[ashis89]

This July, after using a '04 P150 for 3 years and 26k kms, I thought of upgrading. With a budget of 1
lakh.INR, the following bikes were thought of:

1) P200 NS
2) P220 F
3) P180
4) Apache 180
5) FZ-S
6) Karizma R
7) Unicorn(Dad's choice)

I didn't consider the CBR150 as it was way beyond my budget. And I hate the R15 v2.0 for its styling. Also I didn't find it comfortable to ride it in
the city.

After trying out the Apache and the 200 NS and being refused the TD of Karizma R, I settled down for a Plasma blue P180.

Took the delivery on 2nd August '12 and have covered 700 kms since then.

Performance:

Since the bike is new and is running in, I haven't crossed 5k RPM. But the bike feels eager to accelerate and pulls strongly post 3000 rpm(the Exhaustec silencer is playing the role I guess). I have achieved 75 kmph
till date. Post 60 kmph, the bike felt reluctant to go, probably the engine needs to open up some more. Also, I noticed that a couple of times when I tried to move from stand-still in the 2nd gear, the bike shuddered.
In my old P150, I could move from standstill in 2nd gear(even 3rd gear-though I know it is not recommended) comfortably.

Handling:

The bike feels leagues ahead of my old P150. It's more chuckable around the corners(120/80 section tubeless rear tyre) and very stable(long wheelbase) in the straight line(high speed stability not tested yet). Also
the bike isn't much disturbed by the strong winds(B'lore people will know what I mean).

Ride Quality:

I get good riding posture despite my 6ft frame but my pillion riders complained of sore back after long rides as they had to hunch forward(due to the raised rear split seat). The bike is slightly more comfortable on bad
roads than my older P150, which is good because I was happy with my earlier bike. The ride is plush and comfortable for both the rider and the pillion.

On the other hand, the seat compound feel hard. I have done 100+ kms(a max. of 193 kms in a day) on 3 differrent days in city and I was comfortable but felt that the seat could be more soft.

Braking:

The front disc(260mm disc) is ok but I found it lacking bite. I felt the brakes of my old steed(240mm disc) to be better. I haven't tried serious or hard braking as I am taking my bike easy. It may be a psycological
feeling. I will check it thoroughly and get back.

Economy:

I don't know if there was any mistake in calculating but the bike returned me 53.13 kmpl(over 400kms in CITY ride only).

I had tanked up right after taking the delivery(and the bike gulped down 17.xx L of petrol in its 15 L tank) with the ODO reading at 25 kms. On 11th Aug, after completing my 1st service, I again tanked up at SHELL
petrol pump and a total of 8.3 L petrol was consumed, ODO reading at 466 kms.

FE = (466-25)/8.3 = 53.13 kmpl

I rode the bike sedately inside the city(including thick bumper2bumper traffic) and never crossed 4k rpm. I warmed up the engine for 2-3 mins before moving on and rode sedately for 2 kms before opening up.

+ves:

- Riding posture is very comfortable for my 6ft frame.
- Headlamp is DC powered and very bright. I might upgrade to Osram nightbreakers in future.
- Fuel economy seems too good to be true. Will check it again and get back.
- Engine kill switch is welcome. It wasn't there in my earlier bike.
- Plasma blue color in cocktail combo(Bajaj calls the new blue/red-black combo as cocktail shade) is
mesmerizing.
- Dual horns are louder than my older bike.

-ves:

- Lack of kick-starter as an option.
- Lack of rear disc as an option.
- Rattling from the tank extensions from day 1(hasn't been rectified after 1st service even after telling them)
- Blue color gets dirty in a couple of hours. My old steed was silver in color and could run around a couple
of days with a single cloth wipe.
- Low G.C. The centre stand scrapes almost every speed breaker with a pillion riding with me.
- Exhaust note was more promising in the older gen Pulsars(Gen 2-3).

I have covered almost 700 kms and have done the 1st service(at 445 kms) till now. Will be putting up my 1st service experience and report. Will also be uploading pics as I have them in my laptop.

[GTO]

Thread moved from the Assembly Line to the Motorbikes Section. Thanks for sharing!

[Bookkeeper]

Congratulations on your new acquisition. Wish you many happy and safe miles. A few pics to do justice to this well written report.

Fuel efficiency does feel tad too good to be true. I get 50-55 on my Dazzler in city usage and it is a 150cc. Why were you denied the test drive on Karizma? Also how are the engine refinement levels in comparison to your old bike?

[(Alok)]

Originally Posted by ashis89

-ves:

- Lack of rear disc as an option.

