[Sutripta]

Originally Posted by niranjanrvce

I highly doubt a bank angle sensor seeing the lean angles it does regularly with no issues.

An accelerometer will not detect lean while running.

Yes D200 had the shutoff issue initially, including my old one. The fix was a newer map at second service that mellowed down the D200 a lot and solved this problem.

There is a lot of speculation that some external signal (most pointed to:- the side stand sensor) is causing the engine to shut off. Considering how similar the 200 and the 390 are, and that there is a larger population of 200s and for a longer period of time, there should have been lots of similar observations about the 200. Hence my question:- is there?

The D200 also had front fork seals issue - I bust mine over a harmless hump and the service guys seemed to see it as a common enough problem.

My question was the other way around. Lots of complaints about the 200 fork seals. But these complaints seem to have stopped. So has seal quality improved (200 and 390). Or is this taken as par for the course, so no one complains anymore.

Re: Engine shutoff when engine goes from decelerating to idle. Happens in cars also. Normally the result of at the limit programming of ECU. (For FE, and emission reasons). With no leeway for wear and tear, and production tolerances.

Regards
Sutripta

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

Re: Engine shutoff when engine goes from decelerating to idle. Happens in cars also. Normally the result of at the limit programming of ECU. (For FE, and emission reasons). With no leeway for wear and tear, and production tolerances.

If you don't mind can you please explain this part add I have never seen a car switch off while decelerating to idle.

I guess it is a fault and not of programming the ECU. Why will they need to program the ECU in such method?

Anurag.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Added_flavor

Exactly! Everyone who has reported this issue has also acknowledged that keeping the throttle open is the work around for this.

Sometime back I had posted on this topic in the same thread.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motorb...ml#post3342892

I would be seriously concerned if this thing was happening on open throttle applications.

One thing that is a possibility is that most of us here are riding really high strung machines like the KTM Dukes for the first time. The state of tune and fueling is pretty different to what we have been used to and grown up riding. A large part of the silly adolescent grins on all our faces is due directly to this. But such razor sharp tuning does have its reality checks in terms of transitions between levels of throttle opening. I have read about the earlier Duke 690s also being equally snatchy and cranky, till they neutered the tuning with the new Duke 690s (along with the less radical less sharp angular styling too sadly) and made them more rideable. But if you ask any of the serious good riders, they felt the new Duke 690 lost some of its manic character because of that.

Even with the old first lot 200s, the EXACT same thing happened. Most experienced riders never had an issue once they got used to the clutch and throttle transitions. But there was a large enough population of less experienced riders going on and on complaining about how snatchy/jerky the throttle response was and how the bike used to keep shutting off. What was the end result we all know. The manic Austrian tuned Duke 200 was remapped to make it India friendly. And it is my personal opinion that the new Duke 200s while smoother than than the old ones, are not as manic or as wide grin fun to ride as the old ones. There is a MARKED difference in the way they both ride. Any experieenced rider can make it out if he rides the two back to back. I am not talking about the reduced top end which is a god 5+ kmph lower. I am talking about how the bike rips through the gears right from 1st all the way through to 6th.

[Rollin' Thunda]

Originally Posted by ashkamath

The other day my 390 let me down again. I was returning home and was doing a good 80 Kph and at a turn ahead , there was a bus and a couple of cars behind it and I slowed down, from 6th to 5th and while I depressed my clutch to shift from 5th to 4th at about 50 Kph, my bike just went dead. very dangerous situation.

Originally Posted by hsub

This past weekend on the way back from Lonavala I was doing about 100 and while entering a bridge the road had an abrupt elevation drop which caused the bike to be in the air for fraction of a second. Immediately I saw engine warning light come on and for couple of seconds the bike wouldn't accelerate.

I cannot explain ashkamath's situation, but hsub's problem may have come from the ABS. The ABS kicks in when there is a difference in the rotational speed of the two wheels. When his bike was airborne, the rear wheel would accelerate (due to the power being delivered to it) while the front wheel obviously will not ---leading to a difference in their speed, which will be interpreted by the ABS as a front-wheel skid. When this difference is too large, it may be that the Duke is designed to cut off the power. Just my hypothesis...

[sridhu]

@rollin_thunda: don't think abs on bikes looks at front & back wheels simultaneously. Depends more on the individual wheel losing traction. That being said, the conditions could have made the ecu think there has been a crash

[sridhu]

My apologies - it does work the way @rollin_thunda said.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-...or_motorcycles

[avishar]

The black 390.

[Sutripta]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

add I have never seen a car switch off while decelerating to idle.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post2276652

(Though in this case it's a diesel, same principles apply)

Regards
Sutripta

[man_of_steel]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post2276652

(Though in this case it's a diesel, same principles apply)

Regards
Sutripta

Could'nt check the whole thread, so sorry for the negligence. But was it an updated fuel map that solved the issue?

