Honda City Vtec-20000 km report - updated to 61500km

Rudra Sen · 26th July 2005, 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajmat

I don't know if you noticed the bling mobile blasting on your tail. It could match you upto 30 km/h and then the vtec starts its heavy breathing

So now you know why I'm saying highways calling. I know what you mean by heavy breathing but I need to see that on an open space.

Mpower · 27th July 2005, 21:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajmat

Then fit a strut brace, put decent tyres then you'll end up having to ban yourself from the forum......but I still think the old Peugout 205/309 GTi's have the best fwd chassis's

Can't comment on this since I haven't driven the pugs, but there
are quite a few cars fighting for this crown...viz
Ford Focus SVT/RS/ST
Lotus Elan (new)
Mini Cooper (new)
Mazda3
Mondeo ST220

ajmat · 28th July 2005, 08:49

but the lotus elan is rwd

shuvc · 28th July 2005, 11:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shan2nu

Many are gonna find that hard to believe, aren't they? My 30K service bill was Rs. 1,500 and 45K service was Rs. 1092.

Yup, 5 years down the line, you end up spending a lot less than you think you would have.

Slightly

Are the maintenance costs of the NHC at the same levels ? Or is it relatively more expensive to maintain ?

Rtech · 28th July 2005, 11:50

Lotus Elan was the only FWD car Lotus ever made. Beautiful body on the chassis of a regular hatchback (can't remember which one now), but FWD never went down nicely with the loyalists. It was still one of the best handling FWD cars ever though.

Couple of them in Mumbai too, although it terrible condition now.

ajmat · 28th July 2005, 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rtech

Lotus Elan was the only FWD car Lotus ever made. Beautiful body on the chassis of a regular hatchback (can't remember which one now), but FWD never went down nicely with the loyalists. It was still one of the best handling FWD cars ever though.

Couple of them in Mumbai too, although it terrible condition now.

Whoops you are right, was thinking of the Elise - there is a white one in Bangalore - sits in the dealers most of the time

Mpower · 28th July 2005, 19:58

The original Elan from 60s is RWD.
The 90s Elan was a ground up chassis and used a 1.8L Isuzu turbo 4cyl from the Impulse, back when both Lotus and Isuzu were under the GM umbrella.
Lotus engineers are chassis fanatics and would never use someone else's chassis. Its was a backbone chassis with A-arm suspension.

ajmat · 28th July 2005, 21:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mpower

The original Elan from 60s is RWD.
The 90s Elan was a ground up chassis and used a 1.8L Isuzu turbo 4cyl from the Impulse, back when both Lotus and Isuzu were under the GM umbrella.
Lotus engineers are chassis fanatics and would never use someone else's chassis. Its was a backbone chassis with A-arm suspension.

...and gthey sold the design to Kia who made a few and went bust ...Hyundai took it over

Rudra Sen · 27th August 2005, 13:15

Today, at sharp 6 in the morning Ajmat called me from his cell phone. Standing right in front of our building and with a very encouraging tone " Come down, I’m waiting to have heavy breathing!"

Forty minutes after that, a cup of strong Tamilnadu coffee, I get behind the wheel.

First thing what I notice is steering wheel centering position. Almost 20 degree tilted on the right side. Not a big thing though and doesn’t bother Ajmat a bit, But!
From a company like Honda and car which is untouched for any steering issue is not acceptable to me. May be I am too finicky about all these small things but that’s the way we stupid art types are.

7 am and deep grey serpent like highway fades amongst those lovely hillocks. Shift down to second at 4500, shift up to third at 6500-7000, shift down to fourth immediately and allow the right side needle to reach 160…shift up again and fast to fifth. You have reached nirvana. Not for a long though. Because sitting next to me, Ajmat’s expression was not very happy.