Have you check the possibilities to borrow it from p220 on the same swing arm?

[ashis89]

Originally Posted by Bookkeeper

Congratulations on your new acquisition. Wish you many happy and safe miles. A few pics to do justice to this well written report.

Fuel efficiency does feel tad too good to be true. I get 50-55 on my Dazzler in city usage and it is a 150cc. Why were you denied the test drive on Karizma? Also how are the engine refinement levels in comparison to your old bike?

Thanks Bookkeeper.
I know the FE is too good to be true. I will be checking it again and update. As of now, I have covered 300kms after tanking to the brim and the fuel indicator still shows FULL. Will tank up after another 100-200 kms and get back.

The Hero dealer didn't have any TD bike, so they covered up their flaw by saying that Karizma TD is not allowed. I didn't bother going to any other dealer.


The engine refinement in the lower rev range is pretty good, better than my old bike. But past 4k RPM, mild vibrations creep in and the bike seems a little hesitant to go beyond 4.5k RPM. My old bike was vibe-free even at 80kmph/6.5k rpm.
May be the engine needs to open up a bit more and may turn a bit smoother after 1500kms/2nd service.

Originally Posted by (Alok)

Have you check the possibilities to borrow it from p220 on the same swing arm?

No, I haven't checked yet. Has anyone done this modification? Also what are the warranty implications and cost involved?


Note to moderator: I have created a duplicate post while trying to edit and multi-quote the previous one. Please can you delete the previous post.

[bullboy]

I know the FE is too good to be true

I think it is true. My P180 used to give around 55-60kpl (yes!!) when driven sedately at economy mode (rpm always below 5k).This is measured with tankful method some 4years back.
Now the bike gives around 50kpl and is touching 7 yrs and 52k kms.
The sad part is that ther is no part that is free from rust :(

[ashis89]

Originally Posted by bullboy

I think it is true. My P180 used to give around 55-60kpl (yes!!) when driven sedately at economy mode (rpm always below 5k).This is measured with tankful method some 4years back.
Now the bike gives around 50kpl and is touching 7 yrs and 52k kms.
The sad part is that ther is no part that is free from rust :(

May be its correct then. I have ridden it for 300kms post the 2nd tank-full and I feel the FE is something similar this time round too. Will confirm after I fill her up again.

In fact the your FE is similar/better than my old bike,a '04 43k kms old P150 which used to return 45-55kmpl uptill now. I gave it ample throttle wrings though.

[ashis89]

1st Free Service experience

I gave my bike for the 1st free service on 11th Aug with 445kms on the ODO. It was given at Popular Bajaj,Bannerghata road.

On the day of buying,I had been told to take an appointment for servicing. I had taken an appointment the day before over phone and was assured that I would be entertained at the assigned time slot. On the day, I reached at 10 am sharp and enquired about my appointment. To my surprise, the appointment had no value. Anyone could walk in at anytime and give his bike for a service.

-The 1st negative impression.

Still I was happy that they took my bike in for service. They then asked to come the next day to take the bike. I refused by saying that I had come 25 kms from Marathalli and I would take the bike the same day itself. They then said they would give it by 6 pm. Again I was unhappy but I said I would wait whatsoever time it takes. They then agreed to complete ASAP and wrote down in the job-sheet that the 'Customer is waiting'.

-1st +ve impression.

They then gave me an estimate of Rs.530 for a 'FREE' service. I protested to which they said that engine oil and consumables are charged from customer. I had to relent.
The break-up was:

Engine oil(Bajaj DTSi-10000, 1L) - Rs.380(I used to fill up Catrol for Rs.240/L in my old P150 and was very happy for the next 2k kms).

Consumables- Rs.75(Asked the service in charge guy what were the consumables and he was clueless. He could only mutter-Grease).

Additives- Rs 75(Again no idea what it was. He could only say that it was added to the fuel for smooth engine functioning).

- 2nd negative impression.
My jobsheet also mentioned that there was some plastic vibrations coming from the tank extensions as reported by me. They started the work by 11 am. The bike was taken and the chain was cleaned with a rag. Then it was sprayed with the chain lube. All this before a water wash(is it right?).

- 3rd negative impression.

Then they drained the oil and put a plastic mug full of new oil(not even from a sealed bottle).

- 4th negative impression.

The bike then went in for water wash and was back after a long time. By then it was 12:45 pm. They did a small test run inside their campus. They then said the bike was ready to be taken after payment was made. I went to the payment counter and gave my debit card. Their card machine didn't work. I then had to walk down to the nearest ATM to bring some cash and then made the payment.

- 5th negative impression.

