[dsunn]

Originally Posted by amitpunjani

Firstly i must say you are getting excellent average. I normally get 190 km on tank full of CNG with pressure of 200 PSi. Mine is Santro 2008 model, fitted with CNG. The fittment was done from aftermarket. This is the average with 100% AC and B2B traffic.

When the car runs on CNG there is hardly any carbon in engine, and some amt of Carbon in also beneficial for the engine, hence Engine Decarbonization Rs. 1275 is a total waste of money and surely not required, if one is following regular intervals of oil change.

What's extremely important in CNG car is Throttle body cleaning, as the car runs on CNG, i could not see in that in the service break up. Perhaps for the gear oil change you could have waited till next service.

Thanks for your inputs.

I told the MASS technician that engine decarbonization is not necessary since CNG is a much cleaner fuel, but he said it is required as per Maruti's service guidelines. I didn't argue much since I wasn't much sure myself.

The servicing was done as per the technician's recommendation, and throttle body cleaning wasn't suggested. Is it really necessary or can it wait till the next servicing due at 30,000 kms? Any other suggestions which I should keep in mind for next service?

BTW, my car runs a lot. I bought it in August 2011, and it has already clocked 21,000 kms. My experience so far with WagonR CNG has been good. No major hiccups.

[syravi]

I just completed 51,000 kms on my new Wagon R CNG and I must say that Wagon R continues to give me a trouble free ride. My last service (at 50,000) cost me just Rs. 3566 and it included:
• Wheel alignment
• Oil change
• Air filter change
• Brake pad check
• Oil filter change
• Lubricating oil top up
• Tuning
• Cleaning

My earlier reviews (till 38,000 Km) has been published in detail.

At 40,000 Kms I had some trouble with my injectors and I learned some lessons the hard way. I had to change all the injectors as they got irreparably blocked. They were replaced free of cost as they were covered under warranty. But more than the free replacement I had to undergo a little inconvenience. I will detail out my learning and the hurdles I went through. They are as follows:

Till 40,000 kms, and after the first two free services, I shifted to MASS (Maruti Authorised Service Stations) from the Dealer’s Workshop. I had an irritating experience at Competent where they added some additive in petrol for Rs. 800 without asking me. These additives, I know are a way of extracting money from unsuspecting consumers. In the first service itself I was scared by an employee at competent and almost pursuaded to go for Teflon coating, engine coating etc. for a whopping package Rs. 17000. If I had the money that day I would have agreed, but one tends to be short of cash after buying a car and fitting accessories and so I could not take the package that day. On returning home I had the sense to google and realized that in Mumbai it might be necessary due to the corrosive environment triggered by sea breeze but it was absolutely not required in Delhi.

The persuasion for Teflon coating and the additive made me suspect the servicing ethics of Competent and I shifted to Shikhar, a MASS. The service for 3 consecutive times was excellent and much cheaper than at Competent. I did have an issue with this MASS branch when, on my fourth service they arbitrarily tapped the spark plugs without checking with filler gauges. I drove unhappily for 100 kms before realizing that something was wrong with the spark plug space and started looking for a 1.0 mm filler gauge.

It was only on receiving a feedback call when I told them that I will return with a filler gauge when I was told that they have filler gauge. Only they did not care to use it and instead fixed the spark plug gauge with a trial and error approach! Now this was height of negligence.

Anyway 500 kms after my 40,000 km service my car started giving jerks when it was in petrol mode. Everything was fine when it was on CNG but it would be jerky in petrol mode. I promptly went back to Shikhar (MASS) and they diagnosed the problem in 15 minutes flat. The injector was blocked. They tried to clean it. No luck. It was blocked forever and would have to be replaced. Rs. 1250 if I wanted immediately. Or free if I went to Service Masters (Naraina Workshop of Maruti). I said I would want to go to the Service Masters. They promptly made a bill of Rs. 360 for services they could not render. I rushed to Maruti.

They said they would run their own checks and asked for the entire history of my service record. Luckily I had. This is required if I would need any replacements and if I miss any service record in this chain, they will not replace any part and any change would have to be on a chargeable basis.

