[AJ56]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

There may be instances where a mere percentage of a percentage can make a different (the tiny amounts of additive that change the nature of steels comes to mind) but, from what you say, this is not one of them.

Hopefully, the gentleman who was getting his graphene coating will get a great finish on his car anyway.

Yes very correct, in some products even a 0.01% change of ingredients can be massive, but the tests show otherwise for these coatings when put head to head against high quality ceramic.

I think too many people overestimate the role a coating/sealant plays in the final finish, it changes maybe 10% at best from a gloss point of view, 90%+ gains in gloss and optical clarity come from solid machine work to polish out each and every imperfection and make the clear absolutely flat. Coatings are then used to protect that beautiful finish from the elements. That’s why we so a lot of variation between different detail shops as the quality of workmanship varies greatly and two cars coated with the same brand of product can look quite different. Cheers.

[Thad E Ginathom]

Yes, it is the preparation work that makes the shine. I've always been tempted by ceramic, hence following this thread, but my temptation is not final shine but ease of maintenance and protection.

[Rahulinthecity]

Hello All
I recently purchased a new vehicle , a black Alcazar. While contemplating between regular detailing vs PPF vs ceramic coating , I came to know that 3M does ceramic coating for 25k which includes quarterly maintenance.
On paper the deal seems attractive compared to the other professional detailers.
Has anyone tried out 3M ceramic coating services ?

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by Rahulinthecity

Hello All
I recently purchased a new vehicle , a black Alcazar. While contemplating between regular detailing vs PPF vs ceramic coating , I came to know that 3M does ceramic coating for 25k which includes quarterly maintenance.
On paper the deal seems attractive compared to the other professional detailers.
Has anyone tried out 3M ceramic coating services ?

Don’t let your daily car cleaner + Hyundai service centre (when going for annual service) wash the vehicle and you won’t need quarterly ‘maintenance’. Paint that has been corrected and coated once doesn’t need periodic polishing unless swirls are reintroduced due to improper wash technique, max you’ll need is chemical decon with tar/iron removers every 6 months.

Keep in mind the only way to correct even minor defects in the finish is through abrasives (even fine polishes are abrasive) which will strip any ceramic coating applied originally, so make sure you ask the shop if they’ll actually reapply fresh ceramic coating every 3 months, chances are they’ll just use a sealant/SiO2 spray after polishing and give it back, since as a customer there is no way you can tell if the original coating has been stripped or not without extensive paint thickness readings on the same spot before and after initial coating application. Also, do check out other brands like Ceramic Pro, Detailing Mafia, Feynlab, etc.

[TheGearBox]

I'm being offered ceramic coating for 18k, and Teflon coating for 7k by a local detailing place. Which one is a better option? Or should I just avoid both?

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by TheGearBox

I'm being offered ceramic coating for 18k, and Teflon coating for 7k by a local detailing place. Which one is a better option? Or should I just avoid both?

18k is very cheap for a professional ceramic coating, ask the shop what brand of kit is being used before going for it. It’s difficult to say if 7k is reasonable or not since you haven’t mentioned what make and model as pricing differs by size significantly, also your location matters, expect to pay more in larger cities as cost of labour/rentals is higher. Teflon is just a marketing term used by shops, ask them what steps will be performed, generally they will wash-decon-polish-protect. Ask them what brand of products are used. Look for good brands like Menzerna/Carpro/Gyeon/Wolfgang/etc.

[TheGearBox]

Originally Posted by AJ56

18k is very cheap for a professional ceramic coating, It’s difficult to say if 7k is reasonable or not since you haven’t mentioned what make and model

This is for a 2.5 year old C-Class.
I will admit that 18k for ceramic coating sounded very cheap to me too.
As far as Teflon goes, I've heard that the only purpose it serves is to give a glossy look to the car and it lasts for no more than 6-8 months.

[Thad E Ginathom]

This "teflon coating" has not been taken seriously on cars for a decade or more. I'm surprised it is still being offered.