Once done with the payment, I went to my bike and just overlooked the work. I enquired about the vibration issue and they replied that it was taken care of. Upon looking around, I found there was mud and grime sticking at several places and the silencer was very dirty on the underside. I decided not to make an issue and would clean it myself.

- 6th negative impression.

While checking everything, I found that the oil level was about 3mm below the MIN level. I was furious. I immediately called the service in charge and asked for an explanation for it. To this he replied that the oil level would increase once the engine runs and the oil circulates(is it true as I don't know about it? Correct me if I wrong).

I argued that the bike had run a bit during trial run and the oil shouldn't be below the MIN mark. The argument escalated and they said they would drain the oil to show me the quantity of oil used. After draining, it was found that the oil was slightly more than 800 ML. They then started justifying by saying that some oil goes into the oil filter and some pump which won't be drained out(again is it true?). To this I argued that when we change the oil, some old would be remaining in the GB according to their theory, which is not at all good. They were speechless.

Finally they topped up the drained oil with some more oil to make it a full 1L and then put it in the GB.

- Umpteen negative impressions.
Finally on riding out of the showroom, I found that the vibrations was unaddressed.

[ashis89]

After the second tankful, the bike returned 40.29 KM/L.

Distance covered: 415 kms
Fuel consumed: 10.3L
FE: 40.29 KMPL

The bike wasn't ridden hard, the same sedate riding and yet there is significant drop in FE. Usually the FE increases after the 1st service, but just the reverse in my case. It may be due to change in fuel station, I feel Shell doesn't suit me. Will have to check again.

Also I decrease the idle RPM to 1100 RPM(when hot) myself. Now the bike doesn't heat up as much as earlier. FE might also improve.

[ashis89]

After covering 1300kms, I have the following gripes against the bike:

- it has very low GC. I managed to scrape my center stand 15-20 times in the 1 month of ownership and literally crashed the center-stand 3 times in a single day(it literally gave a heart attack each time). Can it be improved in any way?

- Fuel indicator is highly unreliable. After a tankful, it didn't budge a single point till I covered 350 kms and then it tanked 3 points in the next 40 odd kms.

- Headlight seems weak while travelling in heavy traffic. In B'lore, people tend to drive around with High Beam on which render my light useless. It is then that I feel the need of a more powerful light to counter them. Thinking of going in for Osram Night breakers. Are any mods req.d to fit them?

- The engine is yet to open up. Vibrations rise post 4.5k rpm/ 65 Kmph and bike is a bit hesitant to go beyond 70 kmph(I have taken her till 86 kmph top speed). Is any thing wrong?
I plan to change the engine oil at 1500 kms(last oil change was at 445kms/1st service).

[abhinav.s]

Originally Posted by ashis89

- it has very low GC. I managed to scrape my center stand 15-20 times in the 1 month of ownership ....Can it be improved in any way?

Nothing much you can do about it. You can get rid for the centre stand but servicing it will be a nightmare!

Originally Posted by ashis89

- Fuel indicator is highly unreliable. After a tankful, it didn't budge a single point till I covered 350 kms and then it tanked 3 points in the next 40 odd kms.

Most digital fuel indicators are like this. Similar scenario with my RTR too. You have the fuel tap so nothing to worry on this front.

Originally Posted by ashis89

- Headlight seems weak while travelling in heavy traffic.....Thinking of going in for Osram Night breakers. Are any mods req.d to fit them?

If you are going for the same wattage then you don't need any mods. Osram NB's should provide better throw and illumination.

Originally Posted by ashis89

- The engine is yet to open up. Vibrations rise post 4.5k rpm/ 65 Kmph and bike is a bit hesitant to go beyond 70 kmph(I have taken her till 86 kmph top speed). Is any thing wrong?

It is still at 1300kms so its normal. Ensure you are taking it beyond 6k RPM once in a while during each ride and follow it till 2000kms.

Originally Posted by ashis89

I plan to change the engine oil at 1500 kms(last oil change was at 445kms/1st service).

Not sure what brand Bajaj are using so better to go with a reputed brand of mineral oil and change it every 2000kms.

Also regarding your previous post about the service experience:

Consumables --> Could be for chain spray & oil filter (if it needs a change with every oil fill)
Additives --> Money making tactic. You should have firmly refused it and asked for it to be removed from the job card.

With regards to the oil level, the service advisor is right to an extent. The oil filter consumes or rather stores some quantity of oil and hence there might be a difference in the amount of oil drained out.

