Performance Mods for the Ol' Honda City

abhayshanu · 16th April 2009, 02:43

So the guy with the B18C isnt on T-BHP? really.Hmf and he calls himself a car enthusiast.

So has any one got specs? Is he running N/A or any FI?

v1p3r · 17th April 2009, 01:01

Most of the people involved in the project were on TBHP in one form or another -- moderators/members/guests. The engine had a flowed head, low-compression pistons and a massive turbocharger -- it was built abroad with a dyno chart in excess of 400 whp. The owner of the car lost interest after getting a more powerful -- and driveable -- car. The engine was removed and the car sold as stock.

abhayshanu · 17th April 2009, 01:11

Man.what a shame.I wish i would have atleast seen it.
Also why low compression pistons.Arent higher compressions suppose to be better?

ImmortalZ · 17th April 2009, 10:22

Low compression is better for forced induction applications.

abhayshanu · 17th April 2009, 12:54

Oh i really didnt know. So i should increase my compression if i dont have turbo and decrease it if i have one. How much bhp gain is there if we do increase the compression and also how to do so.
Recently been searching for turbos and came across a old type - Twin Turbo. Was impressed but more impressed with sequential turbos. Is it a good idea to get them? A small one and a big one. Small for the low rpms and the larger one for the higher ones. This way there will be less lag. Also i have heard and read that the B20 is a better base for a turbo than a B18c5 because it is larger. But if that is the case cant we just stroke and bore the c5 to a 2.0 L? Guys i am going to swap for major mods, Turbo, nitro, pro suspension, brakes, everything. My dream is to build a 500+ WHP car in india.

v1p3r · 18th April 2009, 03:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by abhayshanu

Oh i really didnt know. So i should increase my compression if i dont have turbo and decrease it if i have one. How much bhp gain is there if we do increase the compression and also how to do so.
Recently been searching for turbos and came across a old type - Twin Turbo. Was impressed but more impressed with sequential turbos. Is it a good idea to get them? A small one and a big one. Small for the low rpms and the larger one for the higher ones. This way there will be less lag. Also i have heard and read that the B20 is a better base for a turbo than a B18c5 because it is larger. But if that is the case cant we just stroke and bore the c5 to a 2.0 L? Guys i am going to swap for major mods, Turbo, nitro, pro suspension, brakes, everything. My dream is to build a 500+ WHP car in india.

If you are on the bigger-is-better trip, just buy an H22. Those are among Honda's strongest blocks. That's probably the best Honda motor to go over 450 wheel and fit in an OHC.

Or you could just buy a Supra.

doomsday · 18th April 2009, 05:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by v1p3r

If you are on the bigger-is-better trip, just buy an H22. Those are among Honda's strongest blocks. That's probably the best Honda motor to go over 450 wheel and fit in an OHC.

Or you could just buy a Supra.

Yeah, but getting the Supra over 500 ponies isn't very straightforward either- its out of BPU territory if one wants to see half a thousand horses on the dyno chart. Mostly involves a scalable 'big-single' route, depending on turbo choice and support mods- which won't come cheap, and doing all this in India will need means a lot of time and LUCK needs to be on your side. However, if done right 500whp Supras will be comfortably streetable.

I agree with the H22 bit though, its really the big-block in Honda's lineup. Ability to withstand a lot of cylinder pressure.

v1p3r · 18th April 2009, 05:16

BPU+ should take you to 400 whp, which is fair enough. It's a darn sight easier to build a Supra to that spec than an OHC.

abhayshanu · 18th April 2009, 07:06

First of all what is BPU? also that is the point, i dont want easy, i want it to be difficult, challenging. Also i do have alot of time but unfortunatly not so much money to go and buy a supra and then even build it.having a total budget of around 15 lacs for the upgrades will be enough, but 15 lacs wont be enough to even buy a supra.
Also i am not of 'the bigger the better' thinking, i was just saying that i have heard and i was just reminding that i will be turbocharging the engine so wanted to know which will be the best to handle pressure and get maximum bhp out.

Tejas@perioimpl · 18th April 2009, 09:42

@ abhayshanu

Just buy Jitu's OHC when he is bored with it...

