[xander]

Originally Posted by dark.knight

Another game-changing product to counter the "ceramic" or "quartz" mafia charging a bomb for their services.

This is a spray sealant, and not in the league of coatings. There is one more video from Pan himself which shows its beading properties disappearing after a simple wipe with an APC.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQZgl8CR6o0

These products can however be used on top of the ceramic coatings after a while to boost the gloss and beading.

[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by xander

There is one more video from Pan himself which shows its beading properties disappearing after a simple wipe with an APC.

Why would anyone use a APC over a wax or sealant coated car? It's like a girl applies a makeup and uses a scrubber to see how durable it is.

APC are very harsh and used for cleaning purposes of alloys, tyres, wheel wells etc.

Amount of money people these days spend on so called CERMAIC Coating is again beyond me. 9H is nothing but marketing BS. Put that amount in FD and on interest earned you can buy different car care stuff for your car to try various wax and sealant for a lifetime.

End of the day Ceramic coatings aren't durable and your car will still develop swirls and scratches no matter what. Again spend a bombshell to have it renewed?

Want to prevent it, get PPF and cover complete car with it. Watch some videos from Shmee150 channel.

Ceramic coatings are like nail polish, once applied no ones knows how to get it off. You would need to sand it. Market is so new that people haven't realized it yet.

With wax and sealant you can take it off easily and try new one without breaking a sweat. Believe me they are durable.

Trust me nothing beats Carnauba wax. My choice sealant, best of both worlds.

Happy detailing.

[devilwearsprada]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Want to prevent it, get PPF and cover complete car with it. Watch some videos from Shmee150 channel.

Ceramic coatings are like nail polish, once applied no ones knows how to get it off. You would need to sand it. Market is so new that people haven't realized it yet.

With wax and sealant you can take it off easily and try new one without breaking a sweat. Believe me they are durable.

Trust me nothing beats Carnauba wax. My choice sealant, best of both worlds.

Happy detailing.

Please do some research sir, it will help you a lot.

1. Good quality PPF such as XPEL which is self healing costs a bomb too, close to 2L for the car. Any normal PPF will develop more swirls than any coating over time.

2. Market isn't new, and no you don't need to sand it. Most coats need not be removed unless they have to be reapplied in which case most appliers such as CeramicPro can remove it using their own removal kits.

3. Wax is the least durable of the lot and masks swirls, doesn't protect it.

My car got dinged multiple times and the UNCR coat took the paint transfer, one clean wipe and the paint was back to shining.

For the swirls a simple polishing coat will take care of it and will only remove 0.5 micron of the 3 micron coat.

[NOS Power]

On the very same point, try using an APC on a proper ceramic coat, I mean from proper brands, like either Carpro, Gyeon, Gtechniq, Max Protect, IGL, Kamikaze or Optimum Polymer Technologies. I'm sure one will run out off APC before the coating stops working completely.

Wax looks great, and that's it. Protection wise, it's the worst. Next up is sealant. And in our Indian climate, I have hardly seen any sealant top 6 months of durability.

Ceramic Coatings are a different league altogether. Especially when it comes to protecting the paint.

But I do get your point why some think it's a waste off money. It's due to the prices charged by companies like Ceramic Pro. It just doesn't make sense.

Especially when you consider the point that these very companies haven't been in India for 5 years, then how can they know whether their coating lasts that long. Especially in our climate.

Results from abroad make no sense in our country.

But on the same hand, there are people who have been using such coatings in India for a long time and seeing the real world advantage of having a Ceramic Coating on their car. Coatings like Carpro, Gyeon, Max Protect and Optimum have been in India for around 5-6 years. And the detailers who have been using these brands for a while must be having repeat clients else they would have run out of business considering the competition.

So it's more a question of making the right choice for you instead of going with the market hype or rat race. Whatever suits you.

Disclaimer: I have always been a wax guy. Still keep looking out for deals on waxes. That said, you used the word Carnauba as being ultimate. I have seen that name on a jar of Formula 1 which costs approx Rs. 350. And I've seen many waxes which actually have Carnauba cost more than a full Ceramic Coating service.

So it's all about what suits you. But at the end of the day, everything has a plus and a minus point.

[xander]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Why would anyone use a APC over a wax or sealant coated car?

To test the durability of course.

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Trust me nothing beats Carnauba wax. My choice sealant, best of both worlds.

How many ceramic coatings did you test out to come to that conclusion?

[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by devilwearsprada

Please do some research sir, it will help you a lot.

Detailing my cars since April 2011 as I owned a Black VW Vento that too having a Black Pearl Effect paint. Much superior to even metallic paints. Even my current car BMW X1 is Sparkling Brown another unique shade which is Black/Brown + lots of sparkles.