They kept the car overnight (the part was not available). The next day after several phones, they changed the part and I got my car late in the night. They did not charge a single rupee!

Another 600 kms of drive and the same problem appeared. This time when I went to Naraina Workshop, they said two of my injectors needed replacement and that the suspension too was making a noise. They took two days and many phone calls to repair the car. Once again the injectors were in short supply.

Another 2000 kms and my car had the same problem again. Tired of the two days wait period they took, I drove it to a workshop of repute. It was late in the night and on my insistence the guy cleaned the injectors and confirmed that it was choked. He also checked the petrol filter which I suspected was the cause of the problem. But the petrol filter was fine.

Post this patch phase, my car is running fine. It was the additional 3 and 4th year guarantee that saved the day for me. My car had done more than two years and I would have to pay almost Rs. 6000 for the repairs had I not gone for the additional warranty.

Here are my learnings:
• MASS might be cheap but they are not competent: The filler gap episode proves their at times, unprofessional approach
• MASS can do only minor repairs for major service including free parts replacement they do not have the rights but just to diagnose the problem they will charge you (I fail to understand this)
• Service Masters are the most competent and they diagnose and replace the parts free of cost. They do charge for rubber components
• You must run the car on petrol everyday to clean the injectors. Continues dry runs on CNG create soot deposits on injectors and block them forever. So now I run my car at least for 5 kms on petrol everyday
• If you are driving a CNG variant, make it a policy to get the injectors cleaned every 10,000 kms
• Dealer workshops fleece customers
• I still have not figured out how all the three injectors could have choked in just 40,000 kms irreparably
• The fact that there was a spare part problem makes me suspicious if the replacements are in an epidemic scale and if it is a flawed injector that is the cause

Happy addition

Faced with the ‘no-boot space on account of CNG cylinder problem’ I have installed an aluminium carrier. I spent 2900 on this genuine, all aluminium section carrier instead of the lighter sheet metal variants that bend and open up at their ends in a short time. I got this from a renowned maker BL and Sons, Kashmere Gate. Their office is near Ritz.

I think post installation, my car looks classier!

Happy driving!

[TheQuarterMile]

Anyone facing the issue of the last bar on the gauge not immediately showing full after topping up?
Don't think pressure is the issue. Always around 200.

[syravi]

Originally Posted by TheQuarterMile

Anyone facing the issue of the last bar on the gauge not immediately showing full after topping up?
Don't think pressure is the issue. Always around 200.

• Amount of CNG filled in winters differs from what gets filled in summers.
• Get the tank full, wait for 3-4 minutes, fill again and you will probably get another 'top up' of Rs. 50 or so.
• The problems are less acute with NGC nozzles.
• Recently my tank emptied to zero and I could refill 8.98 kgs of gas against the specified 9 kgs which is almost perfect. Doesnt matter what the gauge shows.....

[TheQuarterMile]

The issue got fixed. There was a loose connection between the Pressure gauge and the indicator.

[CNGhead]

Originally Posted by TheQuarterMile

Anyone facing the issue of the last bar on the gauge not immediately showing full after topping up?
Don't think pressure is the issue. Always around 200.

Hi,

It happens some time. But there is not difference in the mileage of the car per fill. Mine runs for around 220-240 km for 8KG fill...

Cheers

[Sang]

[quote=syravi;3010428]I just completed 51,000 kms on my new Wagon R CNG and I must say that Wagon R continues to give me a trouble free ride. My last service (at 50,000) cost me just Rs. 35665 and it included:
• Wheel alignment
• Oil change
• Air filter change
• Brake pad check
• Oil filter change
• Lubricating oil top up
• Tuning
• Cleaning

My earlier reviews (till 38,000 Km) has been published in detail.

At 40,000 Kms I had some trouble with my injectors and I learned some lessons the hard way. I had to change all the injectors as they got irreparably blocked. They were replaced free of cost as they were covered under warranty. But more than the free replacement I had to undergo a little inconvenience. I will detail out my learning and the hurdles I went through.
[quote=syravi;3010428]

Hi, Based on your injector Issues, I asked for Injector and throttle body cleaning in my 20000 Kms service. Pasted below is details of what it costed me for 20,000 Kms service.