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by TheGearBox

This is for a 2.5 year old C-Class.
I will admit that 18k for ceramic coating sounded very cheap to me too.
As far as Teflon goes, I've heard that the only purpose it serves is to give a glossy look to the car and it lasts for no more than 6-8 months.

Gloss is a obtained by paint correction via fine abrasives and a polishing pad, you can have a single polishing step or multiple steps depending on your paint condition and budget. Regarding durability please see my post above, as long as you have solid wash technique you don’t need to go back and polish paint again and again. The only reason gloss levels drop over time is because of micro marring (also called swirls) being inflicted on the paint by improper washing. If in doubt, don’t wash leave it dirty, all it takes is one wash with poor technique to ruin a perfectly polish paint finish (modern clearcoats are very soft). Once your washing is on point, you’ll need to reapply protection in the form of waxes/sealants every 1-2 months and maybe a chemical decon every 6 months, that’s it.

[rbp25]

People who have done ceramic coatings on their car, what are your daily/weekly maintenance routines like?

Not sure if the waterless products such as Proklear would eat into the coatings. Should I just stick with the 2 bucket method and a 3M shampoo ?

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by rbp25

People who have done ceramic coatings on their car, what are your daily/weekly maintenance routines like?

Not sure if the waterless products such as Proklear would eat into the coatings. Should I just stick with the 2 bucket method and a 3M shampoo ?

Waterless wash products don’t ‘eat into’ the coatings, but you will end up with micro marring over time as it’s nowhere near as safe as a touchless or multi mitt wash method with a foam cannon and pressure washer. Your coating will still protect the paint but self cleaning ability and gloss will be lost.

Best practice is to use soft water in a pressure washer + foam cannon followed by multiple mitts in a bucket, with each mitt only used over 1-2 panels and then tossed in the laundry bucket, zero risk of cross contamination (unlike 2 bucket method) and eliminates the need for grit guards or a secondary bucket. To dry use an air blower (electric leaf blowers work well) to avoid touching the paint unnecessarily. There are much better shampoos out there than 3M, try Gyeon Bathe, Meguiar’s Ultimate Snow Foam, etc.

Now if the above is too much work (it is without the right equipment), just perform a touchless rinse with a pressure washer and use a leaf blower to dry, you’ll remove 90%+ of the dust safely. Whenever you feel the need, take it somewhere where they have soft water + correct technique to perform a foam wash safely. Cheers.

[krishnakumar]

Hi all,

I've just taken delivery of a new Mahindra XUV3OO yesterday. It's the Aqua Marine color, which is essentially a dark green, so it is said to be a bit of a scratch magnet. Can someone please help me understand the below regarding Ceramic Coating and PPF?

1. I see that there are 2 school of thoughts on this: (1) do the coating/PPF immediately after purchase to preserve the factory quality of body (2) get the coating done after a year or two, to give the car a new spruce of life. What is the recommended approach here based on your experience?
2. Does PPF also have hydrophobic properties?
3. Which are some of the brands that are recommended for both Ceramic/PPF?
4. I understand that ceramic doesn't have self-healing properties. But would it still be able to protect the body from swirl marks, dust/twig scratches? Or is PPF needed for them?

The car is primarily bought for highway roadtrips with possible mild offroads to get to campsites or homestays.

My car will be parked in a basement (except when we travel). I don't have any outlets (both power & water) in the apartment basement to do the cleaning myself using pressure washer.

My idea is to use Jopasu duster, microfibre cloth and a bucket of water to clean the car once every week. And take the car to a detailing shop once in quarter or so. For the above routine, what's the recommended application to protect the body?

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by krishnakumar

Hi all,

1. I see that there are 2 school of thoughts on this: (1) do the coating/PPF immediately after purchase to preserve the factory quality of body (2) get the coating done after a year or two, to give the car a new spruce of life. What is the recommended approach here based on your experience?
2. Does PPF also have hydrophobic properties?
3. Which are some of the brands that are recommended for both Ceramic/PPF?
4. I understand that ceramic doesn't have self-healing properties. But would it still be able to protect the body from swirl marks, dust/twig scratches? Or is PPF needed for them?