Well, I’ve gunned the car few times (and for the first time) to feel pulse of thousand of VTEC lovers in this forum. I am happy that I’ve done this on a lovely highway and not in town. Way the rpm needle moves up to 6000+ range, it gives me a feeling that it likes to be in that range only. Sure, I’m not discounting the well-run 20,000km plus engine.
I’ve tried this on our Bombay office 1.5 EXI with stock tyres. Car was floating on express way to Pune. As all we know Ajmat’s baby runs on 185 wide shoes, the difference was pretty evident. GTO, once again mild request to go for new wheels.
Good front view and right steering feel tells you "give me more". While going slight uphill engine goes little out of breath so down shifting is essential for VTEC types. For mere mortals, no shifting is required unless the car is loaded.

For a short (75km) first impression:
A real gem of an engine.
Rev limiter didn’t activate at 7000rpm at times. But did activate at 6000+ rpm. May be due to fine calculation of right air/throttle combination at given rpm.
Engine becomes noisy at higher rpm (probably a little more than what I’m use to).
Frequent shifting is necessary for enthusiastic driving.
Engine noise and rapid shifting may cause fatigue in long drive.
Rear suspension is too soft for a car of this nature.

This car has strut brace but I couldn’t make out the difference because I haven’t driven it before fixing that.

Psycho, my honest suggestion (of course without having any knowledge on cars and their dynamics) is to start any modification with better, stiffer rear suspension.
If I were Ajmat, I wouldn’t go for any serious modification on engine. Frankly you don’t need any.

Ajmat, a great piece of machine you have. Thanks a lot for giving me a chance to experience it. I am in love with VTEC's heavy breathing.
But for long drive, I would like have my ‘run of the mill’ car.

Next time you should try that. You won’t come back home unhappy. I promise.

ajmat · 27th August 2005, 14:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rudra Sen

1: Today, at sharp 6 in the morning Ajmat called me from his cell phone. Standing right in front of our building and with a very encouraging tone " Come down, I’m waiting to have heavy breathing!"

2: fast to fifth. You have reached nirvana. Not for a long though. Because sitting next to me, Ajmat’s expression was not very happy.

3: 1.5 EXI with stock tyres. Car was floating on express way to Pune. As all we know Ajmat’s baby runs on 185 wide shoes, the difference was pretty evident. [

4: Engine becomes noisy at higher rpm (probably a little more than what I’m use to). Frequent shifting is necessary for enthusiastic driving.Engine noise and rapid shifting may cause fatigue in long drive. Rear suspension is too soft for a car of this nature.

5:This car has strut brace but I couldn’t make out the difference because I haven’t driven it before fixing that.

6: Ajmat, a great piece of machine you have. Thanks a lot for giving me a chance to experience it. I.

In reply

1: Correction - I said "Your chariot awaits" followed by a quick demo on the inner ring road

2: Not a problem sir!, my problem is that I have not been a passenger in my car at that speed and was a bit nervous about the trucks, not you

3: This was discussed with Psycho and the old man on Weds - One school of thought says, a stock Vtec is more fun - reality, it is more noise and dramatics - bit like those naughty movies - in reality - sustained fun is through slow but steady understanding and respect of the machine together with smooth and adventorous persuasion in mutual probing of limits

4: Agreed - it says what it is on the tin !!!! City - would love a w124 for long journeys

5: Should have brought a spanner along for you to check out the difference - takes 10 min to fit

6: anytime my friend ! - at the end of the heavy breathing, you looked pumped out and satisfied or was it that mutton omelette

Rudra Sen · 27th August 2005, 14:48

Ajmat, do you think there are ways to avoid those weekend family commitments? I know a few but not enough to go full blast.

Looks like I need to check in google

GTO · 27th August 2005, 17:06

Holy mackerel! Yet another unsuspecting innocent person to get the Vtec drug in his system....You are addicted, Old Man. Admit it.

I lost count of how many converts I have had after a spin in the Vtec.

You are darn right Ajmat - Vtec Heavy Breathing = Give it to me baby

GTO

Psycho · 27th August 2005, 23:01

Well since you have been bitten by the VTEC bug guess you are ready to drive the yellow esteem

... just took it out for a spin after the mods were done 3 words IT IS MAD... and I am yet to open it up and yet to fit the NOS too.

