[Thar4x4]

Dear All,

After long time I am visiting motorbike section here, went through all the threads to gather information for my new purchases however not able to find the appropriate information/experience as my situation is bit different

Some RE fan will say that I am mad however that's what everybody around call me when it comes to bikes and cars.

I started my riding on Honda CD 100ss around 1999 gradually moved to Honda Ambition (as my family is Honda fan) and then to RE 350 (my choice) around 2008. I enjoyed my bullet for last 3 yrs on various rides one of those is documented here completed Saddle sore 1000 on successfully however now I am not getting chance to plan long rides because of new responsibilities.

Present situation:
I am finding hard to use bullet within city limits because of following reasons:

1. As it is CI engine it heats up in slow city riding speed 20/30 and I can feel that.
2. If I try to speed up, its hard to break in emergency situation, I had couple close calls.
3. Immediate acceleration hurts engine, I know this engine is not meant for that so when there is need of immediate acceleration I feel like I am killing engine.
4. In 4th gear I feel need of 5th gear on some open roads where I can do 80 easily.

Study/Brainstorming:

After lots of discussion on TBHP and with RE friends I learned that there are modifications like front disc break, oil cool system etc. are available however after brainstorming I feel this bike is not made for me so instead of modifying it and loosing its charm of originality I should give it to a true crazy RE fan and move on with new generation bike.

Also lately I learned that I have always admired sports, hi tech and fast bikes from my childhood don't know how I went with RE

Now I can fetch around 1 L from this bike easily so my budget for new bike is same, don't want to put money as upgrade for my car is planned in next year or so.

Requirement -
Budget: 1 - 1.2 L
Need: City + occasional long rides
Result: Big smile on face (more or same powerful as RE 350)



Options:

I have only 2 options now:

1. Keep bullet and buy used bike around 20 K
I am not keen on this option as I already have CAR, TVS Scooty in my garage so not interested in increasing maintenance cost as well as parking space. Also as I will use this second bike for daily commute then what's the point in keeping bullet for occasional use which will not happen considering all the above issue problems.

2. Sell bullet and get new generation bike
I think this points is mote practical, yes this is mind decision however some time we have to go by mind.


Bikes I am looking:

So I have came up with following option for change:

1. Bajaj Pulsar P220
I always like the look of this bike, TDed one in last week however not able to experience the power as the TD was within showroom compound where I was not able to shift from 2 gear. I have went through spec and looks cool with 21 BHP.

2. Karizma R not ZMR
It is old liking when I brought my HH Ambition however it was out of budget at that time. Look wise it is bit old generation however still wins the heart, engine is smooth however when I compare it with P220 I feel it is lacking some hi tech equipment. What I gather from other threads is power delivery is also not WOW. My bad luck the showroom I visited don't have Karizma for TD as well as showpiece. No rear disc however that is not deal breaker as front is fine for my riding style.

3. Bajaj 200NS
I am not impressed with looks and the seating position however many friends are suggesting this fella.

I don't like TVS as well as Yamaha (except 100/135) so I am not looking for that options. I know my budget is wired but that's happens with every body irrespective of buying a Car or Bike.

BHPians please suggest/help me to take decision with your experience.

Thanks,
Vishal

[Blow Horn Ok]

You can check out the Honda CBR 150 too. But I guess, The NS 200 or the duke 200 would suit your commuting needs very well. I found the seating position of the NS 200 very comfortable. Do take a long TD of the same. Stretching your budget by a margin, you could have the KTM! IMO its a crazy and fun bike to have. The Impulse would also be a good choice if you want to go off-beat/off-road!

[Thar4x4]

Originally Posted by Blow Horn Ok

You can check out the Honda CBR 150 too. But I guess, The NS 200 or the duke 200 would suit your commuting needs very well. I found the seating position of the NS 200 very comfortable. Do take a long TD of the same. Stretching your budget by a margin, you could have the KTM! IMO its a crazy and fun bike to have. The Impulse would also be a good choice if you want to go off-beat/off-road!

Thanks !

Yes everyone is suggesting to go for 200NS so just went down in Bajaj showroom and had a look but somehow the design is not appealing as P220. Technology wise it is good but the overall package is lacking something.

Had a look on KTM too and it is amazing BUT 25 K more is not good for me, increasing budget may result in spoiling whole plan.

[vikramvicky1984]

Dear Thar4x4,

I would strongly recommend you a karizma R,

I completed an year with the bike (7k kms) and test drove a lot of bikes but really none is as COMFORTABLE.

Regarding hi tech equipment, I agree it is lacking but nothing you'll really miss.The simplicity is actually a blessing in disguise, its the fancy stuff that often goes wrong. Zma is super reliable. Just warm up with choke in the morning while you put on your riding gear and its goes on smoothly.

Its fast enough to zoom ahead at signals and is very comfortable at 80-100 kmph. I use it for 50 kms daily (navi mumbai to BKC ). FE should be around 35 kmpl with aggressive driving.

