ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

nishantgandhi · 21st July 2009, 11:35

My Getz 1.3 is nearing 40k mark. I think I will go for fully synthetic engine oil at this service.

Which brand is most preferred? I somehow have comfort with Mobil1 and was thinking 5W-50. Is this the right one? Indicative costs on this thread suggest ~Rs 800/ltr.

What other things would I need? Flush? Which is a good brand here?

DieselFan · 21st July 2009, 11:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by janitha

But as per Quadrajet Manual, oil should be API-CH4+ or higher grade!

In which Case Quadrajet also is debarred from using Castrol Edge turbo Diesel.

amit_mechengg · 21st July 2009, 12:03

when i was looking for a synthetic oil castrol edge was costing me 2150rs. the dealer was very well saying its fully synthetic and oil change interval is 20000 kms

then i saw a can of petronas syntium 3000. after bargaining a lot he agreed for ~ 2200rs.
its fully synthetic oil and has following standards

PETRONAS Lubricants - Passenger Car Motor Oil

Standards
SAE 5W-40 API SL/CF
ACEA A3-98/B3-96/B4-98
DaimlerChrysler MB 229.3
Volkswagen VW 502.00 / 505.00
BMW Long Life LL-98
Porsche Approved

so far the oil has proved to be very good. have done almost 10k. my friend also picked up syntium 5000 for his swift. its a very good oil and VFM.

gpa · 21st July 2009, 12:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by nishantgandhi

What other things would I need? Flush? Which is a good brand here?

Mobil 1 is a good oil, you can also use Petronas Syntium and OWS as well. There is a whole thread on OWS in the technical section. Do check that out. As for the flush, you can go for the OWS flush or 3M as well.

Just be sure that every drop of the oil is drained out from the crankcase before filling in the new oil. Removing the dipstick and engine oil filler cap helps the drain process, by letting the air escape easily.

srikant · 21st July 2009, 22:08

So as of now i see that OWS and Mobil are the reliable synthetic oil for Swift Diesel.

R2D2 · 23rd July 2009, 23:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by gpa

I was looking to switch to Castrol's Edge at my car's 10K service and this is exactly what made me change my mind about it.

In the end I went in for Mobil 1.

Some info on Castrol Edge from their site. This dates back to when Edge was introduced in Jan 2006. Note the claim that it is fully synthetic 5W-40 oil meeting API SL specs. Which is now superceded by SM.

Castrol India - Castrol India launches Castrol EDGE

Rgds,

amit_mechengg · 31st July 2009, 13:58

my friend is using MOBIL1 fully synthetic oil since last 2 oil changes. now he wants to switch over to regular mineral oil.

which is the best mineral oil that is suggested after the use of synthetic oil. will there be any oil leakages? his zen has done about 70k kms.

Car&me · 31st July 2009, 14:10

My Cedia is 20K+ run and I am interested in changing the oil to Synthetic now (Sheel Ultra Helix).The manual says I should be using 5w 30 oil. Will get a 5W 30 in Shell Ultra Helix, if not what should I use?

Raccoon · 31st July 2009, 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by amit_mechengg

my friend is using MOBIL1 fully synthetic oil since last 2 oil changes. now he wants to switch over to regular mineral oil.

which is the best mineral oil that is suggested after the use of synthetic oil. will there be any oil leakages? his zen has done about 70k kms.

I don't think you will ever get a clear cut consensus on which is the best oil. You can change to any mineral oil of any reputed brand. Mobil itself has mineral variants... try those! That said, its a good idea to stick to one brand of oil...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Car&me

My Cedia is 20K+ run and I am interested in changing the oil to Synthetic now (Sheel Ultra Helix).The manual says I should be using 5w 30 oil. Will get a 5W 30 in Shell Ultra Helix, if not what should I use?

If you can't get the recommended viscosity, then its best not to consider a change.

Sawyer · 1st August 2009, 07:37

Here is slightly different spin on the subject. Regardless of kms run, changing the oil/filter at 6 months is a very good thing for engine life. Of course if you rack up kms at a high rate then this does not apply, follow the recommended kms for the change by the auto maker, even if the oil maker is ok with extended drain.
But the high cost of the synthetic should not deter you from following the 6 month recommendation. If it does, you are better off with a good mineral oil of the right grade, changed every six months at the outermost limit.
Along with good running in, this is the single largest factor in long and reliable engine life. And, in the case of turbo diesels, a well maintained air filter.
Bottom line, use synthetic if it is affordable under a regime such as this. Quite honestly, for ordinary road use, much of the premium that you pay is for the oilcos profits, and for your mental satisfaction. Engine life benefit would be a distant third place.
PS: Good running in practice includes an oil change at 1000kms, even if the auto maker does not see the need for it

gpa · 1st August 2009, 11:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sawyer

But the high cost of the synthetic should not deter you from following the 6 month recommendation.

