[nitin.rai]

Originally Posted by Tgo

I get to hear from someone who has ridden the yet to be launched TB500. +1 to that.
Here is my outburst of questions for you nitin.rai
[*]Can the rear wheel of the TB500 be put on a TBTS?[*]does the exhaust pipe of the TB500 have room for strap on modifications for the Thump addicts, like a goldstar/upswept/short bottle?[*]Did the Fuel Injection trouble you on your stint on this motorcycle? (thats is If you can talk about it here)[*]Seeing the bike up close and personal and the additions RE has done to this motorcycle, how high will it be priced above the C5? (a rough estimate)[*]What does it sound like with that long barrel exhaust?
.

Dude, can't really go into details but I rode the bike only for a couple of kms.
Test bikes don't have all the jazz & this one had a diff muffler.
- 19 to 18 doesn't make sense but a 19/3.5 from 19/3.25 makes a lot of difference.
- any bike's silencer can be changed; right at the exhaust port or sweep pipe.
- it struggled or didn't - as much as the rest of the C5s. And am talking real high altitude.
- my gut feel - around 1.7-1.8 ex showroom - no input from anywhere; just gut feel.
- I haven't heard the bike on the long barrel exhaust.

[KarthikK]

Originally Posted by Rollin' Thunda

The TBTS rear brakes are fully capable of locking the wheel, so they are not bad. Anything more powerful is unnecessary, and maybe dangerous.
I don't have "nonexistent" rear brakes, I just adjust them so that they can lock the wheel only if fully depressed. This is the ideal setting for a brake, in my opinion.
The disc brake would be essentially non-adjustable, which is why I think they are a bad idea.

I beg to differ here. I own a P220 with a rear disc brake and a TBTS with a rear drum brake, and have used both bikes extensively in the city and for touring on highways. Between the two, there is a world of difference when approaching a braking situation. Disc brake at the rear feels much more progressive and is far more efficient feel-wise on the P220. I don't understand the physics of the G forces, etc. that you mentioned earlier, but in terms of sheer braking confidence and feedback, the disc brake at the rear wins hands down. On the contrary, the TBTS rear brake is practically useless. I have never seen my TBTS rear brakes lockup. Even if I jam it, I feel a weak backward tug at the most (and my brake shoes are fine ). Take a back-to-back test drive of 2 vehicles, one with and another without rear discs and experience the feedback the disc-equipped bike gives you.

Powerful rear brakes don't necessarily need to be dangerous. Higher power needs to be accompanied with higher stopping power. It is just a matter of getting used to, and knowing how much of the pedal to use in what situation. Yes, jamming the brake might cause it to lock up more easily than a weak, 'foot-rest' drum brake. The rider has to get used to the amount that he needs to apply to avoid locking up. The disc brake may not be as adjustable as the drums, it is the rider who has to learn from pedal feedback and adjust .

I agree with what Sutripta said. I too would prefer Discs any day to drums. Drums are simply no match

[Rollin' Thunda]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

The rear brake (on my bike) has the characteristic of an ineffective class teacher who the class disregards (wheels ignore brake input), and who ultimately goes mental (suddenly locking the wheels).

Most mobike disk brake implementations I have found to be very progressive, and greatly prefer it to drums. Front and rear.

Regards
Sutripta

Originally Posted by KarthikK

I beg to differ here. I own a P220 with a rear disc brake and a TBTS with a rear drum brake, and have used both bikes extensively in the city and for touring on highways. Between the two, there is a world of difference when approaching a braking situation. Disc brake at the rear feels much more progressive and is far more efficient feel-wise on the P220. I don't understand the physics of the G forces, etc. that you mentioned earlier, but in terms of sheer braking confidence and feedback, the disc brake at the rear wins hands down. On the contrary, the TBTS rear brake is practically useless. I have never seen my TBTS rear brakes lockup. Even if I jam it, I feel a weak backward tug at the most (and my brake shoes are fine ). Take a back-to-back test drive of 2 vehicles, one with and another without rear discs and experience the feedback the disc-equipped bike gives you.