Originally Posted by devilwearsprada

1. Good quality PPF such as XPEL which is self healing costs a bomb too, close to 2L for the car. Any normal PPF will develop more swirls than any coating over time.

PPF will save you from stone chips, save your bumper in an event for accident by taking maximum impact. No coating will do that.

Swirls only develop when you don't properly maintain and care irrespective of product.

Originally Posted by devilwearsprada

CeramicPro can remove it using their own removal kits.

Do you have an image of it? What it comprises of? That is something I would like to learn.

Originally Posted by devilwearsprada

3. Wax is the least durable of the lot and masks swirls, doesn't protect it.

But gives the highest gloss of all. Wax never masks swirls, that's the work of polish, correct term being fillers contained in polish.

Originally Posted by devilwearsprada

My car got dinged multiple times and the UNCR coat took the paint transfer

What is UNCR?

Originally Posted by devilwearsprada

My car got dinged multiple times and the UNCR coat took the paint transfer, one clean wipe and the paint was back to shining.

Paint transfer can easily be removed from any car using a rubbing compound. Just a wipe, that may be over exaggeration.

Originally Posted by devilwearsprada

For the swirls a simple polishing coat will take care of it and will only remove 0.5 micron of the 3 micron coat.

Did you measure it, when they applied and when they compounded? Or just a marketing gimmick?

Originally Posted by NOS Power

Wax looks great, and that's it. Protection wise, it's the worst. Next up is sealant. And in our Indian climate, I have hardly seen any sealant top 6 months of durability.

2 months is the ideal. Using Blackfire Wet Diamond.

Originally Posted by NOS Power

But I do get your point why some think it's a waste off money. It's due to the prices charged by companies like Ceramic Pro. It just doesn't make sense.

That's the whole point. Even after you get your car Ceramic coated until you maintain it correct way; all your money is down the drain. Its not going to work unless you maintain it.

That's why rather use good shampoo, clay, compound, polish, sealant, wax and maintain your car. Plus save some good amount of money.

Originally Posted by NOS Power

Coatings like Carpro, Gyeon, Max Protect and Optimum have been in India for around 5-6 years. And the detailers who have been using these brands for a while must be having repeat clients else they would have run out of business considering the competition.

There are plenty of gullible customers. When someone can market 9H pencil as a test for hardness for car coating, then anything is possible. End of the day people see that shine is there, which is achievable by even a low quality spray wax.

Main thing is paint correction and surface prep. Coatings are just a topping.

Originally Posted by NOS Power

Disclaimer: I have always been a wax guy.

Same here. Nothings come close to the gloss of it. Got a can of Collinite 915 Marque d'elegance wax for those special times.

Originally Posted by NOS Power

That said, you used the word Carnauba as being ultimate.

By ultimate I mean't in terms of gloss. I should have been more specific.

In terms of durability Wax < Sealant < Cermaic Coatings

Gloss: Wax > Sealant = Ceramic Coatings

Price VFM: Wax/Sealant > Ceramic Coatings

Originally Posted by NOS Power

I have seen that name on a jar of Formula 1 which costs approx Rs. 350. And I've seen many waxes which actually have Carnauba cost more than a full Ceramic Coating service.

Formula 1 is even below average products. Not worth. Easy to find on shelves of every brick & mortar shop.

I used it the first time and once I used Collinite, Meguiars, etc; threw away every Formula1 products.

Originally Posted by xander

How many ceramic coatings did you test out to come to that conclusion?

I meant in terms of gloss and value for money.

[Lambydude]

I'm getting a new black car. I plan to ask my car washing guy (uses micro fibre cloth) to wash car the car after few months . If I do a ceramic coating, will it prevent swirl marks from appearing once the car wash guy starts washing the car daily?

Or should I invest in a car washer ( Bosch) and save some.money instead of ceramic coating.

I'm only concerned about swirl marks here. Not bothered about shine or scratches

[pratyush6]

Originally Posted by Lambydude

I'm getting a new black car. I plan to ask my car washing guy (uses micro fibre cloth) to wash car the car after few months . If I do a ceramic coating, will it prevent swirl marks from appearing once the car wash guy starts washing the car daily?

Or should I invest in a car washer ( Bosch) and save some.money instead of ceramic coating.

I'm only concerned about swirl marks here. Not bothered about shine or scratches

If you can completely avoid touching the car while washing it, then you do not have to worry much really. So, in that sense a Power Washer will do a good job. However, remember that power washers don't dry the car, which I assume you will use a decent micro fiber cloth for that. Then there is waxing. If you can take care of these, then it is obviously better than asking your local car washing guy.

I have had ceramic coating on my car; I found it expensive and not worth it, specially in Bangalore, with people always scratching your cars and doing what not. Save that money and invest in proper tools to wash, dry and wax your car.
Realistically, I don't think anyone can avoid swirl marks but we can try to keep it at a minimum.