This would apply to fully synth oils if your usage is extensive and driving conditions are extreme. Else, a good fully synthetic oil can be changed at the 10,000 kms or one year mark which ever is earlier.

Would make better sense to follow this for all mineral oils.

Raccoon · 1st August 2009, 15:09

^^^ Pretty much. The newer oils are good for 1 year (minerals included!). I guess older oils and cars needed a change every 6 months... hence these recommendations still do the rounds. Our car sees a change once a year, as recommened by Maruti. I don't see any sense in throwing out good oil every 6 months. This is of course assuming that the running does not exceed about 8 - 10 k km in that period.

Sawyer · 1st August 2009, 18:22

The stop start conditions in Indian cities, that do not allow for the oil to come up to full operating temperatures, allow for residue and water build up that then remains suspended in the oil, and qualify for what is described as severe operating conditions in most car manuals. I prefer to throw away my oil after 6 months, and I like the way my engines perform under this regime. It is even worse in the case of diesels, which hate stopstarts more than petrols.
Of course most people sell their cars in 4-5 years these days, so this is possibly not of interest to most people.
To each his own of course, it is just that my preference has been to not let oil that is more than 6 month use remain in the sump. Even if it is Mobil 1. Which is why I have now switched back to good brand minerals. Given my driving in the cities, where I do not explore the upper reaches of the rpm bands often, I find that this makes more sense. And economy.

R2D2 · 1st August 2009, 19:31

Simple arithmetic works here:

a) Cost of 4 ltrs of synth oil (say Mobil1) - Rs 4000/-
b) Cost of 4 ltrs mineral or semi synth - ~1200 (Castrol Magnatec) June 09 batch

Assuming a mfr recommended interval of 1 year/10K Kms, you could change the oil thrice over in a year for the cost of a synthetic fill and have a few hundred bucks left over. This is leaving environmental considerations aside.

OR, if I change mineral or semi synth oil at 6 month/5K kms interval I still save Rs 1600 on oil per annum. Not much in todays terms but these are tough times. Comon guys we all love our cars but lets not get carried away by synth. I'd have loved to use synth regularly had it been reasonably priced.

The choice is quite obvious for me at least.

Rgds,

motionfreak · 1st August 2009, 20:45

but as FIAT says about Linea, synt oli can be changed/stretched at 15K KMs.
Like my Mech, I feel that 10K is too early for Mobil 1 oil change. Just check if the Oil filter needs to be changed, due to clogged up sludge.

Interestingly, an acquaintance used (uses) Mobil 1 in his Car for 10K KMs , then uses it in Water pump and tractors at his farms in Nashik.

21st July 2009, 11:35	#1756
nishantgandhi Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mumbai Posts: 1,220 Thanked: 156 Times	My Getz 1.3 is nearing 40k mark. I think I will go for fully synthetic engine oil at this service. Which brand is most preferred? I somehow have comfort with Mobil1 and was thinking 5W-50. Is this the right one? Indicative costs on this thread suggest ~Rs 800/ltr. What other things would I need? Flush? Which is a good brand here?
	() Thanks

21st July 2009, 12:03	#1758
amit_mechengg Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Pune Posts: 2,488 Thanked: 2,252 Times View My Garage	when i was looking for a synthetic oil castrol edge was costing me 2150rs. the dealer was very well saying its fully synthetic and oil change interval is 20000 kms then i saw a can of petronas syntium 3000. after bargaining a lot he agreed for ~ 2200rs. its fully synthetic oil and has following standards PETRONAS Lubricants - Passenger Car Motor Oil Standards SAE 5W-40 API SL/CF ACEA A3-98/B3-96/B4-98 DaimlerChrysler MB 229.3 Volkswagen VW 502.00 / 505.00 BMW Long Life LL-98 Porsche Approved so far the oil has proved to be very good. have done almost 10k. my friend also picked up syntium 5000 for his swift. its a very good oil and VFM. Last edited by amit_mechengg : 21st July 2009 at 12:04.
	() Thanks

21st July 2009, 22:08	#1760
srikant BHPian Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Bengaluru Posts: 488 Thanked: 12 Times	So as of now i see that OWS and Mobil are the reliable synthetic oil for Swift Diesel.
	() Thanks

