Increasing torque at lower rpms

chetanhanda · 3rd May 2007, 09:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by swathyd

Having torque at lower rpms ensure safe overtaking. Its sheer pleasure to have it between 1500-2500 rpms.

Can anybody suggest methods to increase torque at lower rpms without major alterations.

1] I would reccommend cams designed for low end torque and corresponding headers designed for low end power.
I think you have FiatAdventure , which has a DOHC..so I think there is more scope for adjusting your valve timing...
2] So depending on how much you are willing to spend you could go in for adjustable cam gears to adjust ur exhaust and intake valves timing separately with more accuracy..
3] And of course porting, polishing,val job etc does help as it makes the engine breathe better...

Now depending on what you have selected from 1,2 and 3 and how much you have deviated from stock you may need to alter fuel and/or timing curves. If you have done some only mild stuff with 1,2 and 3 you could possibly get away without a remap of fuel and ignition.
Again depending on you budget you could use a remapped ECU or a piggyback device to enhance/alter both the maps...
Everything depends on how much power you want and @ which rpm and are you willing to pay for it ..?

(This may not be reqd but just a thought.. if you did everything as mentioned above you would then feel the need for diff gear ratios as your powerband has moved elesewhere in the Rev range for which your gearbox was not dsigned for originally.. but this is going to far

)

mclaren1885 · 3rd May 2007, 09:24

Chetan , I am guessing that swathy has come here to find a solution to her low end torque problem and not change half her engine and drivetrain parts

.. And I dont think she is in the quest for more power either ..

Swathy , honestly I suggest you stick to a set of low torque headers and an accordingly setup FFE .. But it also depends on the torque characteristics of your engine ..

chetanhanda · 3rd May 2007, 09:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by theMAG

Karthik,
The afore-mentioned car's mileage drops to 9-10 kmpl while in batch mode, compared to 15 while on sequential firing; according to the owner - who's a very experienced driver. But - as you mentioned, I love that tuned ECU and the way power kicks in due to the batch mode - I wouldnt be surprised if I decide to get it for my Swift shortly.

Sure, you may have noticed the drop in mileage and increase in power, not doubting that.
But I'm not sure it is the batch firing which is the main factor causing this.I wouldn't agree that the batch firing causes 35% mileage drop and such a huge gain in power...
Comparing batch firing in stock to same stock with sequential firing I dont think there will be some much of a diff.
I agree to Karthik's point of view..

Quote:

Originally Posted by theMAG

Another unique thing that will work: get a remapped ECU to fire all injectors simultaneously rather than sequentially - as in stock. You'll NOTICE a difference. But the mileage will drop atleast 35%.

I have a small doubt here, can an OEM ECU firing injectors in sequential mode be simply remapped to run in batch so easily in India? becoz the ECU uses diff logic to locate TDC for batch or sequential.
Would love to hear more of these details..

chetanhanda · 3rd May 2007, 09:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by mclaren1885

Chetan , I am guessing that swathy has come here to find a solution to her low end torque problem and not change half her engine and drivetrain parts

.. And I dont think she is in the quest for more power either ..

Swathy , honestly I suggest you stick to a set of low torque headers and an accordingly setup FFE .. But it also depends on the torque characteristics of your engine ..

oops ..

agreed mclaren1885, maybe swathy should go along with minor stuff..

theMAG · 3rd May 2007, 10:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by chetanhanda

I have a small doubt here, can an OEM ECU firing injectors in sequential mode be simply remapped to run in batch so easily in India? becoz the ECU uses diff logic to locate TDC for batch or sequential.

As someone else asked me, I should have, in hindsight, made it clear that this remapped ECU is a different standalone unit- not the stock ECU remapped.

@ Swathy - coming back to your problem, get a FFE- tuned for low and mid range and a KN with CAI as the easiest solution to some increase in o/p. All the other solutions mentioned here are not cheap and will have a domino effect on other aspects.

Jaggu · 3rd May 2007, 10:32

coming back to original post, start with some good pipes and air fliter that should help you, once you are bored with it go for next level, porting/polishing etc and then if you have more money go for piggy back ecu or somthing.

having lived in TVM for almost 20 years, my advice to you is to get the job done somewhere in bangalore or cochin coz in TVM i dont know of any good garage competent for pipe jobs, yeah k&n can be done by any TDH

BEEM3R · 3rd May 2007, 12:36

Hey Guys. I just got a brand new black Swift VXi. Ive never done performance mods on a Car. Usually just do wheels. Ive done wheels already day before yesterday. I would like to to do an exhaust and Air filter. Could you suggest a good set up and a good place to go to In Chennai? And what rates I should expect so I dont get duped being new to this. I would really appreciate your help.

rdas45 · 3rd May 2007, 19:37

Hi,

I have a honda b16a dohc.. i have the adjustable cam gears.. what would be the best retard and advance on a NA car..?

Should I go 2 degree on the intake an Advance and a 2 degree retard on the exhaust... People usually do this combination... Or you can suggest me better

chetanhanda · 4th May 2007, 09:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdas45

Hi,

I have a honda b16a dohc.. i have the adjustable cam gears.. what would be the best retard and advance on a NA car..?