@sutripa Interesting analogy with the manic school teacher

I must admit my feelings towards disc brakes are biased by my experience with the front disc brakes on my TBTS, which as Sutripa said are very grabby, and a menace to inexperienced riders. So, subconciously I feel that the TBTS 500 rear brakes will be the same, which would make them very dangerous indeed.

However, I see that there is no fundamental reason why disc brakes have to be grabby, or even non-adjustable. I can think of mechanisms that would serve to adjust and moderate them. Other bikes like the P220 mentioned by KarthikK seem to have well-behaved disc brakes. So perhaps, I will test ride the TBTS 500 and then decide...

Thanks!

However, returning to the main question, I don't think the more powerful TBTS 500 would be the best first bike for a relatively inexperienced rider.

[KarthikK]

Originally Posted by Rollin' Thunda

I don't think the more powerful TBTS 500 would be the best first bike for a relatively inexperienced rider.

+1. . While the TBTS 500 definitely suits TGO's needs perfectly, it is quite a heavy beast at 190kg. Definitely something to keep in mind for an amateur rider. Strictly speaking, even the TBTS350 is not the best first bike; Definitely not something to buy and then learn riding.

[mobike008]

Inputs from a newbie bulleteer. I bought a bullet with a clear variant in mind which was a Classic. Rode 350 and then 500. Decision made in miliseconds

IMHO, all other bullets pale in comparison to its retro styling and most importantly a contemprary heart which is most required in this age where convienience is of utmost importance.

TBTS 350 Vs. TBTS 500

350 would be ideal if you plan to use the bike regularly and also if lot of touring is on your mind.

500 launch date is unknown and you may have to wait for a year to lay your hands on it ( But, IMO it would be worth the wait)

C-350 Vs. C- 500

350 : All above parameters apply to this one too. But, this would be a better handler than the TBTS which is more ideal for a straight long roads and offers better comfort both for front and rear passengers

C-500 : This engine will simply blow you away to smithereens. Once you ride a C-500 all other thoughts go awry and you will simply not look beyond its awesome power and pulling capacity due to its enormous torque figures

However, its only for riders like me who bought it for pleasure riding and dont expect to do more than 500kms/month.

Choose a variant carefully after evaluating which parameters means the most to you.

Hope this helps !

[ebonho]

I would most definitely wait for the Tbird 500. Its got some good stuff going for it feature-wise, over and above the fact that its a 500.

[Tgo]

Originally Posted by nitin.rai

Dude, can't really go into details but I rode the bike only for a couple of kms.
Test bikes don't have all the jazz & this one had a diff muffler.
- 19 to 18 doesn't make sense but a 19/3.5 from 19/3.25 makes a lot of difference.
- any bike's silencer can be changed; right at the exhaust port or sweep pipe.
- it struggled or didn't - as much as the rest of the C5s. And am talking real high altitude.
- my gut feel - around 1.7-1.8 ex showroom - no input from anywhere; just gut feel.
- I haven't heard the bike on the long barrel exhaust.

I thought so, about disclosing info on this public forum. But you have been of great help. Please do share some info on the ergonomics of the TB500 compared to the TBTS.

Secondly, could you please shed some light on what 19/3.25 and 19/3.5 mean? I know they are the tyre sizes. What does the part after the '/' mean?

Originally Posted by KarthikK

+1. . While the TBTS 500 definitely suits TGO's needs perfectly, it is quite a heavy beast at 190kg. Definitely something to keep in mind for an amateur rider. Strictly speaking, even the TBTS350 is not the best first bike; Definitely not something to buy and then learn riding.

Okay, first things first, being called an amateur rider sounds like an insult but that is the truth. I have ridden a handful of bikes including the old CI 350 and 500 bullets, the usual Pulsars, Yezdis and RXs, just that I have not owned any of them till now.