31st July 2009, 13:58	#1762
amit_mechengg Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Pune Posts: 2,488 Thanked: 2,252 Times View My Garage	my friend is using MOBIL1 fully synthetic oil since last 2 oil changes. now he wants to switch over to regular mineral oil. which is the best mineral oil that is suggested after the use of synthetic oil. will there be any oil leakages? his zen has done about 70k kms.
	() Thanks

31st July 2009, 14:10	#1763
Car&me BHPian Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Chennai Posts: 207 Thanked: 36 Times	My Cedia is 20K+ run and I am interested in changing the oil to Synthetic now (Sheel Ultra Helix).The manual says I should be using 5w 30 oil. Will get a 5W 30 in Shell Ultra Helix, if not what should I use?
	() Thanks

1st August 2009, 07:37	#1765
Sawyer Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Pune Posts: 2,677 Thanked: 1,786 Times	Here is slightly different spin on the subject. Regardless of kms run, changing the oil/filter at 6 months is a very good thing for engine life. Of course if you rack up kms at a high rate then this does not apply, follow the recommended kms for the change by the auto maker, even if the oil maker is ok with extended drain. But the high cost of the synthetic should not deter you from following the 6 month recommendation. If it does, you are better off with a good mineral oil of the right grade, changed every six months at the outermost limit. Along with good running in, this is the single largest factor in long and reliable engine life. And, in the case of turbo diesels, a well maintained air filter. Bottom line, use synthetic if it is affordable under a regime such as this. Quite honestly, for ordinary road use, much of the premium that you pay is for the oilcos profits, and for your mental satisfaction. Engine life benefit would be a distant third place. PS: Good running in practice includes an oil change at 1000kms, even if the auto maker does not see the need for it Last edited by Sawyer : 1st August 2009 at 07:44. Reason: PS
	() Thanks

1st August 2009, 15:09	#1767
Raccoon Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Poona Posts: 1,851 Thanked: 116 Times	^^^ Pretty much. The newer oils are good for 1 year (minerals included!). I guess older oils and cars needed a change every 6 months... hence these recommendations still do the rounds. Our car sees a change once a year, as recommened by Maruti. I don't see any sense in throwing out good oil every 6 months. This is of course assuming that the running does not exceed about 8 - 10 k km in that period.
	() Thanks

1st August 2009, 18:22	#1768
Sawyer Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Pune Posts: 2,677 Thanked: 1,786 Times	The stop start conditions in Indian cities, that do not allow for the oil to come up to full operating temperatures, allow for residue and water build up that then remains suspended in the oil, and qualify for what is described as severe operating conditions in most car manuals. I prefer to throw away my oil after 6 months, and I like the way my engines perform under this regime. It is even worse in the case of diesels, which hate stopstarts more than petrols. Of course most people sell their cars in 4-5 years these days, so this is possibly not of interest to most people. To each his own of course, it is just that my preference has been to not let oil that is more than 6 month use remain in the sump. Even if it is Mobil 1. Which is why I have now switched back to good brand minerals. Given my driving in the cities, where I do not explore the upper reaches of the rpm bands often, I find that this makes more sense. And economy.
	() Thanks

1st August 2009, 19:31	#1769
R2D2 Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Pune Posts: 3,231 Thanked: 5,742 Times	Simple arithmetic works here: a) Cost of 4 ltrs of synth oil (say Mobil1) - Rs 4000/- b) Cost of 4 ltrs mineral or semi synth - ~1200 (Castrol Magnatec) June 09 batch Assuming a mfr recommended interval of 1 year/10K Kms, you could change the oil thrice over in a year for the cost of a synthetic fill and have a few hundred bucks left over. This is leaving environmental considerations aside. OR, if I change mineral or semi synth oil at 6 month/5K kms interval I still save Rs 1600 on oil per annum. Not much in todays terms but these are tough times. Comon guys we all love our cars but lets not get carried away by synth. I'd have loved to use synth regularly had it been reasonably priced. The choice is quite obvious for me at least. Rgds,
	() Thanks

1st August 2009, 20:45	#1770
motionfreak BHPian Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Thane Posts: 193 Thanked: 64 Times	but as FIAT says about Linea, synt oli can be changed/stretched at 15K KMs. Like my Mech, I feel that 10K is too early for Mobil 1 oil change. Just check if the Oil filter needs to be changed, due to clogged up sludge. Interestingly, an acquaintance used (uses) Mobil 1 in his Car for 10K KMs , then uses it in Water pump and tractors at his farms in Nashik.
	() Thanks