After service, pickup for the car has become really heavy. Problem after services is even when I depress accelerator pedal fully. it used to pick slowly. I complained to Maruti service station guys and they sent engineers on home visit. They corrected some settings and its much better now, still it seems at time as if there is jerky movement or fuel/cng supply is reduced. I plan to go and get it checked again this week. Pickup was much better before service

[CARDEEP]

Originally Posted by Sang

Hi, Based on your injector Issues, I asked for Injector and throttle body cleaning in my 20000 Kms service. Pasted below is details of what it costed me for 20,000 Kms service.

After service, pickup for the car has become really heavy. Problem after services is even when I depress accelerator pedal fully. it used to pick slowly. I complained to Maruti service station guys and they sent engineers on home visit. They corrected some settings and its much better now, still it seems at time as if there is jerky movement or fuel/cng supply is reduced. I plan to go and get it checked again this week. Pickup was much better before service

There is come problem with your fuel pump (worst case scenario). I would suggest using premium fuel (on regular basis), & contact some competent FNG for replacement of faulty parts (not necessarily the fuel pump).

[syravi]

Originally Posted by Sang

At 40,000 Kms I had some trouble with my injectors and I learned some lessons the hard way. I had to change all the injectors as they got irreparably blocked. They were replaced free of cost as they were covered under warranty. But more than the free replacement I had to undergo a little inconvenience. I will detail out my learning and the hurdles I went through.


Hi, Based on your injector Issues, I asked for Injector and throttle body cleaning in my 20000 Kms service. Pasted below is details of what it costed me for 20,000 Kms service.

After service, pickup for the car has become really heavy. Problem after services is even when I depress accelerator pedal fully. it used to pick slowly. I complained to Maruti service station guys and they sent engineers on home visit. They corrected some settings and its much better now, still it seems at time as if there is jerky movement or fuel/cng supply is reduced. I plan to go and get it checked again this week. Pickup was much better before service

Hi Sang,

If you go through my previous learnings, you will realize that the most probable reasosn for your problems can be:

• They did not change the air filter
• Or they changed the wrong spark plugs instead of the NGK spark plugs that have been specifically designed for Wagon R CNG. The model and make is mentioned in the manual that comes along. Even if you install the wrong make of NGK sparkplugs it still wont work. The pep of the engine will be missing and you will feel heavy
• The gap between the spark plugs should be measured with a gauge and should be between .9 - 1 mm. 1 mm is better. Out of habit the workers adjust it to 0.8mm which is right for other CNG kits but very wrong for this car. If you insist on a 1 mm gap, they will say that the car will guzzle CNG and you wont get 'good mileage.' Ignore their advice. They dont know their job.
• The RPM is low. The accelerator wire slackens and needs to be tightened a bit.

Get these points checked and be on the road of a comfortable ride.
Hope this helps!

[Sang]

Originally Posted by CARDEEP

There is come problem with your fuel pump (worst case scenario). I would suggest using premium fuel (on regular basis), & contact some competent FNG for replacement of faulty parts (not necessarily the fuel pump).

Thanks Cardeep. I am getting it serviced at Maruti Sale and Service Naraina which I think is best Maruti workshop around the place I live. I am running it mostly on CNG, not sure if Fuel pump can still be the culrprit. Not aware of what FNG means :-(

[Sang]

Originally Posted by syravi

Hi Sang,

If you go through my previous learnings, you will realize that the most probable reasosn for your problems can be:

• They did not change the air filter
• Or they changed the wrong spark plugs instead of the NGK spark plugs that have been specifically designed for Wagon R CNG. The model and make is mentioned in the manual that comes along. Even if you install the wrong make of NGK sparkplugs it still wont work. The pep of the engine will be missing and you will feel heavy
• The gap between the spark plugs should be measured with a gauge and should be between .9 - 1 mm. 1 mm is better. Out of habit the workers adjust it to 0.8mm which is right for other CNG kits but very wrong for this car. If you insist on a 1 mm gap, they will say that the car will guzzle CNG and you wont get 'good mileage.' Ignore their advice. They dont know their job.
• The RPM is low. The accelerator wire slackens and needs to be tightened a bit.