On a general note, I have despised the service at Bajaj. Though i had a P220 which was serviced at Pro-biking, the experience left me aghast. The way the service advisers treated the P150/P180 owners was appalling to say the least. Best to finish your free services and find a good mechanic outside to maintain the bike.

[(Alok)]

Originally Posted by abhinav.s

Consumables --> Could be for chain spray & oil filter (if it needs a change with every oil fill)

Are they really doing this(replacing oil filter)? Any one checked in front of eyes?
It needs to open clutch cover and refit. In this case there will be a charge in bill for gasket also.

[abhinav.s]

Originally Posted by (Alok)

Are they really doing this(replacing oil filter)? Any one checked in front of eyes?
It needs to open clutch cover and refit. In this case there will be a charge in bill for gasket also.

That is the reason for mentioning in () about the need for it. AFAIK, it was a centrifugal filter in the P220 which did not need replacement but there was some part which was supposed to be cleaned before filling fresh oil. But in the RTR, it is replaced every time oil is changed and its a very simple thing to do.

[pugram]

Originally Posted by abhinav.s

That is the reason for mentioning in () about the need for it. AFAIK, it was a centrifugal filter in the P220 which did not need replacement but there was some part which was supposed to be cleaned before filling fresh oil. But in the RTR, it is replaced every time oil is changed and its a very simple thing to do.

As far as I know, the Air filters are only cleaned each time and fitted back. Unlike cars I have not seen bike Air / Fuel filters being replaced during regular service.

These consumable charges are for the cleaning cloth, tape for binding electrical fittings ,etc. and is generally added in every bill for both Car and Bike alike.

I have a P180 UG 3 Model. Till the time I was filling up 4 or 5 litres of Petrol, the fuel gauge used to work fine. It was filled "full tank" once and from then on it has become unreliable. I guess Bajaj tests this gauge with the quantity of fuel the general public mostly uses. Rs.200 / Rs.300 etc.

[ashis89]

Originally Posted by abhinav.s

Nothing much you can do about it. You can get rid for the centre stand but servicing it will be a nightmare!
My room-mate has an identical P180 bought 3 months back. He was facing the same GC problem. He raised the rear suspension by adjusting and making it more firm. He says his problem is solved though I can see no reason why it should be solved as there is no link between the suspension travel and the centre-stand position. Should I try it out?
I haven't done so till date because I like the soft setup for the pot-holed B'lore roads.


Most digital fuel indicators are like this. Similar scenario with my RTR too. You have the fuel tap so nothing to worry on this front.
I am not worried(in my earlier bike the fuel gauge didn't work and I relied on tap,so no problem). Its just that I didn't expect it from a new bike.


If you are going for the same wattage then you don't need any mods. Osram NB's should provide better throw and illumination.
What if I increase the wattage? What mods are required and what are the cons? Upto what safe limit can I increase the wattage?


It is still at 1300kms so its normal. Ensure you are taking it beyond 6k RPM once in a while during each ride and follow it till 2000kms.
I have been doing it since I crossed 800 kms for short stints. I am just impatient for the engine to open up soon and become smooth and free-revving.


Not sure what brand Bajaj are using so better to go with a reputed brand of mineral oil and change it every 2000kms.
I was sticking with Castrol in my previous bike. What brand and make do you suggest for P180?

I change the oil every 2-2.2k kms but since the engine is running-in, I thought of doing the 2nd oil change at 1500kms(1st was at 445kms).

Also regarding your previous post about the service experience:

Consumables --> Could be for chain spray & oil filter (if it needs a change with every oil fill)
Pulsar doesn't require oil filter change but only cleaning at every oil change(which they didn't do AFAIK).
Additives --> Money making tactic. You should have firmly refused it and asked for it to be removed from the job card.
Will do so the next time round.

With regards to the oil level, the service advisor is right to an extent. The oil filter consumes or rather stores some quantity of oil and hence there might be a difference in the amount of oil drained out.
Just enlighten me- what should be the oil level just after the oil change? Should be between MIN and MAX or less than MIN(due to filter consuming oil)?

On a general note, I have despised the service at Bajaj. Though i had a P220 which was serviced at Pro-biking, the experience left me aghast. The way the service advisers treated the P150/P180 owners was appalling to say the least. Best to finish your free services and find a good mechanic outside to maintain the bike
I have employed the services of my local mechanic for my previous bike and I was satisfied. I continue to do so. It is only for the free services that I am/will be visiting Bajaj A**.

Originally Posted by (Alok)

Are they really doing this(replacing oil filter)? Any one checked in front of eyes?
It needs to open clutch cover and refit. In this case there will be a charge in bill for gasket also.

No, they dont do any such thing. When asked they say it is not required now.