ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

hellspawn · 14th December 2006, 14:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsk1979

What about those members who push their engines to the limits by simple and extreme mods or operating conditions
1. For example chipping, K&N, Free flow etc,. to get additional HP.

well these mods actually make an engine more efficient.k&n and free flow dont strain the engine rather thay help the engine perform better.members with swapped engined cars,turbos,nos etc do require synthetic oils.
but my question is "do you need synthetic oil for your every day commutes to the office".

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Moreover no matter whether machinery is old or new, won't better lubrication increase life. Esp during cold starts(5-10degrees at delhi winters) when the 20W40 oil will not be effective. When engine gets warm things are okay, but what about 2 minutes of torture your engine will go through because your oil was designed for minimum 20 degrees temperature?

where did you get the 20 degrees part from???
the 20 in "20w40" means the viscosity of oil at low temperatures and "40" means the viscosity of oil at normal running conditions.so a sae10w40 oil will flow better than 15w40 oil at the same ambient temperature.also the lower the initial number,thinner will be the lubrication film.
and how much life will be increased.do you as a user plan to use the car in that extra life that it gets. mineral oil can make the engine easily cross 150 k but by that time your engine would have lost its compression ratio,piston rings will need to be changed etc etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Also Indian driving conditions are very demanding. Lots of heat, cold-heat transformations can lead to sludge buildups. Somebody who changes oils every 6000kms or so will do okay with 15W40, but if you don't(which many people don't) a better oil will stay good for longer periods.

well what i would say is that its best to stick the manufacturer's recommendation and they are the best authority on what is required for runing the engine.after all they built it.
if you have done some serious mods to your cars,go for synthetic oils.
it all depends on what you expect from your vehicle.
whats the point of saying that synthetic oils increase engine life when we indulge in bunny hops from traffic lights,wheel spins,downshifting without blipping the throttle.....you get what im trying to say!!

sandeep108 · 14th December 2006, 14:56

I think to sum up:
1. There is very little or no perceived difference.
2. There is/may be long term benefit.
3. It is 3-4 times more expensive.
4. Still requires to be changed on as frequent basis as mineral oil. (even more if like GTO one drives @>6k rpm - are you always only in 1st gear? - my OHC 1.3 goes to 55km/h in 1st - your vtec would be more - 60 or 63km/h and no can do driving any faster than that even on expressway nowadays)
5. So it may be good for your car but definitely not on your pocket.

mithun · 15th December 2006, 05:12

My experience with semi-synthetic is quite a pleasant one for my bike although I have never used synthetics for my car yet....

I usually change the engine oil of my bike every 2500 KMS. When I've used mineral oil like Castrol Activ 4T for my Pulsar, I've noticed that the bike loses it's smoothness after about 1500 KMS. But it's not the same case whenever I've used semi-synthetic like Castrol Power 1, the bike will run with the same smoothness even after 2500 KMS and I've never even felt that it's time for the engine oil change.

2fast4u · 16th December 2006, 20:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by ram

How much more does one really want? At the end of the day, should the total amount spent on lubrication exceed the price of a new engine?
Regular oil changes with good mineral oils gives you decades of engine life anyway.

agree with you on this.
here in the gulf my old nissan 92 model is still going strong having done over 1,298K kms and its still on the same block piston enjoying its supply of mineral oil. its on castrol or nissan 20w50.

nitrous · 16th December 2006, 22:41

@2fast4u:1.3 million kilometres???

Pls tell me thats a typo!

2fast4u · 17th December 2006, 18:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by nitrous

@2fast4u:1.3 million kilometres???

Pls tell me thats a typo!

no nitrous thats right!! when i was leaving uae i met the first owner by chance who was in all surprise when he saw the car and also commented "nicely maintained". during the chat he mentioned that he had got the meter reset from 740k+ to 90k for disposing off. the 2nd owner added around 35 to 40k and now i am 3rd owner.
i too was in surprise when i came to know of how much the engine has actually run with no overhaul at least i have not overhauled it in near to 5 yrs now.

goldsun · 7th January 2007, 20:09

I have added OWS Synthetic oil along with OWS Iridium Spark Plugs to my swift, which has done 19k kms. Both along with the engine flush costed me Rs.6.7K. It is just 40+ km since the above changes and there are certain noticeable benefits, which are:

The engine is very responsive and starts up very quickly than before.
The lower end torque has improved a lot.
The engine seems to be smoother, as there is no vibration when the engine is under stress, which used to be there when doing at 35 kmph in 4th gear.