[naveen.raju]

Got ceramic coating done on my car few weeks back. Full report and pictures here:

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/other...ve-cochin.html (Professional Detailing | Ceramic Coating | Car Care - DBS Automotive, Cochin)

[haisaikat]

Originally Posted by naveen.raju

Got ceramic coating done on my car few weeks back. Full report and pictures here:

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/other...ve-cochin.html (Professional Detailing | Ceramic Coating | Car Care - DBS Automotive, Cochin)

I read somewhere that if you do ceramic coating treatment, thereafter your regular car wash guy cannot wash the same way again, is it true? In your ceramic thread the before and after looks are day and night difference so seems your 25k paid off. Is it hard to maintain the shine going forward say after 2-3 months? You may need to get this done 1-2 times a year, so wondering if regular wax polish / teflon is cost effective for the shine part.

[archat68]

I imported Mr Fix 9H ceramic coating from AliExpress for around 7$. Going by the reviews from the Youtube I was quite sure that the product is a fake one and I took the application part casually and boy I messed up badly.

I had no decent polish and the car being comparatively in good condition I used the Meg's Ultimate Polish with a wool pad on DA, washed the car after that and applied the coating. Now the instruction says to apply to part of the panel wait for 5 minutes in summer and 5-10 minutes in winter and then wipe off with a damp MF towel followed by dry MF towel. What I did was I applied to the complete panel and by the time I completed a panel it was about 10 minutes, I tried to wipe off and it turned almost gummy and was difficult to remove. I applied some more of the coating and tried to wipe off. This time I could wipe off but there was already uneven streaking on the car. For the next panels I followed the instructions and there was no problem at all.

I thought that I will be able to polish off the unevenly applied panel. But with my my DA, wool pad and 3M one step finishing compound and a lot of work it is still there. So the coating is extremely hard and adhesion is extremely good. Remember I have not done any IPA wipe down of the car after polishing and it still managed to get bonded so well. The MF towels that I used for applications even after washing with a good detergent have become quite hard/rough.

[procrj]

Originally Posted by haisaikat

I read somewhere that if you do ceramic coating treatment, thereafter your regular car wash guy cannot wash the same way again, is it true?

Not really. Post curing/hardening of ceramic coat, you can wash the car the same way you have been doing.

Is it hard to maintain the shine going forward say after 2-3 months? You may need to get this done 1-2 times a year, so wondering if regular wax polish / teflon is cost effective for the shine part.

Most ceramic coats come with a fixed time duration during which they will remain effective. 1year, 2 years, 5 years and so on. Depending on number of layers and strength of ceramic used, you might need a top up every few years or so but not in a few months.

[::CMS::]

Originally Posted by archat68

Mr Fix 9H ceramic coating

Its not fake rather a slight different material but with same properties, polysiloxane.

I have also used this and its pretty good provided the surface is prepared well. Most coatings are high priced because of the time and effort involved in preparing the surface and making them flawless. The glaze is far better than any wax that I tried too.

Originally Posted by procrj

Post curing/hardening of ceramic coat, you can wash the car the same way you have been doing.

Irrespective of the coating brand, proper maintenance is a must to retain the finish. A bad wash is enough to create swirls and scratches, use proper no-non sense wash method.

[naveen.raju]

Originally Posted by haisaikat

I read somewhere that if you do ceramic coating treatment, thereafter your regular car wash guy cannot wash the same way again, is it true? In your ceramic thread the before and after looks are day and night difference so seems your 25k paid off. Is it hard to maintain the shine going forward say after 2-3 months? You may need to get this done 1-2 times a year, so wondering if regular wax polish / teflon is cost effective for the shine part.

They recommend using premium products while washing. After all, the coating has got a life and shall deteriorate over a period of time.

Many shops do offer free touch ups after the treatment and they also have many combo packages for lesser amount so that the shine can be retained.

Ceramic coating does provide a good layer of protection from scratches or minor bumps (sort of a PPF). Few days back a car hit my car and it was a pretty good bang. And I could see his bumper had scratches from the impact. My car too had few visible scratches but did go off with a wipe. The coating did save me some cash here .

[procrj]

Originally Posted by ::CMS::

A bad wash is enough to create swirls and scratches, use proper no-non sense wash method.

My assumption was that most folks here follow the two bucket rule and use MF cloth to wash their cars, which is what I meant by normal wash.

If you need to wash a ceramic coat car with expensive shampoo and sprays, then its really not economical and it might make more sense to get regular wax + sealant. The whole point of a hard layer over the clear coat is to ensure that the extra layer tackles the swirls, contaminants and what not thereby ensuring that your clear coat is safe and doesn't need to be cut often.