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Old 19th July 2022, 15:40   #5956
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

After using Mobil-1 0W40, Shell Helix Ultra 5W40 for the past three years, I am going back to Shell Helix HX 7 10W40 semisynthetic oil for my Alto's upcoming annual service. Price is Rs 645 per litre at the Shell fuel station. I did not find any significant difference between this oil and the other two synthetics, and my car runs less than 5k km every year anyway.
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Old 19th July 2022, 18:39   #5957
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by hserus View Post
The Shell Ultra ECT 0w30 is an excellent oil that fits your spec. You might also consider Castrol Edge 0w20 if it fits your budget, this is a fantastic oil. https://www.amazon.in/Castrol-03124-.../dp/B00JGQLZJ4
@hserus,

Thank you for your reply.

I am being a noob with oil specs. I'd like to stick to company spec.
The Castrol Edge is 0W-20. Will that be suitable for 0W-30 spec engine oil?
I am still unsure about these new gen turbo engines with BS6 fuel.

On the other hand, is it a suitable decision to replace company oil immediately after every service (a year or 10K km)? I hope that wonít harm the engine due to the back-and-forth oil changes between mineral and synthetic. What is your view on that aspect?

Also, can you please advise me if Bodmo is reliable to pick up engine oil or any other sites? I donít trust Amazon with such critical spares.

Brdgs
Sail
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Old 19th July 2022, 19:57   #5958
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

My humble alto had mineral oil change at 1000 kms, Mobil 0W40 fully synthetic at 5000 kms and every 5000 kms thereafter. The engine still revs like new, even after 85000 kms in 14 years. So synthetic really makes a difference (but at a price).
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Old 19th July 2022, 20:59   #5959
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

I have been buying the cheapest oil that meets the factory specifications, so far engine and car is doing fine, odd 2.3l kms.
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Old 19th July 2022, 23:39   #5960
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by jinojohnt View Post
My humble alto had mineral oil change at 1000 kms, Mobil 0W40 fully synthetic at 5000 kms and every 5000 kms thereafter. The engine still revs like new, even after 85000 kms in 14 years. So synthetic really makes a difference (but at a price).
Appreciate your care for the engine, with fully synthetic oil every 5000 km. But I feel this is overkill.

I have been chaging the oil in my SX4 (Petrol) every 10,000 km and I have used mineral oil throughout. The car has clocked 1,38,000 km so far and the engine still feels like new.
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Old 20th July 2022, 00:28   #5961
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by Sail View Post
I hope that won’t harm the engine due to the back-and-forth oil changes between mineral and synthetic.
In general, that is a bad idea. I experimented a bit with engine oils in my earlier driving days and formed a rough guide for myself based on experience, reading, own logic etc as follows:

1. For the selection of oil, try and stick with the manufacturer's guidelines unless there is a big enough reason not to.

Engine oil is a vital factor in an engine running well, and the manufacturer has done their research to come up with a recommendation. Chances of improvement surely are there, but we need to also consider the potential gain and potential loss.

2. To improve the life of the engine, especially one driven a bit hard or one which is to be kept for long, have gone for changing the engine oil sooner. In my beloved Optra Magnum, would change it at 7,500kms instead of 10,000kms. It worked very well. This change from the manufacturer's recommendation comes without risk.

3. If a change in engine oil is to be made, then make it once and then try and stick with it. The layer of oil in the chamber is a vital part of a well-functioning engine. Tampering with that layer repeately ] by changing oils is a bad idea in my books; even more so for Diesel/Turbo engines. I even avoid changing the brand with the same specs, let alone changing from mineral to synthetic or vice versa.

4. Try and ensure that the oil really is changed and is fresh. There has been a practice at many outlets to do make-shift filtering of old oil from one car and reuse it in another, which is a good recipe for a rough engine, poor FE, and kill its life. For cars not in warranty, this is really simple to do at a FNG witnessing the change personally. This oil change going wrong once might undo all the good other steps and recommendations might do.