So unless its a custom with a suicide clutch or a high powered superbike, what worst can happen?

Originally Posted by mobike008

TBTS 350 Vs. TBTS 500

350 would be ideal if you plan to use the bike regularly and also if lot of touring is on your mind.

500 launch date is unknown and you may have to wait for a year to lay your hands on it ( But, IMO it would be worth the wait)

Choose a variant carefully after evaluating which parameters means the most to you.

Hope this helps !

Originally Posted by ebonho

I would most definitely wait for the Tbird 500. Its got some good stuff going for it feature-wise, over and above the fact that its a 500.

Thank you guys! Contemplation in progress...

[KarthikK]

Originally Posted by Tgo

Okay, first things first, being called an amateur rider sounds like an insult but that is the truth. I have ridden a handful of bikes including the old CI 350 and 500 bullets, the usual Pulsars, Yezdis and RXs, just that I have not owned any of them till now.

Sorry if my post sounded offensive or conveyed the wrong meaning. First up, I'm afraid I wasn't directly referring to you in the last part of that post . I was referring to people who buy a very heavy/powerful bike first and then start learning to operate the clutch and gear basics, etc. There are still people who do that, and that is what I was against, given the weight and stubborn handling of these bikes.

If you read my initial post on the first page of this thread, I myself was suggesting the TB500 to you, based on your requirements, and I still maintain that. If you have ridden bikes of this capacity before, then there won't be any issue.

So unless its a custom with a suicide clutch or a high powered superbike, what worst can happen?

Sorry this is going a bit OT. Pardon this analogy, but if someone were to learn driving, would he/she learn it in a santro/alto or would that person learn it in a fortuner? A fall from a 190kg bike is not a joke, neither is ramming into something with this mammoth weight. "worst" can be anything here, I wouldn't want to get into negative imaginations

Good luck for the decision making! I vote for the TB500. Let us know what was your choice

[nitin.rai]

Originally Posted by Tgo

I thought so, about disclosing info on this public forum. But you have been of great help. Please do share some info on the ergonomics of the TB500 compared to the TBTS.
Secondly, could you please shed some light on what 19/3.25 and 19/3.5 mean? I know they are the tyre sizes. What does the part after the '/' mean?

Both the bikes are comfortable. The 350 would probably be a little easier to manouver in the city due to the smaller tank - about 8 kg less on fuel tank & 190-182 kg weight diff. If primary is city then 350; if touring is primary then go for the 500.
You could change the front tyre on the 350 to a 19/3.5(thickness) from the stock 3.25 ribbed though it would make the steering a lil heavy coz of the lack of ribs.

[Tgo]

Latest development.

The thing is, I need the motorcycle now. Well its more of the fact that having no means of personal transport is kind of stifling. Started looking for used Enfields on the internet.

Does no one sell one at an honest price anymore? The asking prices are touching the sky. Even badly modified versions have absurd prices.

So, I've thought of cancelling my booking of the TBTS and wait for the TB500 to launch. In the mean time, I've thought of buying a used Royal Enfield, preferably a STD 350. I have contacted a few people through e-mail after going through their advertisements. I want to ask you, how much should I pay for a 1970's 1980's and a 1990s model respectively? Lets see how close you get to guessing the market prices.

I guess selling the motorcycle will not be a problem??? That's another big question mark.

[nitin.rai]

Originally Posted by Tgo

Latest development.

The thing is, I need the motorcycle now. Well its more of the fact that having no means of personal transport is kind of stifling. Started looking for used Enfields on the internet.

Does no one sell one at an honest price anymore? The asking prices are touching the sky. Even badly modified versions have absurd prices.

So, I've thought of cancelling my booking of the TBTS and wait for the TB500 to launch. In the mean time, I've thought of buying a used Royal Enfield, preferably a STD 350. I have contacted a few people through e-mail after going through their advertisements. I want to ask you, how much should I pay for a 1970's 1980's and a 1990s model respectively? Lets see how close you get to guessing the market prices.