However as for the VTEC breathing, Ajmat I think that Rudra must have been on a mild high (Adrenalin Types) till he realised the diff between the effects of Torque and BHP (Shifts)... Rudra well pointed out about the suspension... the VTEC always gives me jitters on the rear ends and it does defn needs a better footprint. As for the mods part of it trust me the VTEC loyalists always seem to keep looking for that elusive bit to keep that high going.

However GTO I think that the bling machine and the roarer should keep him satisfied, however you never know.

ajmat · 5th December 2005, 18:26

and so....35200 km, after a hard 5000 kms to Vayanad, hard driving morning commute and Bangalore roads, the car was losing its edge. Starting from rest was becoming an effort, a few creaks and rattles. Faults - the passegner side mirror did not always work and a blocked wiper jet. So booked her in.

Believe me, competition works!!!! Driver came at 8.55 am, 5 minutes early. Got a call 20 min later from the service manager. The mirror adjust mechanism needed to be replaced (after three tries, fair enough = Rs 1500) and battery needed a 12 hour charge - hmm - a Zen sized battery + amp + sub means trouble brewing. They wanted to hold the car for 12 hours to charge the battery - but I needed the car at 5.00. At 4.00 PM got a call that the car was on it's way. Arrived at 4.30, immaculately presented!!!!! Normally, the car arrived after 6.00 after a hurried job!!!

Full marks for being in contact with the customer - each service advisor has a mobile so you can get constant feedback

Damage Rs 3366 - remember the mirror -as cheap as the 800 or even cheaper. Cool !!! Was so pleased with the service, I gave the delivery guy a big tip for being prompt

Drove the car back - it's mojo has been restored and rattles removed - only to get bugg**ed by Bangalore roads

ajmat · 6th March 2006, 22:50

The past 5000 km were one of the Vtec's toughest. At Xmas, a quick dash to Kerala on some pretty awful roads. The Dharmapuri - Salem section was bad and i grounded the chassis (not the sump). On my return to Bangalore, the car was rattling and slightly floppy.

I then decided to push it on the circuit. Enough is written about this elsewhere. I really should not have bothered. The old man and Jaggu told me that the car really rolled when slaloming police checks on the way. Milaege flopped on my way back to 13 as opposed to 16 in the Optra (maybe my ECU was still in throttle mode - should have done the Dom black out test)

Returned to Bangalore and found that the Vtec was very jittery at high speeds. So 39500 rolled up and I decided to advance the service. Brake pad with 2000km to go were changed as a precaution for Rs 3500.

For it's hard work, I decided to treat it to some Mobil 1 for Rs 2600 - Rudra and Psycho insisted, I tried it. Prior to the service, I cleaned the K&N out - it made a big difference and in the process found that it had not been seating properly.

40k service is usually quite big. I wanted to change the shockers but no one can find the koni or equivalent so was planning to go for a stock set. The service consisted on coolant, brake fluid, gear box oil changes and new fuel filter. Doors were adjusted. surprise surprise only the lower susepnsion bushes required changing.

Final Damage - Rs 6044 (ok 2600 for oil + 3500 for brakes not counted + Rs 3000 for new Battery) It was still ridiculous. What will a Skoda cost?

Car pulls well and the noise it makes when accelerating is ...oh boy

Suspension is controllable but not totally as confident as the Swift. whitefield Honda services cars to the ordinary Joe's standard not a Boy Racer T-bhp standard. Might change shockers, play with rear springs later. A trip to Penang might be in the offing so I might be lucky if work does not distract.

