Cams for the Alto

harmon_bro · 23rd January 2008, 11:53

I have a friend with an Alto who has a already done basic mods on the performance end. Shaved head, Simota intake, FFE, Iridium plugs, plug wires etc. Now he wants to have a upgrade of the cams. Can someone please help him on this. The car is the 1061 cc block.

TARUL · 24th January 2008, 20:34

Hey bro are you going to take the alto to track or something,otherwise these mods are not recommended for a car that your going to be using on a daily basis.

harmon_bro · 24th January 2008, 21:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by TARUL

Hey bro are you going to take the alto to track or something,otherwise these mods are not recommended for a car that your going to be using on a daily basis.

Yes! Tarul the car will be on track.

TARUL · 24th January 2008, 23:30

The only person that I know & trust for performance mods is psycho,may be you should get in touch with him.

ananthkamath · 25th January 2008, 09:53

I believe the Alto 1.1 engine is a bored-out version of the old Gypsy 970cc engine (not 100% sure though). Get in touch with some of the guys who used to rally the old gypsies, they might hook you up with something. Your best bet is one of the old school guys like the Madans or Kamlesh Patel, or even Leelakrishnan in Coimbatore.

v1p3r · 25th January 2008, 23:16

Ananth, I don't think so. The Alto is the M800 F8 with a 4th cylinder. The old 1000/Gypsy engine is different, though of the same family.

ananthkamath · 26th January 2008, 04:57

The Gypsy is an F10A. The Alto 1.1 is called an F10D. Both have the exact same stroke (72 mm, incidentally same as the 800). The Gypsy gets its 970cc from a 65.5 mm bore, whereas the Alto gets its 1061 cc from a 68.5 mm bore. Its somehow easier for me to believe that Maruti wouldn't have gone to the trouble and expense of designing a whole new block, rather than re-boring the old one by 3 mm.

That F8 + 1 cylinder is definitely some crap cooked up by a smart journalist, no doubt aided by Maruti's marketing division.

v1p3r · 27th January 2008, 03:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by ananthkamath

That F8 + 1 cylinder is definitely some crap cooked up by a smart journalist, no doubt aided by Maruti's marketing division.

F8 is 3 cyl and 796 cc. Alto 1.1 is 4 cyl and 1061 cc. Same bore, same stroke. Do the math.

ananthkamath · 27th January 2008, 11:09

Too funny man, you thought I didnt do the math on that one. What I'm saying is they bored out the Gypsy block instead of building a whole new block. Go see both the blocks and I'll eat my words if they aren't the same.

Mpower · 27th January 2008, 19:31

I myself have been confused about this. Some detail engine pics of the M1000 and Wagon R blocks should clear it up.

im_srini · 25th March 2008, 15:16

To those who are on the lookout for cams for the Alto 1.1, you could try contacting N1 Engineering. They respond to your queries promptly and are generally a delight to work with. I understand that they've been working with Piper Cams for the past 3 years and have managed to re-profile cams for several Indian engines.

Piper can also be contacted directly. For a re-profile of a stock Alto 1.1 cam, you could be quoted around 200 GBP (~16K at today's rates). Of course, you'll have to provide the stock F10D camshaft (~2.5K) and pay for shipping to Piper and back.

Piper do mention that with re-profiling you can't get "crazy" profiles (300+) and higher lift. If you insist on 300+ profiles and higher lift, Piper can grind you a one-off billet cam, the quote for that is around 600 GBP (~48K) !?!

vdiatech · 4th August 2009, 22:47

hi, how much does a camshaft weigh approximately ? i am trying to buy one overseas and want to calculated the postage that would be passed on to me ?

thx

im_srini · 5th August 2009, 10:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdiatech

hi, how much does a camshaft weigh approximately ? i am trying to buy one overseas and want to calculated the postage that would be passed on to me ? thx

Hi, the weight of the cam would depend primarily on its size, which is usually proportionate to the size of the engine. The shipping weight of the cam for the Alto 1.1 was ~2.5 Kgs. I guess you can assume a maximum shipping weight of 4 Kgs to calculate freight charges.

Live To Jive · 5th August 2009, 10:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by ananthkamath

The Gypsy is an F10A. The Alto 1.1 is called an F10D. Both have the exact same stroke (72 mm, incidentally same as the 800). The Gypsy gets its 970cc from a 65.5 mm bore, whereas the Alto gets its 1061 cc from a 68.5 mm bore. Its somehow easier for me to believe that Maruti wouldn't have gone to the trouble and expense of designing a whole new block, rather than re-boring the old one by 3 mm.

That F8 + 1 cylinder is definitely some crap cooked up by a smart journalist, no doubt aided by Maruti's marketing division.

Quote:

Originally Posted by v1p3r

F8 is 3 cyl and 796 cc. Alto 1.1 is 4 cyl and 1061 cc. Same bore, same stroke. Do the math.