My idea is to use Jopasu duster, microfibre cloth and a bucket of water to clean the car once every week. And take the car to a detailing shop once in quarter or so. For the above routine, what's the recommended application to protect the body?

1) The only correct school of thought is to protect your paint immediately upon delivery as it leaves the factory unprotected, you can use a wax or paint sealant if you don’t want a ceramic coating. Postponing this decision will only lead to a more aggressive approach being used by the detailer later to remove defects in the paint before applying protection (be it a coating or otherwise). Doing it immediately will result in a much less aggressive approach as in most cases only a finishing polish is needed to remove light swirls inflicted by the dealer before delivery.

2) Certain brands of PPF are pre coated but these coatings are nowhere near as durable as a professional ceramic coating, other brands are not treated at all and can be protected with products used on paint.

3) Ceramic - Kamikaze Miyabi/Zipang coat, Carpro Finest Reserve, Gyeon Mohs, Opticoat Pro+, etc.
PPF - Xpel, 3M, Optimum self heal, etc.

4) There are self healing ceramic coatings in the market from brands like Feynlab and Kamikaze (Zipang coat is self healing). You must understand however that a coating can only self heal upto it’s own thickness which is 4-8 microns at best for a multi layer system.

No coating can protect from anything more than very, very mild surface abrasions, twigs and improper washing will damage the finish but if the damage is light, it may not penetrate the coating and so when correcting paint thickness isn’t affected. PPF will obviously protect to a much greater extent as it’s much thicker.

I’d say avoid the duster as dry wiping with it will scratch the coating. Get a good waterless wash like optimum no rinse (ONR) + 7-8 400 gsm plush edgeless microfibre towels (like the Eagle edgeless from the Rag Company) and spray and wipe each panel for removing light dust in between washes.

Best application is to work from top to bottom as you have the lightest contamination at the top. Flip to a fresh towel side each time, specially after the first pass as that picks up a lot of dirt.
Do not apply anything more than very light pressure otherwise you’ll leave swirls behind, if something isn’t wiping off, leave it and take it to a detailer or use a pressure washer to safely remove.
Avoid cross contamination by using your paint towels on the glass/interior/plastic trim, etc. use separate towels for that (colour coding really helps here). Cheers.

[Sahil00090]

Hi everyone,

I purchased a Polo TSI in August 2021, Sunset Red (Metallic), the car has some very minute spray paint marks on 60-70% of car body and this makes the surface feel rough. This is on glasses as well.

3M suggested claying will get rid of it.

Can anyone suggest what could be the best approach? Also, can you please suggest a good detailing store in Delhi/NCR.

P.s. I got the rear left door repainted at the VW ASS but I don't remember if the spray paint marks were before that or not.

[AJ56]

Originally Posted by Sahil00090

Hi everyone,

I purchased a Polo TSI in August 2021, Sunset Red (Metallic), the car has some very minute spray paint marks on 60-70% of car body and this makes the surface feel rough. This is on glasses as well.

3M suggested claying will get rid of it.

Can anyone suggest what could be the best approach? Also, can you please suggest a good detailing store in Delhi/NCR.

P.s. I got the rear left door repainted at the VW ASS but I don't remember if the spray paint marks were before that or not.

Most likely it happened during the repaint as the dealer (have faced it multiple times with Honda) didn’t bother masking the other panels and windows before respraying your door.

Clay may or may not remove paint overspray as each case varies, even if it does it will leave micro marring (fine swirls) in the paint as clay is abrasive and will require at least a 1 step paint correction to fix correctly.
In some cases you’ll need to wetsand as the absolute last resort but that is more an exception than the norm.

As detailers, we start with the least aggressive approach and step up until we get the results we’re aiming for, that’s the safest approach in my opinion. Would be more than happy to help you as I operate a detailing centre in Gurgaon - 5C Car Care. You can message for contact details or just put our name in google maps and you’ll get it. Cheers.