Get these points checked and be on the road of a comfortable ride.
Hope this helps!

Thanks Syravi !! It seems to be good advice, I will check all of this with them when I go on Saturday. They have corrected accelerator wire slackness to a good extent but it can still be better. I do not see any charges for spark plug replacement in my part and that rules out NGK plug Issue. They might have done some gap adjustment as part of Injector or Throttle body cleanup. I know only one thing that whatever fun drive part was there is driving it that has gone away. I hope they are able to fix this problem.

[syravi]

Originally Posted by Sang

Thanks Syravi !! It seems to be good advice, I will check all of this with them when I go on Saturday. They have corrected accelerator wire slackness to a good extent but it can still be better. I do not see any charges for spark plug replacement in my part and that rules out NGK plug Issue. They might have done some gap adjustment as part of Injector or Throttle body cleanup. I know only one thing that whatever fun drive part was there is driving it that has gone away. I hope they are able to fix this problem.

And one more thing. Spark Plugs in CNG should be changed after every 20,000 kms and not the routine 40,000. So if you have skipped the change in the past 20,000, change them irrespective of how they look

[CARDEEP]

Originally Posted by Sang

Thanks Cardeep. I am getting it serviced at Maruti Sale and Service Naraina which I think is best Maruti workshop around the place I live. I am running it mostly on CNG, not sure if Fuel pump can still be the culrprit. Not aware of what FNG means :-(

@Sang, FNG ~ Friendly Neighbourhood Garage.

Coming to your car's problem, @syravi have mentioned list of probable causes & quoted the cause, in the worst case scenario.

However, it hardly matters where you get your car serviced, if the problem (s) occur after the service or work on a problem. It should not be like "Chooha nikal ke Billi ghusa dena", though I admit MSM have good reputation, & they are the best to deal with, around that place.

I feel you problem, is much simpler one & you need to check you air filter, as the first step, once this is done the spark plug settings need to checked [if these are faulty repair or replace them (it cost Rs. 240 for my Santro Xing)]. If all these do not work (which I feel won't be the case), the fuel pump would be the culprit & they would suggest changing that.

The FNG come into picture here, as the Fuel Pump costs more than couple of thousand bucks. As far as I know, there is a part in the pump (costing around Rs1.5K) that can be replaced & the pump works normally.

Hope this is helpful to you

[ninjatalli]

Originally Posted by syravi

Here are my learnings:
• You must run the car on petrol everyday to clean the injectors. Continues dry runs on CNG create soot deposits on injectors and block them forever. So now I run my car at least for 5 kms on petrol everyday
• If you are driving a CNG variant, make it a policy to get the injectors cleaned every 10,000 kms

Those are some excellent learnings, and if there are more such info nuggets on this thread, I would ask you to put them up separately; this will have two clear advantages

1. Validated by other CNG users thus adding/correcting whatever you have experienced as a general guidelines for all CNG cars
2. Clear Info / knowledge for wanna-be / new CNG car owners

An awesome thread - glad to have stepped on this so late in your ownership tale. Keep updating!

[Sang]

Originally Posted by CARDEEP

@Sang, FNG ~ Friendly Neighbourhood Garage.

Coming to your car's problem, @syravi have mentioned list of probable causes & quoted the cause, in the worst case scenario.

However, it hardly matters where you get your car serviced, if the problem (s) occur after the service or work on a problem. It should not be like "Chooha nikal ke Billi ghusa dena", though I admit MSM have good reputation, & they are the best to deal with, around that place.

I feel you problem, is much simpler one & you need to check you air filter, as the first step, once this is done the spark plug settings need to checked [if these are faulty repair or replace them (it cost Rs. 240 for my Santro Xing)]. If all these do not work (which I feel won't be the case), the fuel pump would be the culprit & they would suggest changing that.

The FNG come into picture here, as the Fuel Pump costs more than couple of thousand bucks. As far as I know, there is a part in the pump (costing around Rs1.5K) that can be replaced & the pump works normally.

Hope this is helpful to you

Hi, This car is less than 2 years old. I think fuel pump should be covered in warranty, if it fails.