I am not sure whether Synthetic oil or the spark plug that has resulted in the above improvements.

harsh87 · 7th January 2007, 23:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by mithun

My experience with semi-synthetic is quite a pleasant one for my bike although I have never used synthetics for my car yet....

I usually change the engine oil of my bike every 2500 KMS. When I've used mineral oil like Castrol Activ 4T for my Pulsar, I've noticed that the bike loses it's smoothness after about 1500 KMS. But it's not the same case whenever I've used semi-synthetic like Castrol Power 1, the bike will run with the same smoothness even after 2500 KMS and I've never even felt that it's time for the engine oil change.

try veedol semi synthetic for bikes
my friend who repairs superbikes recommends it to all his customers
all his clients busas,r1,r6s etc are running on this oil
retails for 250 bucks a litre

sanjaymugur · 8th January 2007, 10:34

How is Castrol EDGE fully Synthetic oil.. anybody has used it here..

its grade is 5W-40..

sandeep108 · 8th January 2007, 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by goldsun

I am not sure whether Synthetic oil or the spark plug that has resulted in the above improvements.

More likely the spark plugs, they were due for change anyway at 20k. But your iridium ones should last maybe the lifetime of the car, if good petrol is used. Also new oil and filter, whether mineral or synthetic and a service - all would help with what you are experiencing.

Jr Godzilla · 9th January 2007, 12:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2fast4u

no nitrous thats right!! when i was leaving uae i met the first owner by chance who was in all surprise when he saw the car and also commented "nicely maintained". during the chat he mentioned that he had got the meter reset from 740k+ to 90k for disposing off. the 2nd owner added around 35 to 40k and now i am 3rd owner.
i too was in surprise when i came to know of how much the engine has actually run with no overhaul at least i have not overhauled it in near to 5 yrs now.

Simply amazing ride dude. Seen your car pictures and credit to you and the previous owners its simply too well maintained.

Credit also to the Oil companies and Nissan Engineering as i am amazed that you have not done an overhaul in 500+k kms. right!!!

hey since you ar in bahrain lets meet up some time.

sgmuser · 10th January 2007, 07:15

My experience with engine oil :
First I started to use Esso for my kinetic way back in 90s and felt a lots of difference. It was so smoother and felt comfortable at high speeds ie around 80-90kmph.
Then 2 years back I started to use Castrol Magnatec Semi Synthetic for my Nissan Sunny 1997 model which had done 45k then. Now its 125k and its stunner in terms of pickup in the signals. Even the Nissan service center guy is surprised with its smoothness, power and pickup, when he test drove mine for some other problem. Semi-Synth's price almost 2 times, I can extend the change period to almost double that mineral oil. I even tried Shell's Semi-Synth but to me Castrol is the best of the lot. The fully synth costs around double that of semi-synth and the workshop friend adviced Semi Synth is more than enough for sedans like Nissan Sunny.

Even my friend who had driven few models says the car feels very smooth even at 150kmph upwards. I know its because of the semi synth oil :-)

sameera · 18th January 2007, 20:46

I have a Zen Carb 1999 Dec. Two weeks back I got the service done. I put a K&N filter and Mobil1 SuperSyn engine oil. The after effect has been amazingly good.
No more cold starting problem
Engine response has been simply superb and starts up very quickly than before
Lower end torque has improved a lot noticeably
Engine smoothness is excellent and just half crank engine is roaring.
Vibration has reduce remarkably when the engine is under stress

My car has done 66K..and it still rocks....