The F8 & F10D share a lot of parts. They have added a cylinder. The engines look quite similar. The gypsy engine is the same as the M1000 one right, which has a Cast Iron block but is similar to the Aluminium Zen (1.0) and Esteem (1.3) engines.

Quote:

Originally Posted by harmon_bro

I have a friend with an Alto who has a already done basic mods on the performance end. Shaved head, Simota intake, FFE, Iridium plugs, plug wires etc. Now he wants to have a upgrade of the cams. Can someone please help him on this. The car is the 1061 cc block.

What is a shaved head and how does it affect performance? (Assuming that you are referring to the engine and not the driver.)

23rd January 2008, 11:53	#1
harmon_bro BHPian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Madras Posts: 542 Thanked: 14 Times	Cams for the Alto I have a friend with an Alto who has a already done basic mods on the performance end. Shaved head, Simota intake, FFE, Iridium plugs, plug wires etc. Now he wants to have a upgrade of the cams. Can someone please help him on this. The car is the 1061 cc block.
	() Thanks

24th January 2008, 20:34	#2
TARUL BHPian Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: BANGALORE Posts: 117 Thanked: Once View My Garage	Hey bro are you going to take the alto to track or something,otherwise these mods are not recommended for a car that your going to be using on a daily basis.
	() Thanks

24th January 2008, 23:30	#4
TARUL BHPian Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: BANGALORE Posts: 117 Thanked: Once View My Garage	The only person that I know & trust for performance mods is psycho,may be you should get in touch with him.
	() Thanks

25th January 2008, 09:53	#5
ananthkamath Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mangalore Posts: 1,209 Thanked: 80 Times View My Garage	I believe the Alto 1.1 engine is a bored-out version of the old Gypsy 970cc engine (not 100% sure though). Get in touch with some of the guys who used to rally the old gypsies, they might hook you up with something. Your best bet is one of the old school guys like the Madans or Kamlesh Patel, or even Leelakrishnan in Coimbatore.
	() Thanks

25th January 2008, 23:16	#6
v1p3r Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: BLR / DXB / LON Posts: 5,334 Thanked: 6,896 Times View My Garage	Ananth, I don't think so. The Alto is the M800 F8 with a 4th cylinder. The old 1000/Gypsy engine is different, though of the same family.
	() Thanks

26th January 2008, 04:57	#7
ananthkamath Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mangalore Posts: 1,209 Thanked: 80 Times View My Garage	The Gypsy is an F10A. The Alto 1.1 is called an F10D. Both have the exact same stroke (72 mm, incidentally same as the 800). The Gypsy gets its 970cc from a 65.5 mm bore, whereas the Alto gets its 1061 cc from a 68.5 mm bore. Its somehow easier for me to believe that Maruti wouldn't have gone to the trouble and expense of designing a whole new block, rather than re-boring the old one by 3 mm. That F8 + 1 cylinder is definitely some crap cooked up by a smart journalist, no doubt aided by Maruti's marketing division. Last edited by ananthkamath : 26th January 2008 at 04:59.
	() Thanks

27th January 2008, 11:09	#9
ananthkamath Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mangalore Posts: 1,209 Thanked: 80 Times View My Garage	Too funny man, you thought I didnt do the math on that one. What I'm saying is they bored out the Gypsy block instead of building a whole new block. Go see both the blocks and I'll eat my words if they aren't the same. Last edited by ananthkamath : 27th January 2008 at 11:11.
	() Thanks

27th January 2008, 19:31	#10
Mpower Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 10,409 Thanked: 1,729 Times View My Garage	I myself have been confused about this. Some detail engine pics of the M1000 and Wagon R blocks should clear it up.
	() Thanks

25th March 2008, 15:16	#11
im_srini BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Portland Posts: 1,010 Thanked: 489 Times View My Garage	To those who are on the lookout for cams for the Alto 1.1, you could try contacting N1 Engineering. They respond to your queries promptly and are generally a delight to work with. I understand that they've been working with Piper Cams for the past 3 years and have managed to re-profile cams for several Indian engines. Piper can also be contacted directly. For a re-profile of a stock Alto 1.1 cam, you could be quoted around 200 GBP (~16K at today's rates). Of course, you'll have to provide the stock F10D camshaft (~2.5K) and pay for shipping to Piper and back. Piper do mention that with re-profiling you can't get "crazy" profiles (300+) and higher lift. If you insist on 300+ profiles and higher lift, Piper can grind you a one-off billet cam, the quote for that is around 600 GBP (~48K) !?!
	() Thanks

4th August 2009, 22:47	#12
vdiatech BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 414 Thanked: 10 Times	hi, how much does a camshaft weigh approximately ? i am trying to buy one overseas and want to calculated the postage that would be passed on to me ? thx
	() Thanks