[vnabhi]

@s_pphilip---it looks like there's a problem with that particular car. I've driven my friend's Sonata Embera (2.4 petrol manual) for many miles a couple of years ago on the highway, and its brakes, coupled with ABS were fantastic.

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by vnabhi

@s_pphilip---it looks like there's a problem with that particular car. I've driven my friend's Sonata Embera (2.4 petrol manual) for many miles a couple of years ago on the highway, and its brakes, coupled with ABS were fantastic.

Hmmn Vnabhi, well that is a worrying feeling then, this car is sold to us by Hyundai Advantage, we have repeatedly asked the dealer and they say the brakes are fine, I somehow feel it is sub par, but since I assume it is simple mechanics/friction that stops the car, can't understand when all the parts are supposedly good what could go wrong. The silver lining is they are offering a one year replaceable extended warranty which covers mechanical and electrical parts except for consumables and wear and tear.
There are two Hyundai dealers in Goa, and since we have finalized and initiated the RTO transfer process, I think I shall take it to the other dealer and get it checked under this extended Hyundai warranty or on cost after purchase. I should also encounter another Embera owner at the workshop and share the concern. I am trying to work my way through contacts at the other showroom.
I hope this issue gets resolved without much complications and turns out to be a simple solution, again the warranty offered makes me believe it should be simple.
Since we have already transferred the part payment and the rest will be done in a day, is this some where we take a stand and ask them to cross check and confirm before delivery.
I have expressed my discomfort with the brakes during my drive and was countered by this argument that the car has been this way last 5 years, and to top it there is a warranty on offer which covers replacements which allays my fears.
Forgive my ignorance, but this was the carrot dangling on the stick, is it only because we are buying from Advantage that we are provided the extended warranty? If so in case we went with another local dealer or approached an individual does that mean we would not avail the added warranty in a similar case?
Thanks for all the help and tip by all.

[ACM]

Embera brakes should be fine. Hyundai service too should be fine in general but it still does depend on the service centre. Embera should be reliable but if things to go wrong you will be highly dependent on the ASS (and this being a discontinued vehicle that did not sell in numbers refurbished parts will not be easily available) while in case of some of the other options the service might be easier.

An Honda accord would be easier to live with.

2005-6 accord 2.4 MT / AT could be yours for 4-5L and the FE would be about 8 for AT and 9.5 for MT.

A Skoda will indeed be higher maintenance and hence atleast for accidents comprehensive insurance is essential. A side view mirror in a Laura is 16K and just the mirror Glass is about 3K. Accord parts though are not cheap but they don't fail easily.
A Laura front head light with bulb can be about 25K (just one unit), and the sunroof about 75K, the Turbo with intercooler about 125K in ASS and 75 outside. An AC compressor about 38 outside and 75 in ASS. A flywheel about 40K and the DSG unit about 150K.

That said all stuff that should fail first time from factory would have already failed and been replaced by 60,000 kms. A 2006 Laura could be yours for about R. 6L with about 80-100k kms on the odo.

Any diesel car would have done that kind of kms in 7-8 years and all of these will require replacement of parts like timing belts and suspension for sure. Turbo too will be suspect for all Skoda or non Skoda diesel higher power vehicles of the class between 100,000 to 150,000 kms. (except maybe an Altis diesel)

[vnabhi]

75 K for an AC compressor in an Accord? Well it is around 58 K for the Embera. My pal's compressor is giving trouble and this is the figure quoted by Hyundai.

He got some jugaad done in an FNG for around 9 K and is living with it. The AC works fine, but sometimes there are some water drops dripping on the front passenger's foot from the dashboard.

[Pacifica]

Originally Posted by ACM

Embera should be reliable but if things to go wrong you will be highly dependent on the ASS (and this being a discontinued vehicle that did not sell in numbers refurbished parts will not be easily available) while in case of some of the other options the service might be easier.

ACM, you are correct that refurbished/after-market parts for Embera aren't easily found. However, my experience has been that Hyundai is pretty prompt about arranging parts as needed, and they are fairly reasonable. If I ever feel hard done by parts costs I just talk to my friend who owns a Laura and that puts matters in perspective.

Example - an ass riding a Pulsar hit and broke my driver side mirror - knocked out the glass. Went to Hyundai, got the glass fixed, no problem. Similar case on my friend's Laura, the ASC told him the mirrors came as a set and he has to buy BOTH left and right mirrors. My friend told him to take a hike, got a friendly neighbourhood guy to fit the mirrors instead.