Sameera
bangalore

moralfibre · 19th January 2007, 11:22

Can anyone tell me whether any engine flush is available for 4 stroke bikes with a wet multiplate clutch? I want to try this for my Unicorn.

ajmat · 2nd February 2007, 10:49

One thing I noticed when giving a pot of synthetic oil along with the car for service is that the manager realises that you are a car buff and will not mess around with you

14th December 2006, 14:56	#107
sandeep108 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bombay Posts: 1,050 Thanked: 302 Times	I think to sum up: 1. There is very little or no perceived difference. 2. There is/may be long term benefit. 3. It is 3-4 times more expensive. 4. Still requires to be changed on as frequent basis as mineral oil. (even more if like GTO one drives @>6k rpm - are you always only in 1st gear? - my OHC 1.3 goes to 55km/h in 1st - your vtec would be more - 60 or 63km/h and no can do driving any faster than that even on expressway nowadays) 5. So it may be good for your car but definitely not on your pocket.
	() Thanks

15th December 2006, 05:12	#108
mithun BANNED Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Cochin Posts: 2,195 Thanked: 268 Times	My experience with semi-synthetic is quite a pleasant one for my bike although I have never used synthetics for my car yet.... I usually change the engine oil of my bike every 2500 KMS. When I've used mineral oil like Castrol Activ 4T for my Pulsar, I've noticed that the bike loses it's smoothness after about 1500 KMS. But it's not the same case whenever I've used semi-synthetic like Castrol Power 1, the bike will run with the same smoothness even after 2500 KMS and I've never even felt that it's time for the engine oil change.
	() Thanks

16th December 2006, 22:41	#110
nitrous Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: UAE/Lon/Madras Posts: 6,965 Thanked: 325 Times View My Garage	@2fast4u:1.3 million kilometres??? Pls tell me thats a typo!
	() Thanks

7th January 2007, 20:09	#112
goldsun BHPian Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Mumbai Posts: 230 Thanked: 48 Times	Added Synthetic Oil to Swift I have added OWS Synthetic oil along with OWS Iridium Spark Plugs to my swift, which has done 19k kms. Both along with the engine flush costed me Rs.6.7K. It is just 40+ km since the above changes and there are certain noticeable benefits, which are: The engine is very responsive and starts up very quickly than before. The lower end torque has improved a lot. The engine seems to be smoother, as there is no vibration when the engine is under stress, which used to be there when doing at 35 kmph in 4th gear. I am not sure whether Synthetic oil or the spark plug that has resulted in the above improvements.
	() Thanks

8th January 2007, 10:34	#114
sanjaymugur BHPian Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 262 Thanked: 57 Times	How is Castrol EDGE fully Synthetic oil.. anybody has used it here.. its grade is 5W-40..
	() Thanks

10th January 2007, 07:15	#117
sgmuser BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chennai Posts: 755 Thanked: 1,124 Times View My Garage	My experience with engine oil : First I started to use Esso for my kinetic way back in 90s and felt a lots of difference. It was so smoother and felt comfortable at high speeds ie around 80-90kmph. Then 2 years back I started to use Castrol Magnatec Semi Synthetic for my Nissan Sunny 1997 model which had done 45k then. Now its 125k and its stunner in terms of pickup in the signals. Even the Nissan service center guy is surprised with its smoothness, power and pickup, when he test drove mine for some other problem. Semi-Synth's price almost 2 times, I can extend the change period to almost double that mineral oil. I even tried Shell's Semi-Synth but to me Castrol is the best of the lot. The fully synth costs around double that of semi-synth and the workshop friend adviced Semi Synth is more than enough for sedans like Nissan Sunny. Even my friend who had driven few models says the car feels very smooth even at 150kmph upwards. I know its because of the semi synth oil :-)
	() Thanks

18th January 2007, 20:46	#118
sameera Newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2 Thanked: 0 Times	I have a Zen Carb 1999 Dec. Two weeks back I got the service done. I put a K&N filter and Mobil1 SuperSyn engine oil. The after effect has been amazingly good. No more cold starting problem Engine response has been simply superb and starts up very quickly than before Lower end torque has improved a lot noticeably Engine smoothness is excellent and just half crank engine is roaring. Vibration has reduce remarkably when the engine is under stress My car has done 66K..and it still rocks.... Sameera bangalore
	() Thanks

19th January 2007, 11:22	#119
moralfibre Team-BHP Support Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: MH-12 Posts: 8,451 Thanked: 13,973 Times	Can anyone tell me whether any engine flush is available for 4 stroke bikes with a wet multiplate clutch? I want to try this for my Unicorn.
	() Thanks

2nd February 2007, 10:49	#120
ajmat Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 14,864 Thanked: 27,973 Times View My Garage	One thing I noticed when giving a pot of synthetic oil along with the car for service is that the manager realises that you are a car buff and will not mess around with you
	() Thanks