Whats not good:

1. it suffers from a problem of shutting down sometime suddenly. One needs to open fuel filler and its fine.
2. Tubeless tyres are not there
3. rear disc brakes: I don't feel it necessary but would have loved to have it. Service chaps told me that it can be ordered to be factory fitted.

I can lend you my zma over a weekend in navi mumbai

I felt the CBR 150 to be really overpriced. It looks beautiful but seems to be hardly selling
R15 is what I would have switched to if I had a better back.

[Thar4x4]

Originally Posted by vikramvicky1984

Dear Thar4x4,

I would strongly recommend you a karizma R, ...

Thanks Vikram for kind advice and offer for riding your ZMA hope I would have located in Mumbai

Yes ZMA is my second option let's see what is planned.

Thanks,
Vishal

[amit_purohit20]

ZMA is a good bike for you but if you want it for only city driving I did suggest RTR180 any day. Drive it, wring the throttle hard to know what I mean. But yes if you want to use the same bike for touring then forget it especially if you are pillion.
I feel sad that you are neglecting 200 NS the best bike available below 1 lakh just for the looks, but then ultimately its your choice what you feel good. The pros. points of this bike are too many to be neglected so easily.

My choice would be:
1)PULSAR 200 NS.
2)ZMA
3)RTR 180.

But if its to be only a city bike for short fast runs its the RTR 180. I have one and reliability is fine.

[Bazinga]

Since you have already shortlisted P220, I would suggest you TD a Avenger 220 as well. It can be a good bet.

From the ones you have shortlisted I think P220 is the safest and better looking choice. However do a TD of all bikes and choose the one that fits you the best in form of in-city driving.

Add these to your TD list and let us all know once you have ridden them
1. Avenger 220
2. KTM 200 (you would need to stretch your budget by a few grands)
3. CBR 150
4. Also the new TBTS 350 isn't a bad bet either. But the brakes and all are equally short on this one

[praful]

Both the Pulsar 220 and Karizma are age old bikes now and might get phased out anytime soon. I expect the Pulsar 220 to be phased out pretty soon actually! My suggestion is to stay away from both of them.

I would recommend you look at KTM Duke 200, it will put a ear to ear grin everytime you whack open that throttle. Yes you'd have to stretch your budget, but it fits your needs much better. Its perfect for city riding and the occasional long rides as well. The 200NS is a more practical (read: less exciting) variant of the Duke 200. So you could try both bikes and see what fits your needs best.

[VW2010]

Personally i am the old age once a bullet for ever a bullet guy. But given your predicament i would advice you to look at the best torque at the price range from the new age bikes. Top speed is something you can completely ignore for you will never get a chance to rip the engine to attain such speeds.

Ninja, Honda CBR 250 or some of the 250cc bikes are good but way over your budget. At your price point you will have to compromise on one thing or another.

The recommended bikes by fellow bhpians are all good but will not give you the smile coming from a bullet. May be you will enjoy some of them on the short test drives.

The best way to judge is take the bike for the test drive on your normal commute routes. You can judge your need vs what the bike can offer in a realistic way.

None of the bikes mentioned except the avenger gives a riding position that is actually comfortable.

Test drive in your usual roads and decide. From a low RPM to high RPM engine the difference in comfort is completely poles apart. So keep your expectation "zero" and do not compare it with your bull. The bull was designed for the casual 50kmph thud thud and can definitely do a good highway ride.

Lastly, some of the issues you have mentioned to me is not even the issue of the model but this specific bike probably. The 350 with a disk and a drum stops as expected, heat at 30 kmph means there is something wrong with either the oil flow or even the engine reaching its age, 4th gear and 80 is pretty standard and with a change in sprocket 80 becomes far more comfortable and acceleration at right gears is all it takes. My bull still comes out of the signal along with some of the new age bikes mentioned above and with a different sprocket my gearing is tall and gives me that extra acceleration in different gears that helps me hit 100 in not time. I do agree that you have made your decision and i respect that. So this paragraph is not to judge you but just to say the RE350 is highly competent on the points you have mentioned.

[vibbs]

All the best for your decision. IMO the best bike in India close to a lakh rupees is the Pulsar 200NS.
I also wanted to add a couple of thoughts on the Avenger since some mentioned it. I own an avenger and have an ownership thread running here in the forum too. IMO the comfort factor of an Avenger is highly over rated. I have discussed this same point with a couple of other avenger owners and the feeling is same. Although it is not uncomfortable, it also is not the best position out there. It is also a misconception that bikes with upright seating would be the most comfortable for all. A lot depends on many other things. Upright seating with feet placed in the front may seem comfortable, but as soon as the road gets bad, (which incidently is the case in India) all shocks are transmitted straight to your spine. IMO the best position is one that is neither too crouching nor too upright. That is why I think you should look at something like the Karizma or even the CBR.

As an owner of Avenger, I wouldn't suggest it to anyone who is not specifically looking for a cruiser.