For my needs, and I think for most, this is a conservative and good approach with improvements possible (as in point 2). Of course, one might choose less conservative and more aggressive approaches.

Last edited by Poitive : 20th July 2022 at 00:32. Reason: Refinement, added short para in the end.
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Old 20th July 2022, 08:43   #5962
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
In general, that is a bad idea. I experimented a bit with engine oils in my earlier driving days and formed a rough guide for myself based on experience, reading, own logic etc as follows:
@Poitive

Thank you very much for your thoughtful input.

Now, I would like to share a small incident that happened to me recently.
Sorry for going off-topic.

My wifeís Grand i10 AT (Dec 2016), has been serviced regularly (10K/1 yr) at Dee Emm Hyundai in Gurgaon for the past 4 years with fully synthetic oil. The car went out of extended warranty on Dec 21. Last service was done at 68.5K odo in Febí22 by my wife (obviously she did not check the car fully after the service). The full 10K service was done. After returning from ship in May, I found several problems with the car, including vibration, mis-alignment, suspension issues, etc. Recently, I took the car to Heera Motors (FNG) in Gurgaon. All issues were attended to, including a full service. I was astonished to see fully black engine oil drained out from the sump in front of me. And all this is within 4k of running from Feb 22 till now. The cabin AC filter was still old, spark plugs were not cleaned, coolant was not attended to, throttle body was not cleaned etc.

Now you see, this is the maker/dealer service we trust with our pricey possessions. Even if makers want to do the best for our cars, dealers will deviate for fat margins, and it is very easy for them to get away with one word "company instruction" and no one can say anything. They continue with rip-offs.

Coming back to my recent Kia Sonet acquisition, what raised my eyebrows is that for a mineral oil of 3.6 liters they are charging 2710+Taxes. Why not pay a little more and get the best oil for the engine as per company spec.

I am still looking for a solution, as I am not in great favor of changing mineral/synthetic oils at every service, and I agree with your # 2. I don't think Kia customer support can help much. But I am going dig it further with Kia, for a best solution.

Brdgs
Sail
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Old 21st July 2022, 04:59   #5963
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sail View Post
@hserus,

Thank you for your reply.

I am being a noob with oil specs. I'd like to stick to company spec.
The Castrol Edge is 0W-20. Will that be suitable for 0W-30 spec engine oil?
The company oil is not mineral it is a synthetic blend from shell, having seen the can. Any oil at all with a 0w low viscosity spec is going to be high quality, you can rest assured.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ~Zombie~ View Post
I have been buying the cheapest oil that meets the factory specifications, so far engine and car is doing fine, odd 2.3l kms.
It will do very well indeed but a truly good synthetic that fits the spec your car needs makes your engine run a lot smoother than a synthetic blend or mineral. You arenít going to see much of this difference if you just use the car in the city or short highway runs. Long trips on the other hand ..
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Old 21st July 2022, 08:53   #5964
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by hserus View Post
The company oil is not mineral it is a synthetic blend from shell, having seen the can. Any oil at all with a 0w low viscosity spec is going to be high quality, you can rest assured.
@hserus,

Exactly.
Any online search will reveal 0W-30 has to be some kind of synthetic.

As Hyundai has Shell synthetic oil options, my initial impression of Kia was also the same. But when asked (at two service centers in Gurgaon), they informed me that they are using Servo oil.
I am not sure why Kia / dealers are deviating from their spec given in the car's owner manual. The oil is very reddish in color. Not at all looks premium like golden or hint of yellow of synthetic or semi-synthetic.
And, I canít find any servo oil of the above spec in online search.

Right now, I have two options in my mind:

1. Do a full service at Kia with their oil, add some Liqui Moly Oil treatment and forget about it.
2. Do a oil service with Kia and immediately change over to fully synthetic (Shell Helix Ultra 0W-30) at an FNG, watch for a year.

Brdgs,
Sail
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Old 21st July 2022, 09:13   #5965
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

The servo oil that Hyundai / Kia use is a 5w30 that is good for BS4 CRDI / petrol engines. It is NOT meant to be used for BS6 cars.

