2012. I also decided to get the ugly dent on the same boot panel which was left by a wonderful Innova driver who failed to stop in time in Oct last year. I was quoted 2.5k for the entire paint and removing of dent. I was happy that I was getting 2 jobs done at such a reasonable low cost. Maybe the scratches were a blessing in disguise but vandalism is vandalism.

.....

How much was repainted? That's a good deal.

[sumeethaldankar]

So I had to overhaul the pump again, the third time. The pump was leaking from a different area this time and my mechanic initially thought it was the engine oil after closer under body inspection deduced it was the pump. It cost only ~3.7k for the overhaul, 1800 for the pump overhaul, 1500 for labor and remaining for oil and a kaput headlight. Incidentally I had to visit twice to my mechanic’s place as the pulley was not fitted properly and the pump started to make noise whenever the steering was turned even a bit. Deva fixed the same on the second visit and touch wood now the pump is working fine.

The engine check light issue is haunting me for the past 1.5 months. Last week too when the car was at Deva’s garage the light came on. Deva said it’s most probably due to removal of the air intake that the light must have come on. He disconnected the battery for 15 mins and reconnected and the light went away. As mentioned in the civics’ bible thread Honda wanted to change the entire throttle body. The error code was P2135 which was related to high voltage fluctuation to the throttle position sensor. I did some researched online including the bible thread and found the post by Bhpian “car_crazy1400” too had a similar issue. I promptly called my service advisor and requested him to change the relay. They replaced the part and deleted the code and so far apart from the Deva bhai incident the check engine light has not occurred, touch wood.

A few observations on my part which probably led to the check engine light as per me.

1. I was running 4 yes 4 devices on the single 12v Jack using a generic splitter. 2 Dash cams, 1 Garmin GPS and 1 Tantra Bluetooth device. The thing with the Tantra was that accidently the stereo volume needed to be turned up loud till say around 40 for decent output of the sound. The sound at 40 seems high but the loudness was normal and not deafening. What this meant was it put load on the electrical system since the volume was set so high. I remember there used be a humming sound when I used to switch on the lights and I reported same to Honda but they did not come back with anything. I have now removed all devices except one dashcam which is currently in place. I think the Tantra thing was probably caused the high voltage condition but I am not sure and this is just a guess.

2. I was parking the car in dusty condition earlier. When the first time the check engine light came on the car was at the painter’s place getting repaired for the scratches and a dent. It was parked overnight in a dusty place. At that time Honda said it was the oxygen sensor, deleted the code and gave the car back. At my office place due to easier parking I was parking the car outside the stilt parking which faced a boundary wall covered with trees and plants. In the evening I found the front covered with dust and one of those days driving back I found the check engine light coming on. Even Deva’s parking is in dusty condition. The dust might be affecting the Mass air flow sensor which could also trigger the check engine light. I now park in better places inside the office stilt parking slot.

3. My third guess it was actually the faulty relay which caused the light. In the cases for the oxygen sensor and at Deva bhai’s place where the light was on the car did not behave erratically and drove normal except for the glow on the dashboard.

So based on my observations I still cannot conclude the root cause. Honda wanted to replace the throttle body and also suspected the engine wiring harness. But google and Team bhp saved me from shelling out 40k for a new throttle body. Again Honda is not really to be trusted with their diagnosis and it is best to take a second opinion in case the bill is expected to be huge. I have told my mechanic Deva that in case the light comes backup (I hope it doesn’t) I will be getting the car to him. Meanwhile I have switched back to Honda synthetic oil for now since it was working out cheaper. Maybe I will shift to Liqui Moly again next time.

The Pump leakage this time was at the bottom.


The Relay replaced.


The car would behave like this for the voltage related issue.

http://youtu.be/126IXluEHG8

Bhpian car crazy1400 took had a similar issue. I thank him profusely for this post.

Originally Posted by car_crazy1400

My civics dash started to show the orange fuel injection sign & revvs started at 1500 and refused to come down.

Tried revving it but it won't go beyond 2000rpm.

Tried restarting and it went normal but with the same orange light glowing.

Took it to FNG, got scanner plugged in. It detected a fault with throttle position sensor relay.

Got relay changed just now and looks fine till now.

Paid rs 500 for scanning & 180 for the replacement relay.

Can any one help with the cost for changing all 4 shockers on the civic. My suspension has gone hard and i intend to change these before changing the tires.


My Neighborhood garage quoted 6600 each for front o.e. Shocker from Honda. Imported ones TRW (IIRC) were at 3300 each.

Any help would be very welcome.

Thanks

Rishi

[sumeethaldankar]

So back on CNG after a hiatus of 306 days as per my App. Do we have any choice these days with the ever increasing fuel prices. I was running into a bill of 10k a month just for petrol and had enough of it. I went to Lovato authorized CNG fitter in Ghatkopar this time. Have no intention of allowing the original installer to touch the car again. I was in and out of the service center in 40 mins.

I told them the car was not running on CNG for around 8-10 months. They connected the car to the computer and re-calibrated the CNG ECU. Rest nothing else touchwood was needed to be done. Was charged 500 bucks and asked them whether they are not going to do a test run. They said no and were pretty confident in their job only I know my car better. She runs fine in the morning now and there are no major jerks while driving but the issue where she stalls and shuts off in CNG after a heavy bout of traffic in the evening still remains. Might visit Lovato guys again with the problem and see if they have a solution to same.

Mileage seems to back to 19-20 kms per KG and I am quite relieved to see the fuel gauge move slowly down now. During the last few weeks I was driving the car in absolute eco mode at max 1500 rpm and speeds around 55 to 60 kmph max. This was really getting on my nerves even though the car was still delivering around 13 kms to the litre in average Mumbai traffic which is quite good. But I was having zero driving pleasure and found it was at times bit unsafe as most vehicles were overtaking me leaving me struggling to keep the car in the economic rpm range. Finally had enough and decided to get the CNG fixed.

Below are some random pics.





Was keeping AC at min temp to reduce fuel consumption.