Also - gotta pay my taxes

28th July 2005, 08:49	#63
ajmat Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 14,860 Thanked: 27,949 Times View My Garage	but the lotus elan is rwd
	() Thanks

28th July 2005, 11:50	#65
Rtech Team-BHP Support Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 5,770 Thanked: 359 Times View My Garage	Lotus Elan was the only FWD car Lotus ever made. Beautiful body on the chassis of a regular hatchback (can't remember which one now), but FWD never went down nicely with the loyalists. It was still one of the best handling FWD cars ever though. Couple of them in Mumbai too, although it terrible condition now.
	() Thanks

28th July 2005, 19:58	#67
Mpower Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 10,409 Thanked: 1,730 Times View My Garage	The original Elan from 60s is RWD. The 90s Elan was a ground up chassis and used a 1.8L Isuzu turbo 4cyl from the Impulse, back when both Lotus and Isuzu were under the GM umbrella. Lotus engineers are chassis fanatics and would never use someone else's chassis. Its was a backbone chassis with A-arm suspension.
	() Thanks

27th August 2005, 13:15	#69
Rudra Sen Team-BHP Support Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 11,590 Thanked: 6,532 Times View My Garage	VTECing at 7000 rpm. First time experience. Today, at sharp 6 in the morning Ajmat called me from his cell phone. Standing right in front of our building and with a very encouraging tone " Come down, I’m waiting to have heavy breathing!" Forty minutes after that, a cup of strong Tamilnadu coffee, I get behind the wheel. First thing what I notice is steering wheel centering position. Almost 20 degree tilted on the right side. Not a big thing though and doesn’t bother Ajmat a bit, But! From a company like Honda and car which is untouched for any steering issue is not acceptable to me. May be I am too finicky about all these small things but that’s the way we stupid art types are. 7 am and deep grey serpent like highway fades amongst those lovely hillocks. Shift down to second at 4500, shift up to third at 6500-7000, shift down to fourth immediately and allow the right side needle to reach 160…shift up again and fast to fifth. You have reached nirvana. Not for a long though. Because sitting next to me, Ajmat’s expression was not very happy. Well, I’ve gunned the car few times (and for the first time) to feel pulse of thousand of VTEC lovers in this forum. I am happy that I’ve done this on a lovely highway and not in town. Way the rpm needle moves up to 6000+ range, it gives me a feeling that it likes to be in that range only. Sure, I’m not discounting the well-run 20,000km plus engine. I’ve tried this on our Bombay office 1.5 EXI with stock tyres. Car was floating on express way to Pune. As all we know Ajmat’s baby runs on 185 wide shoes, the difference was pretty evident. GTO, once again mild request to go for new wheels. Good front view and right steering feel tells you "give me more". While going slight uphill engine goes little out of breath so down shifting is essential for VTEC types. For mere mortals, no shifting is required unless the car is loaded. For a short (75km) first impression: A real gem of an engine. Rev limiter didn’t activate at 7000rpm at times. But did activate at 6000+ rpm. May be due to fine calculation of right air/throttle combination at given rpm. Engine becomes noisy at higher rpm (probably a little more than what I’m use to). Frequent shifting is necessary for enthusiastic driving. Engine noise and rapid shifting may cause fatigue in long drive. Rear suspension is too soft for a car of this nature. This car has strut brace but I couldn’t make out the difference because I haven’t driven it before fixing that. Psycho, my honest suggestion (of course without having any knowledge on cars and their dynamics) is to start any modification with better, stiffer rear suspension. If I were Ajmat, I wouldn’t go for any serious modification on engine. Frankly you don’t need any. Ajmat, a great piece of machine you have. Thanks a lot for giving me a chance to experience it. I am in love with VTEC's heavy breathing. But for long drive, I would like have my ‘run of the mill’ car. Next time you should try that. You won’t come back home unhappy. I promise.
	() Thanks

27th August 2005, 14:48	#71
Rudra Sen Team-BHP Support Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 11,590 Thanked: 6,532 Times View My Garage	Ajmat, do you think there are ways to avoid those weekend family commitments? I know a few but not enough to go full blast. Looks like I need to check in google
	() Thanks

27th August 2005, 17:06	#72
GTO Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 70,501 Thanked: 300,629 Times View My Garage	Holy mackerel! Yet another unsuspecting innocent person to get the Vtec drug in his system....You are addicted, Old Man. Admit it. I lost count of how many converts I have had after a spin in the Vtec. You are darn right Ajmat - Vtec Heavy Breathing = Give it to me baby GTO
	() Thanks