Infact, Viper is starting another big project now (as per the grapewine) and his OHC should be up for sale as well!!!

abhayshanu · 18th April 2009, 09:48

dude i dont want it to be easy, i want it to be diffcult and complicated, also 250 whp is half of what i want. According to suggestion a H22a will be best but major mods to engine bay will have to be done, so still thinking of the best engine(H22a is still in the option, top on the list actually)

Here a discussion on H22a vs B18C5 - Which would be better? B18c5 vs h22? - Yahoo! Answers

Ford Rocam · 18th April 2009, 10:07

If you want it the hard way, then for your 500whp goal you need a very strong foundation & that is the Engine, fully build & reliable as hell to take all the abuse, to reach that power levels you dont need an H22 or C5. a basic b16/b18 should do as you will need to build it up anyway so why waste money buying expensive motor.You will need to have time,Patience & money to setup this kind of car.
Do a proper planning & go by stages & keep the moolah ready if you dont want any delay in setup.

good luck

ImmortalZ · 18th April 2009, 13:22

Twin turbo setups are very hard to do right. You'll need a proper tuner to get it running properly. As for going NA, you'll need race fuel to get high WHP numbers without FI. It is easier and more practical in India to go FI with our bad fuel. A good twin turbo setup will let you keep it as a daily driver as well.

And please, don't read stuff on Yahoo! answers. Go find forums with people who do this stuff daily and for a living. Drink up from that fountain of knowledge.

abhayshanu · 18th April 2009, 14:55

(@ immortalZ)Yes but if you read a guy who has swapped a h22a and b18c5 has commented. There is also a guy working for honda who has commented.

Also b18c5 is just a ported and polished b18c1, but the prices of b18c are like 4-5k $ and H22a are around 2-3k $ so definatly less, and thus a advantage, but the engine is still in the thought process, it will remain for atleast 1 more year, it is only in 2011 will i swap, so till then i will be studing, learning, arranging, finding, testing, buying, importing and installing.

I have gained alot of knowledge in the last month, nearly as much as i have gained in the last year thank to this wonderfull forum and its members, i sincerly thank all of you from the deepest pits of my heart.

v1p3r · 18th April 2009, 20:38

Upto 400 whp the easiest motor to turbo cheap which will plonk into the OHC is the D16Y8. Over that H22. Jitu, don't you think it'll be easier to use an H22 just because of the displacement?

16th April 2009, 02:43	#76
abhayshanu BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Mumbai Posts: 708 Thanked: 324 Times View My Garage	So the guy with the B18C isnt on T-BHP? really.Hmf and he calls himself a car enthusiast. So has any one got specs? Is he running N/A or any FI?
	() Thanks

17th April 2009, 01:01	#77
v1p3r Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: BLR / DXB / LON Posts: 5,334 Thanked: 6,896 Times View My Garage	Most of the people involved in the project were on TBHP in one form or another -- moderators/members/guests. The engine had a flowed head, low-compression pistons and a massive turbocharger -- it was built abroad with a dyno chart in excess of 400 whp. The owner of the car lost interest after getting a more powerful -- and driveable -- car. The engine was removed and the car sold as stock.
	() Thanks

17th April 2009, 01:11	#78
abhayshanu BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Mumbai Posts: 708 Thanked: 324 Times View My Garage	Man.what a shame.I wish i would have atleast seen it. Also why low compression pistons.Arent higher compressions suppose to be better?
	() Thanks

17th April 2009, 10:22	#79
ImmortalZ Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,179 Thanked: 488 Times View My Garage	Low compression is better for forced induction applications.
	() Thanks

17th April 2009, 12:54	#80
abhayshanu BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Mumbai Posts: 708 Thanked: 324 Times View My Garage	Oh i really didnt know. So i should increase my compression if i dont have turbo and decrease it if i have one. How much bhp gain is there if we do increase the compression and also how to do so. Recently been searching for turbos and came across a old type - Twin Turbo. Was impressed but more impressed with sequential turbos. Is it a good idea to get them? A small one and a big one. Small for the low rpms and the larger one for the higher ones. This way there will be less lag. Also i have heard and read that the B20 is a better base for a turbo than a B18c5 because it is larger. But if that is the case cant we just stroke and bore the c5 to a 2.0 L? Guys i am going to swap for major mods, Turbo, nitro, pro suspension, brakes, everything. My dream is to build a 500+ WHP car in india.
	() Thanks