Should I go 2 degree on the intake an Advance and a 2 degree retard on the exhaust... People usually do this combination...
Or you can suggest me better

Thats a nice setup, is it JDM/USDM ?
There wont be a generic absolute setting for advance/retard which you are looking for on a NA car, you will have to tune it to match your setup.
You will have to 1st consider the cam profile you currently have, a +/- no of degrees would be diff depending how hot or how crazy your cam was and how your extractors are designed currently ?
Since u swapped in a B16 I'm 100% sure you are only interested in top end power and have pretty high overlaps,duration etc
But we can use a basic thumb rule ...for the kind of power u are looking for : open early and close it late, btw what are your cam timings currently can you share some numbers ? we can guess some overlap
etc from there... but anyways you will need a dyno to figure out the best timing or simply go with trial and error customised specifically to your setup.

chetanhanda · 4th May 2007, 11:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by theMAG

As someone else asked me, I should have, in hindsight, made it clear that this remapped ECU is a different standalone unit- not the stock ECU remapped.

ok cool,
.. I think we will take this up in more detail in a diff thread, we dont want to hijack this thread...

but I still feel batch/sequential firing is not the main reason.

vabs78 · 5th May 2007, 05:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by chetanhanda

ok cool,
.. I think we will take this up in more detail in a diff thread, we dont want to hijack this thread...

nothing left to hijack chetan

(no offence ment)

swathyd · 5th May 2007, 10:41

hey guys waht about porting and polishing with ffe and cai. It will increase the power by another 5% .What things should be taken care of while going for porting and polishing.

Jaggu · 5th May 2007, 10:57

porting and polishing are highly specialized job and will require a very competent person who knows the right calculation for the particular engine.

PM Psycho he might be able to give you some detailed info.

profold · 20th July 2009, 15:25

Hi friends,
I have come across the book ."Modern Engine Tuning", by A . Graham Bell (hopefully not the inventor of Telephones

), Hayness Publishing, 2002. ISBN 1859608663, 9781859608661
271 page full discussion on car performance improvement. By the keyword "Tuning" , the author covers all sorts of mods in engine ,cam shaft, fuel system,ECU, exhaust systems and more. Appears to be very practical with Dyno results.
Thanks to this, even I could make out some of what the experienced guys are talking about.
Would be helpful to nuby's like me.

Available in India from some online stores at Rs. 1542, free shipping.

3rd May 2007, 09:24	#32
mclaren1885 BANNED Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Bangalore (the city of modded cars) !! Posts: 4,820 Thanked: 45 Times View My Garage Infractions: 0/1 (10)	Chetan , I am guessing that swathy has come here to find a solution to her low end torque problem and not change half her engine and drivetrain parts .. And I dont think she is in the quest for more power either .. Swathy , honestly I suggest you stick to a set of low torque headers and an accordingly setup FFE .. But it also depends on the torque characteristics of your engine ..
	() Thanks

3rd May 2007, 10:32	#36
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,904 Times	coming back to original post, start with some good pipes and air fliter that should help you, once you are bored with it go for next level, porting/polishing etc and then if you have more money go for piggy back ecu or somthing. having lived in TVM for almost 20 years, my advice to you is to get the job done somewhere in bangalore or cochin coz in TVM i dont know of any good garage competent for pipe jobs, yeah k&n can be done by any TDH
	() Thanks

3rd May 2007, 12:36	#37
BEEM3R BHPian Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Dubai-Chennai Posts: 311 Thanked: 20 Times	Hey Guys. I just got a brand new black Swift VXi. Ive never done performance mods on a Car. Usually just do wheels. Ive done wheels already day before yesterday. I would like to to do an exhaust and Air filter. Could you suggest a good set up and a good place to go to In Chennai? And what rates I should expect so I dont get duped being new to this. I would really appreciate your help.
	() Thanks

3rd May 2007, 19:37	#38
rdas45 BHPian Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Mumbai Posts: 72 Thanked: 0 Times	Hi, I have a honda b16a dohc.. i have the adjustable cam gears.. what would be the best retard and advance on a NA car..? Should I go 2 degree on the intake an Advance and a 2 degree retard on the exhaust... People usually do this combination... Or you can suggest me better Last edited by aah78 : 3rd May 2007 at 20:55.
	() Thanks

5th May 2007, 10:41	#42
swathyd BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: thiruvananthapuram Posts: 774 Thanked: 25 Times	hey guys waht about porting and polishing with ffe and cai. It will increase the power by another 5% .What things should be taken care of while going for porting and polishing. Last edited by swathyd : 5th May 2007 at 10:42. Reason: jh
	() Thanks

5th May 2007, 10:57	#43
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,904 Times	porting and polishing are highly specialized job and will require a very competent person who knows the right calculation for the particular engine. PM Psycho he might be able to give you some detailed info.
	() Thanks

20th July 2009, 15:25	#44
profold BHPian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Kolkata Posts: 44 Thanked: 0 Times	Newbys' Guide for this Highly technical Engine Mod thread Hi friends, I have come across the book ."Modern Engine Tuning", by A . Graham Bell (hopefully not the inventor of Telephones ), Hayness Publishing, 2002. ISBN 1859608663, 9781859608661 271 page full discussion on car performance improvement. By the keyword "Tuning" , the author covers all sorts of mods in engine ,cam shaft, fuel system,ECU, exhaust systems and more. Appears to be very practical with Dyno results. Thanks to this, even I could make out some of what the experienced guys are talking about. Would be helpful to nuby's like me. Available in India from some online stores at Rs. 1542, free shipping.
	() Thanks