I guess selling the motorcycle will not be a problem??? That's another big question mark.

If you are buying an old RE as the primary commuter rather than out of love for it - stay away. You may just be disheartened.

[ajnagpur]

Originally Posted by Tgo

Latest development.

So, I've thought of cancelling my booking of the TBTS and wait for the TB500 to launch. In the mean time, I've thought of buying a used Royal Enfield, preferably a STD 350. I have contacted a few people through e-mail after going through their advertisements. I want to ask you, how much should I pay for a 1970's 1980's and a 1990s model respectively? Lets see how close you get to guessing the market prices.

I guess selling the motorcycle will not be a problem??? That's another big question mark.

Just my two cents.

I would suggest you go for the TBTS that you are getting soon. Its a lovely bike with no issues. RE keeps on making changes to their bikes & keeps on improving. Even the Classic 500 has been going through some or the other change till now.

So I suggest you go for the bike which is in the market for some time. tested and respected. I have a TBTS & this 2011 is my second one after 2008 model. thats a long story why I sold & again bought the same bike

Regarding Thunderbird 500. 1. Well, its almost an year away + you dont know what exactly it will be. 2. they showed it in the expo but who know what is going to be the final version. I saw it in pics & to frankly tell you its looking small & funny. 3. Also, its RE so expect a lot of initial issues which they will solve with time. So again you will have to wait or be a guinea pig. choice is yours.

For daily commuting I suggest you stay away from old Standard 350 if you have not lived with Bullets. Trust me it will be a sour experience. I had a 1977 model.

The new Twinspark engine is a different breed all together. No hassels, no leakages, No troubles. Absolutely reliable. just like any other indo/jap.

All the best.

[naveenroy]

Originally Posted by nitin.rai

If you are buying an old RE as the primary commuter rather than out of love for it - stay away. You may just be disheartened.

Oh for the love of biking, I totally agree with this point here. I'd suggest you wait for the TB500 or get the TB350 for now. Please don't buy an old RE Standard now and plan to use it for your daily commute etc. You will then be forced to cancel your booking for any RE for the future

[rockyb]

I 2nd that. Don't buy a STD 350 for the current market price for a daily commute. Its not worth. It has became a collector's item. If at all you want to buy a used RE - buy a used avl 350, 500 Machismo (very costly again) or TB. Buy a STD 350 only and if only you want to experience the original gear / original bullet etc and want to spend lots of time/money in garage.

Otherwise buy a Unicorn, Pulsar 150 etc ... till you book/buy a TB 350. Don't wait for TB 500. Never know how much time it takes from Expo to showroom. RE have this habit to Expo to export and giving them to us after through testing abroad

Originally Posted by Tgo

Latest development.

The thing is, I need the motorcycle now.

Does no one sell one at an honest price anymore? The asking prices are touching the sky. Even badly modified versions have absurd prices.

. I want to ask you, how much should I pay for a 1970's 1980's and a 1990s model respectively? Lets see how close you get to guessing the market prices.

I guess selling the motorcycle will not be a problem??? That's another big question mark.

[Tgo]

Thanks Nitin, AJ, Naveen and Rocky,

I'm really sorry for being so confused at the moment. I was told of a 2007 AVL Thunderbird with 10k on the odo by a RE mechanic near my house. Owner is asking for Rs. 70,000. Will have to go and see the condition of the motorcycle. Immediately available. Can someone share the specifications of the AVL engine and shed some light on how it compares to the UCE? Did it have those aimless decals on the tank (bottom sides)? Did it come with Disc brakes up front?

Another one is a 2010 TBTS UCE. Owner is asking for Rs. 1,10,000. He also lives close by but I haven't seen the motorcycle.

I am so confused right now that I'm thinking of buying either of these, second hand and calling it all off. Will see when the TB500 is in the market.