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by ACM

Embera brakes should be fine.

An Honda accord would be easier to live with.

That said all stuff that should fail first time from factory would have already failed and been replaced by 60,000 kms. A 2006 Laura could be yours for about R. 6L with about 80-100k kms on the odo.

Thanks ACM, we have asked Advantage to sort out the brakes and they agreed and gave the car for general check up today, the reason for buying from advantage dealership is that since they should know their car best they should negate any issues in car existing because of the previous owner.

I agree with the Honda Accord part, in fact I even like the 2006 Accord 2.4 and I know we will get it inside 5 L or so but it will drive us crazy at the fuel pump. Its easier to allow ourselves to spend upfront on the car than spend regularly on fuel, but I could be wrong if maintenance becomes a handful, I've heard though that Honda spares are expensive.

Also agreed on the analogy that whatever defects could crop up will reflect from beginning, which is also a concern, what if the owner deliberately covers it, also what about the expensive spares even when it comes to regular maintenance.

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by Pacifica

ACM, you are correct that refurbished/after-market parts for Embera aren't easily found. However, my experience has been that Hyundai is pretty prompt about arranging parts as needed, and they are fairly reasonable. If I ever feel hard done by parts costs I just talk to my friend who owns a Laura and that puts matters in perspective.

Example - an ass riding a Pulsar hit and broke my driver side mirror - knocked out the glass. Went to Hyundai, got the glass fixed, no problem. Similar case on my friend's Laura, the ASC told him the mirrors came as a set and he has to buy BOTH left and right mirrors. My friend told him to take a hike, got a friendly neighbourhood guy to fit the mirrors instead.

Thanks Pacifica, That is reassuring, even I am going to believe that Hyundai will support us for the next 3/4 yrs in the least. :-)
Another friend casually mentioned while discussing that Embera spares should be easily available in Singapore since there is a substantial market there.
I do love Skoda's but my friend believes, if it is Skoda it is better to pick it brand new rather than pre-owned which I second.
For now we are choosing to go with the Embera because we want space and comfort and no car comes close except for the Altis which slipped from our hands. Even the previous gen Corolla's are priced above market rates and they still get sold.
In Goa, Toyota is know to be best in service, then Maruti and then some less smiles away Hyundai.

[ACM]

Originally Posted by Pacifica

ACM, you are correct that refurbished/after-market parts for Embera aren't easily found. However, my experience has been that Hyundai is pretty prompt about arranging parts as needed, and they are fairly reasonable. If I ever feel hard done by parts costs I just talk to my friend who owns a Laura and that puts matters in perspective.

Example - an ass riding a Pulsar hit and broke my driver side mirror - knocked out the glass. Went to Hyundai, got the glass fixed, no problem. Similar case on my friend's Laura, the ASC told him the mirrors came as a set and he has to buy BOTH left and right mirrors. My friend told him to take a hike, got a friendly neighbourhood guy to fit the mirrors instead.

Oh I own a Laura since many years and have had the side view mirror knocked out twice both times just changed the bottom part of the mirror with the blinker. Also recently just changed the glass. The Mirror does NOT come in pairs and that is just a rogue dealer sending your friend on a ride. In anycase the part will be available outside as well. But yep the Laura parts are expensive (mostly made in European countries rather than Korea or Japan or other Asian locations) even more than that of the accord and Embera for also for sure but available quite easily. The newer Laura has cheaper spares than the older one which I have and some of them are localized production.

[s_pphilip]

I'd like to update all in case I haven't implied this clearly earlier that we have gone ahead and paid the dealer and now awaiting the RTO transfer, as per the advantage guys they do not release the car until the RTO transfer is done, this should take 2/3 days, meantime we've asked them to check the brakes and acceleration and general servicing. Thanks T-Bhp and all of you individually for helping immensely. I shall update you once we have it in hand. The first trip is decided, its our close friends b'day this week and we plan to celebrate it in Pune this weekend. Looking forward to AH-47. Cheers. :-)

[Pacifica]

Congratulations!

Mods, this thread is in the Luxury/Imports/Supercars section and speaking as an Embera owner I don't think its any of those. Shouldn't this thread be in the regular Sedans section? Its just a midsize family sedan after all.

[mango_pal]

Originally Posted by Pacifica

Congratulations!