18th April 2009, 05:16	#83
v1p3r Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: BLR / DXB / LON Posts: 5,334 Thanked: 6,896 Times View My Garage	BPU+ should take you to 400 whp, which is fair enough. It's a darn sight easier to build a Supra to that spec than an OHC.
	() Thanks

18th April 2009, 07:06	#84
abhayshanu BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Mumbai Posts: 708 Thanked: 324 Times View My Garage	First of all what is BPU? also that is the point, i dont want easy, i want it to be difficult, challenging. Also i do have alot of time but unfortunatly not so much money to go and buy a supra and then even build it.having a total budget of around 15 lacs for the upgrades will be enough, but 15 lacs wont be enough to even buy a supra. Also i am not of 'the bigger the better' thinking, i was just saying that i have heard and i was just reminding that i will be turbocharging the engine so wanted to know which will be the best to handle pressure and get maximum bhp out.
	() Thanks

18th April 2009, 09:42	#85
Tejas@perioimpl Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bombay Posts: 4,423 Thanked: 9,581 Times View My Garage	@ abhayshanu Just buy Jitu's OHC when he is bored with it... Infact, Viper is starting another big project now (as per the grapewine) and his OHC should be up for sale as well!!! Last edited by Tejas@perioimpl : 18th April 2009 at 09:48.
	() Thanks

18th April 2009, 09:48	#86
abhayshanu BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Mumbai Posts: 708 Thanked: 324 Times View My Garage	dude i dont want it to be easy, i want it to be diffcult and complicated, also 250 whp is half of what i want. According to suggestion a H22a will be best but major mods to engine bay will have to be done, so still thinking of the best engine(H22a is still in the option, top on the list actually) Here a discussion on H22a vs B18C5 - Which would be better? B18c5 vs h22? - Yahoo! Answers
	() Thanks

18th April 2009, 10:07	#87
Ford Rocam BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Mumbai-India Posts: 878 Thanked: 23 Times	If you want it the hard way, then for your 500whp goal you need a very strong foundation & that is the Engine, fully build & reliable as hell to take all the abuse, to reach that power levels you dont need an H22 or C5. a basic b16/b18 should do as you will need to build it up anyway so why waste money buying expensive motor.You will need to have time,Patience & money to setup this kind of car. Do a proper planning & go by stages & keep the moolah ready if you dont want any delay in setup. good luck
	() Thanks

18th April 2009, 13:22	#88
ImmortalZ Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,179 Thanked: 488 Times View My Garage	Twin turbo setups are very hard to do right. You'll need a proper tuner to get it running properly. As for going NA, you'll need race fuel to get high WHP numbers without FI. It is easier and more practical in India to go FI with our bad fuel. A good twin turbo setup will let you keep it as a daily driver as well. And please, don't read stuff on Yahoo! answers. Go find forums with people who do this stuff daily and for a living. Drink up from that fountain of knowledge.
	() Thanks

18th April 2009, 14:55	#89
abhayshanu BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Mumbai Posts: 708 Thanked: 324 Times View My Garage	(@ immortalZ)Yes but if you read a guy who has swapped a h22a and b18c5 has commented. There is also a guy working for honda who has commented. Also b18c5 is just a ported and polished b18c1, but the prices of b18c are like 4-5k $ and H22a are around 2-3k $ so definatly less, and thus a advantage, but the engine is still in the thought process, it will remain for atleast 1 more year, it is only in 2011 will i swap, so till then i will be studing, learning, arranging, finding, testing, buying, importing and installing. I have gained alot of knowledge in the last month, nearly as much as i have gained in the last year thank to this wonderfull forum and its members, i sincerly thank all of you from the deepest pits of my heart.
	() Thanks

18th April 2009, 20:38	#90
v1p3r Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: BLR / DXB / LON Posts: 5,334 Thanked: 6,896 Times View My Garage	Upto 400 whp the easiest motor to turbo cheap which will plonk into the OHC is the D16Y8. Over that H22. Jitu, don't you think it'll be easier to use an H22 just because of the displacement?
	() Thanks