27th August 2005, 23:01	#73
Psycho Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,043 Thanked: 110 Times View My Garage	Well since you have been bitten by the VTEC bug guess you are ready to drive the yellow esteem ... just took it out for a spin after the mods were done 3 words IT IS MAD... and I am yet to open it up and yet to fit the NOS too. However as for the VTEC breathing, Ajmat I think that Rudra must have been on a mild high (Adrenalin Types) till he realised the diff between the effects of Torque and BHP (Shifts)... Rudra well pointed out about the suspension... the VTEC always gives me jitters on the rear ends and it does defn needs a better footprint. As for the mods part of it trust me the VTEC loyalists always seem to keep looking for that elusive bit to keep that high going. However GTO I think that the bling machine and the roarer should keep him satisfied, however you never know.
	() Thanks

5th December 2005, 18:26	#74
ajmat Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 14,860 Thanked: 27,949 Times View My Garage	and so....35200 km, after a hard 5000 kms to Vayanad, hard driving morning commute and Bangalore roads, the car was losing its edge. Starting from rest was becoming an effort, a few creaks and rattles. Faults - the passegner side mirror did not always work and a blocked wiper jet. So booked her in. Believe me, competition works!!!! Driver came at 8.55 am, 5 minutes early. Got a call 20 min later from the service manager. The mirror adjust mechanism needed to be replaced (after three tries, fair enough = Rs 1500) and battery needed a 12 hour charge - hmm - a Zen sized battery + amp + sub means trouble brewing. They wanted to hold the car for 12 hours to charge the battery - but I needed the car at 5.00. At 4.00 PM got a call that the car was on it's way. Arrived at 4.30, immaculately presented!!!!! Normally, the car arrived after 6.00 after a hurried job!!! Full marks for being in contact with the customer - each service advisor has a mobile so you can get constant feedback Damage Rs 3366 - remember the mirror -as cheap as the 800 or even cheaper. Cool !!! Was so pleased with the service, I gave the delivery guy a big tip for being prompt Drove the car back - it's mojo has been restored and rattles removed - only to get bugg*ed by Bangalore roads Last edited by ajmat : 5th December 2005 at 18:28.*
	() Thanks

6th March 2006, 22:50	#75
ajmat Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 14,860 Thanked: 27,949 Times View My Garage	The past 5000 km were one of the Vtec's toughest. At Xmas, a quick dash to Kerala on some pretty awful roads. The Dharmapuri - Salem section was bad and i grounded the chassis (not the sump). On my return to Bangalore, the car was rattling and slightly floppy. I then decided to push it on the circuit. Enough is written about this elsewhere. I really should not have bothered. The old man and Jaggu told me that the car really rolled when slaloming police checks on the way. Milaege flopped on my way back to 13 as opposed to 16 in the Optra (maybe my ECU was still in throttle mode - should have done the Dom black out test) Returned to Bangalore and found that the Vtec was very jittery at high speeds. So 39500 rolled up and I decided to advance the service. Brake pad with 2000km to go were changed as a precaution for Rs 3500. For it's hard work, I decided to treat it to some Mobil 1 for Rs 2600 - Rudra and Psycho insisted, I tried it. Prior to the service, I cleaned the K&N out - it made a big difference and in the process found that it had not been seating properly. 40k service is usually quite big. I wanted to change the shockers but no one can find the koni or equivalent so was planning to go for a stock set. The service consisted on coolant, brake fluid, gear box oil changes and new fuel filter. Doors were adjusted. surprise surprise only the lower susepnsion bushes required changing. Final Damage - Rs 6044 (ok 2600 for oil + 3500 for brakes not counted + Rs 3000 for new Battery) It was still ridiculous. What will a Skoda cost? Car pulls well and the noise it makes when accelerating is ...oh boy Suspension is controllable but not totally as confident as the Swift. whitefield Honda services cars to the ordinary Joe's standard not a Boy Racer T-bhp standard. Might change shockers, play with rear springs later. A trip to Penang might be in the offing so I might be lucky if work does not distract. Also - gotta pay my taxes Last edited by ajmat : 6th March 2006 at 22:53.
	() Thanks