Mods, this thread is in the Luxury/Imports/Supercars section and speaking as an Embera owner I don't think its any of those. Shouldn't this thread be in the regular Sedans section? Its just a midsize family sedan after all.

I had the exact same thought right now, as soon as I saw the thread!

Yes, the Sonata is just a regular midsize family sedan and has no reason to be in this section.

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by Pacifica

Congratulations!

Mods, this thread is in the Luxury/Imports/Supercars section and speaking as an Embera owner I don't think its any of those. Shouldn't this thread be in the regular Sedans section? Its just a midsize family sedan after all.

I too agree. It is neither a Super car or Import and if considered a Luxury well depends, won't it then not qualify a whole lot of similar cars like Altis, Superb etc, I don't think we can classify them likewise then.

And thank you all, we picked the car and immediately did the trip to Pune to celebrate my friends B'day totaling about 1400kms, to update, we did about 400+kms in Pune itself with trips to Corinthians Brewery, Lonavala etc, it felt nice to move around in a big car and it does feel different, even the building security had a few Q's to ask and despite all its quirks, we are ecstatic.
The highway stretch of about 600+kms was all smiles, yes the lag is irritating and I still suspect the brakes (though they behaved better than I first thought), but on straight broad roads the car has a different charecter, once above 90kmph the car flies, it is difficult to keep up with this car when there are open roads, we could do constant 120/140kmph sprints, we did 160kmph a few times but somehow were not getting comfortable above 150kmph as there aren't enough straights, on gentle curves at 150+ the car feels like it wants to go straight, the steering resists the smooth inputs.
However between 100 and 140 we had a blast, we could easily shoot past others on straights because of the aggressive power.
In city it is irritating and we'd end up crawling in first gear lots of time as the second gear stalls if you crawl on half clutch.
The car is decently comfortable but you do feel the road below, it is not exactly cushion ride, I felt the Honda City my friend came with, has a softer ride, an incident I'd like to share is we went flying over a crest at about 90kmph, the crest was followed by a dip in the road which we didn't anticipate and the car landed hard and there was a prominent KHAT sound at the rear which really surprised us. I have been to Pune several times in the Swift on the same roads and never had this experience, I think the rear bottomed, somehow we could not figure why. There is no way the car under body could kiss the road as the length of the crest was bigger than the wheelbase. I plan to get the underside checked when I take it to the dealer to sort some delivery niggles.
The car gave an average of 13kmpl and we tanked in about 107 ltrs. I think it was low because of multiple gear shifts to step up pace.
The space is impressive but one feature I really missed are bottle holders, its appalling to have those bottles rolling on the floor.
It is too early to say anything concrete but for now we are happy and would want this feeling to stay.

[s_pphilip]

Since my friend is out of town I am driving the Embera around past week in a bid to familiarize with it because its a new acquisition, also since it feels different to a Swift/Alto.

I have used about 50 ltrs of Diesel driving in Goa and the car averages about 13kmpl. The speeds vary between 40kmph & 70kmph, regular driving, which is why I feel the mileage should have been better. What is the mileage others have noted for the crdi?

Yesterday the 'AIRBAG' light in the instrument cluster came 'ON' while driving home after dinner. Showed it today and they traced it to the seat belt lock, if there is another instance it shows up again, they agreed to change it. For now they erased the error code.

Because it was Sunday yesterday and I didn't know what to make of the AIRBAG light when it came up (I've spent my life in non-airbag Maruti's), I took the car to a person who worked with a Maruti dealer earlier, he advised me to take the car to the ASC. He also told me the suspension has become 'HARD' and I should get it replaced under warranty.

I reported this to Hyundai guys and they checked the suspension and said that everything is okay. They even took a trial run and explained via a simple demonstration by applying pressure on top of the boot saying it bounced back hence it is fine.

We have a warranty cover of 12 months and if the suspension needs replacement it needs to be done within this time frame, can I rely on what the ASC says or is there any other way to check it. I am contemplating whether to take it to the other Hyundai dealer in Goa and get it checked.
In my previous post I did mention that the car does not feel as soft as a Dolphin Honda City (NHC), now not sure whether it is designed like wise, don't have another Embera to cross check with.

I request others to please shed more light.

Since people are not familiar with the Embera I do come across interesting amusing comments, someone asked me whether it is a 6 cylinder, looking at the long bonnet, Another called it an Accord. :-)
Since it flaunts VIP no plates, one young chap pulled over and asked if I am the politicians son.
Overall its been an interesting week.