Colour is not a useful guideline for whether an oil is mineral or full synthetic.

If Servo has a new 0w20 C3 / C5 spec they formulated specifically for Hyundai I am not sure, that is quite possible without the oil coming anywhere near the retail market. However, you had better see what is written on the barrel before you allow it to be filled in your car. Does it say ACEA A5/B5 (or A3/B4) or does it say ACEA C3 / ACEA C5?

As for your options - if the barrel (and the bill / part number in Hyundai's billing system) says this is 0w20 oil, go ahead and happily fill it. If it is a 5w30 that they also fill for BS4 cars don't fill that in a BS6 vehicle unless you like substantial engine work in the near future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sail View Post
As Hyundai has Shell synthetic oil options, my initial impression of Kia was also the same. But when asked (at two service centers in Gurgaon), they informed me that they are using Servo oil.
I am not sure why Kia / dealers are deviating from their spec given in the car's owner manual. The oil is very reddish in color. Not at all looks premium like golden or hint of yellow of synthetic or semi-synthetic.

Last edited by hserus : 21st July 2022 at 09:15.
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Old 21st July 2022, 18:41   #5966
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Quote:
Originally Posted by hserus View Post
The servo oil that Hyundai / Kia use is a 5w30 that is good for BS4 CRDI / petrol engines. It is NOT meant to be used for BS6 cars.
@hserus,

Thank you for your constant support.

Please find below oil spec as per car manual and 2nd last service invoice (which I received from previous owner). Both of them clearly indicating 0W-30, AECA C2. May be Servo is special engine oil for Kia.

Brdgs
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Old 22nd July 2022, 08:26   #5967
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

That is fine - but what was the oil as mentioned in the invoice when you changed oil? If that too is the C2 0w30 you're fine.

It is entirely possible for engine oil to be whatever colour the manufacturer likes, just because Shell / Mobil use a golden colour is no indicator of what kind of oil it is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sail View Post
@hserus,

Thank you for your constant support.

Please find below oil spec as per car manual and 2nd last service invoice (which I received from previous owner). Both of them clearly indicating 0W-30, AECA C2. May be Servo is special engine oil for Kia.

Brdgs
Sail
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Old 22nd July 2022, 09:56   #5968
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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That is fine - but what was the oil as mentioned in the invoice when you changed oil? If that too is the C2 0w30 you're fine.
@hserus,

This is a pre-owned purchase; the car has undergone two oil changes. Last one being at 19.5k Odo. The car is 1.5 years old (23K odo now) and still under company warranty + having extended warranty till 5th year.

Invoice (of 1st oil service which I got with papers) only mentioned about 0W-30 AECA C2. As per car manual, it is supposed to be fully synthetic. But service center guys are telling its not fully synthetic & as per Kia instructions they are using this oil from servo. I mean they are not opening any further path for discussion (As usual stuff). If I bring my own oil as per car manual (fully synthetic, 0W-30 AECA C2), they will put a note in service record, as a result engine warranty will go off.

Brdgs
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Old 22nd July 2022, 10:07   #5969
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Never mind the fully synthetic or not, the service centre people don't know any such thing.

What does the barrel or can in which the oil is available say?

If it says 5w30 just escalate saying wrong grade. If it says 0w30 ACEA C2 or any other ACEA C series oil then just fill it and move on, it should be fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sail View Post
Invoice (of 1st oil service which I got with papers) only mentioned about 0W-30 AECA C2. As per car manual, it is supposed to be fully synthetic. But service center guys are telling its not fully synthetic & as per Kia instructions they are using this oil from servo. I mean they are not opening any further path for discussion (As usual stuff). If I bring my own oil as per car manual (fully synthetic, 0W-30 AECA C2), they will put a note in service record, as a result engine warranty will go off.
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Old 23rd July 2022, 09:16   #5970
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Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Gulf Ultrasynth X Plus 5W30 3.5 litre can for just Rs 967 on Amazon India. Those looking for cheap yet good oil can go ahead


Link : https://amzn.eu/d/i8izWo0
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