EDIT: If you really want a grin on your face every time you go out for a spin, increase your budget slightly and get the best Hooligan on our streets. The KTM DUKE. You will be grinning ear to ear every time you take it out for a ride.

[Thar4x4]

Originally Posted by amit_purohit20

ZMA is a good bike ...

Originally Posted by Bazinga

Since you have already ...

Originally Posted by praful

Both the Pulsar 220 and Karizma are ...

Originally Posted by VW2010

Personally i am the old age once a bullet ...

Originally Posted by vibbs

All the best for your decision. IMO the best bike in India close to a lakh rupees is the Pulsar 200NS.

EDIT: If you really want a grin on your face every time you go out for a spin, increase your budget slightly and get the best Hooligan on our streets. The KTM DUKE. You will be grinning ear to ear every time you take it out for a ride.

Thanks all for your valuable inputs

So I am revising my option list again with price.

1. Bajaj 200NS - 94 K OTR Pune

2. Karizma R not ZMR - around 90 K OTR

3. Bajaj Pulsar P220 - 90 K OTR Pune.

4. KTM Duke - 1.43 K OTR Pune

So this KTM fella is new addition, yesterday had close look on it and I liked the bike. TD bike was not available so visiting them today. However my initial impression is it will be hard for pillion as the seat is very small. If this will be the case then this will be out first as my wife like to ride with me. But overall finish and quality is remarkable and after that its hard to look at pulsar :(.

I am going through all the KTM thread however not able to figure out the service and maintenance cost, what I gathered is parts and kit are expensive

KTM owners can you please throw some light on about 2 concerns.

@amit, @praful, @vibbs - Yes I am leaning towards pulsar 200NS now. The only concern I have is, they launched P220 with fuel injection and re-launched again with carb. So what if same happens with 200NS.

@Bazinga - My friend own Avenger 220 and I have driven it lot but that is also not city bike considering wheel base. TBTS no I can keep my STD RE instead. About CBR, I find they are way costly compared to my options.

@VW2010, yes sire I totally appritiate your view about RE and I still love it but I have limited budget and in that I want to enjoy all types of bikes in life so can't keep it insted I am offering it to a friend who is RE fan. That's all I can do.

Thanks,
Vishal

[praful]

Originally Posted by Thar4x4

@amit, @praful, @vibbs - Yes I am leaning towards pulsar 200NS now. The only concern I have is, they launched P220 with fuel injection and re-launched again with carb. So what if same happens with 200NS.

You are right, the Duke is not so comfortable for the pillion. The seat is small and the suspension is not particularly comfortable for the pillion.

Bajaj is constantly working at improving their products, especially more so with first generation products. So it is quite possible that they might make some changes with the next iteration of the 200NS. That will put you in a perpetual loop if you follow that thought process So best to decide on what is the best available to you in the present!

[ike]

Originally Posted by vikramvicky1984

Dear Thar4x4,

I would strongly recommend you a karizma R,

So would I. I've been using an R for a little over a year now and I'm really happy with it. It has no disc brake in the rear, but the stock set up is good. Regarding the bike shutting down, you will have that problem only if the fuel gets too low, atleast that is what I think as this happened to me only once. The service guy once told me some bikes have issues with the self start not working but if u switch off the ignition and turn it back on again, it will work. This too hasn't happened to me so far. All in all it's been really trouble free except for the rattling of the front fairing. The R15 is good too, only that I was not comfortable with the riding position.

[SR71A]

Originally Posted by Thar4x4

Dear All,

Present situation:
I am finding hard to use bullet within city limits because of following reasons:

1. As it is CI engine it heats up in slow city riding speed 20/30 and I can feel that.
2. If I try to speed up, its hard to break in emergency situation, I had couple close calls.
3. Immediate acceleration hurts engine, I know this engine is not meant for that so when there is need of immediate acceleration I feel like I am killing engine.
4. In 4th gear I feel need of 5th gear on some open roads where I can do 80 easily.
Thanks,
Vishal

Dear Sir,

As a proud owner of a 2001 Bullet Electra with CI engine. I would like to share some of my experience.

I was based out of Mumbai for a few years and drove in its maddening traffic and faced the same issues. Carried out the following tunings.

I found that running on a slightly rich mixture drastically helps reducing engine over-heating. Tuning up of ignition timing, tappet clearances also helps.

Braking of course can be improved with front discs. I hope you keep the classic, as they are no longer manufacturing the CI engine.

Happy tootling.

[Thar4x4]

Originally Posted by SR71A

Dear Sir,

As a proud owner of a 2001 Bullet Electra with CI engine. ..

Happy tootling.

SR71A, no one is sir here I feel like I am ageing when someone call me sir.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts however somehow I have started liking for these new generation bikes. Also as specified in my opening post I liked sports and powerful bike from childhood so I think RE is powerfull but it lack some hi tech equipments.

Also the classic is not going anywhere it is just moving to friend/brother's home so no worry.

Thanks,
Vishal