[s_pphilip]

Originally Posted by Pacifica

s_pphilip, I own a Feb 2008 Sonata Embera AT Petrol.
The Embera is a fine car - reliable, safe, staid driving, low maintenance, and comfortable.
Since I bought the car I have driven it Delhi - Haridwar, Delhi - Chamba, Delhi - Pune (with my only my dog for company), Pune - Bangalore - Salem - Bangalore - Pune, Pune - Alibagh, Pune - Bombay - Pune, etc. Never once had a single problem - touch wood.

VERY comfortable seats,

Pacifica, that is a lot of miles.
A question though vague, can you clarify whether the dolphin Honda City (NHC) has a softer ride than Embera? The reason for me asking this is in my previous post and I haven't come across another Embera to compare the suspension.
I found the NHC softer and also a Maruti service chap I ran into said the suspension is HARD.
The mileage too is a bit low from what I expected, rest all is good for now.
Thanks for your help.

[s_pphilip]

Two and half weeks and 2k kms that the car is with me, I thought I shall write my perspective of the car in its current state, though this may be irrelevant as I don't see many interested in the Sonata.

Weakness (scope for improvements) first:

Pain to shift to 1st gear, it needs multiple attempts, also impossible to crawl in 2nd as it stalls easily, gearing hence not at all suited for the slow driving.

Not as soft as Honda City, somehow I find Honda City (NHC) quite soft, potholes are better absorbed at speeds of around 40kmph.
(Is this feeling because of the leather covers as the leather will have become comparably harder in 5 yrs, the City I constantly compare to has fabric seats, I believe something like this does happen)

Very lethargic/not agile, can't change direction swiftly and any input you provide is not based on reflex but premeditated.

You can feel the power only if you are above 80kmph, hence not suited for everyday drives. The RC book says 140HP, this surprises me.

Maybe because it is a 5 yr model, but the controls like accelerator pedal, brake pedal feel like they have a lag in it.

Mileage is unexpectedly low, about 12 with a/c and about 13 w/o a/c or minimal a/c. I thought it will give about 14/15 respectively.
(Is there something that needs to be done to get better efficiency?)

The locking system is weird, (I noticed it is the same for i20 too), the front doors can be opened from inside even if you lock it centrally, dangerous for old people or children, small children need to be kept in the rear seat only.
Also the doors auto lock only after the speed crosses 40kmph, I think it should have been programmable to a lower figure.

Lack of bottle holders, if you keep a full 1 ltr bottle in the cup holders next to the gear lever, on braking hard the bottle jumps out as it does not stay tight. Bottle holders in the doors would be deeper hence hold them tight. The seat back pockets don't stretch. A night out for drinks means lots of water bottles as alcohol is a diuretic. I don't but friends do.

Very Noisy engine, you need the music constantly, but most crdi's are.

I think this car has only 1 trip meter, which is bad, there is a multi-information display but that does not provide any useful information, the distance to empty rapidly keeps reducing, which is scary.

In 2 days driving I use up about 19 ltrs of fuel which is way higher than what petrol swift needs. (Our weekend route is quite constant).

Pluses:

Though this is not a young fresh design, it is pretty graceful/proportional and does not look odd from any angle.

The big car looks can hence be attraction in a small town.

The occasional highway straight drives is a delight. It feels comfortable at speeds like 90kmph.

Space and Leather around you.

Maintenance and Reliability and Spares: can't comment yet.

Something to highlight, because I am moving around in the Sonata, my whole driving style has changed, I let others overtake me because this car is not agile like the Swift, here, press the accelerator to up the pace and response is pathetic at slow speeds, I take corners slow, reverse slow, and prefer driving in a lower gear to keep the engine above 1k/1.2k rpms. Even the manual recommends that 6th gear should have the car running around 80/90kmph. There are hardly any roads in Goa for this.

Now I realize why this car didn't do exceptionally well as I find the Honda City an amazing product at 2/3rd the price. Also why ACM kept insisting on the Skoda's though we were really reluctant on Skoda's. Maybe since Pacifica has petrol the petrol must be ultra responsive and hence characteristics different.

Our priority was space and comfort and hence it fits the bill based on our priorities. If it could have addressed the other mechanical concerns it would have made a great case. I am willing to ignore the dashboard as I have started accepting it and is okay.

We are looking forward to many happy miles. We plan to drive down to Kerala to witness the Onnam festivities this year, those long drives will get the car back in color.