[Urban_Nomad]

I have been contemplating a two wheeled addition to my garage for some time now to give my 10 year old RE thunderbird some company.

The bike shall predominantly be used in the city with a trip to the mountains thrown in once every 3-4 months. Have not contemplated track days (yet). My choices:

- used duke 200: have a couple available for around 85-90k. 2012 examples, done around 10k. The idea is to use it as a learner bike for maybe a year or bit more. 2015 should see some interesting launches in the middleweight category. Can save money n take my pick (fervently praying ebonhos predictions on the 690 are as accurate as they were with the 390).

New 390: will live with this one longer than the 200 for sure. Just don't want to be disappointed when the aforementioned launches happen n I "feel stuck" (for the lack of a better expression). No vfm deals available in the used market currently. There is a three month old available for sale for around 1.75, but I would rather pay a few thousand extra n get one brand new. What do the current owners think? Is this a bike you would not grow out of for say .... 3 years(??). I'm a novice n not an expert sports rider (hardly).

Used ninja 250 - a late 2009 model is available for just under 2 lac. It had an akrapovic slip on, puig sliders n a tank pad. The bike has done under 8000 Kms n is very very well maintained. Not a single scratch. The owner will also provide the stock exhaust. I've loved the ninja since the day it was launched. It is touted as the best learner bike for someone looking to get into sport riding. But I am very aware that this is an almost 5 yr old vehicle. Plus the service cost is much higher than the ktm.

Thoroughly confused!!!! Please help gurus. I have put up this query here because we have a multitude of owners here who own at least one of the three bikes above. Your views on the pros n cons of owning one will be most helpful.

[Sutripta]

Originally Posted by man_of_steel

Could'nt check the whole thread, so sorry for the negligence. But was it an updated fuel map that solved the issue?

Users (sufferers?) still report issues.
Details of what is done with each firmware change is not revealed, so your guess is as good as mine. Fuel maps unlikely to be the issue (esp with diesels!) I would think (entirely my opinion) more a question of when (and how) to transition between coast and idle.

Regards
Sutripta

[sridhu]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

Thoroughly confused!!!! Please help gurus. I have put up this query here because we have a multitude of owners here who own at least one of the three bikes above. Your views on the pros n cons of owning one will be most helpful.

I have the 390 but at the same price, I would plump for the Ninja.

Note from Support - Quoted post shortened. Please avoid quoting an entire lengthy post as it inconveniences our mobile and small screen users. Thanks!

[man_of_steel]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

New 390: will live with this one longer than the 200 for sure. Just don't want to be disappointed when the aforementioned launches happen n I "feel stuck" (for the lack of a better expression). No vfm deals available in the used market currently. There is a three month old available for sale for around 1.75, but I would rather pay a few thousand extra n get one brand new. What do the current owners think? Is this a bike you would not grow out of for say .... 3 years(??). I'm a novice n not an expert sports rider (hardly).

If you can buy a new 390, its a good option provided you can live with the hard suspension, the hard seat and windblast, please do take a TR before buying. On my 390, which is 2.5 months and 6k kms old. I realized its true potential only when I took it to the tracks. I never knew the full potential of the machine I bought until then. Still, as a first timer to the track, I might have been using only 60%-70% of its potential!

Believe me, you wont get bored of this bike even if you are commuting on it on a daily basis.

Used ninja 250 - a late 2009 model is available for just under 2 lac. It had an akrapovic slip on, puig sliders n a tank pad. The bike has done under 8000 Kms n is very very well maintained. Not a single scratch. The owner will also provide the stock exhaust. I've loved the ninja since the day it was launched. It is touted as the best learner bike for someone looking to get into sport riding. But I am very aware that this is an almost 5 yr old vehicle. Plus the service cost is much higher than the ktm.

That seems to be a sweet deal IF it is maintained well. I was never able to find one in a good condition when I was looking for one before going for the 390. But Keep in mind that even while the overall quality and the individual parts quality and reliability is several notches above its counterparts, it is not at all cheap. Parts costs a bomb and will not always be readily available even through ASCs (eg. Mirrors costs around 2.5k brake pads around 1.5k+ IIRC). Please give it a thought if you really enjoy hunting and waiting for parts. But the feel, smoothness and even sound of that parallel twin stays unchallenged till date.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

- used duke 200: have a couple available for around 85-90k. 2012 examples, done around 10k. The idea is to use it as a learner bike for maybe a year or bit more. 2015 should see some interesting launches in the middleweight category. Can save money n take my pick (fervently praying ebonhos predictions on the 690 are as accurate as they were with the 390).

New 390: will live with this one longer than the 200 for sure. Just don't want to be disappointed when the aforementioned launches happen n I "feel stuck" (for the lack of a better expression). No vfm deals available in the used market currently. There is a three month old available for sale for around 1.75, but I would rather pay a few thousand extra n get one brand new. What do the current owners think? Is this a bike you would not grow out of for say .... 3 years(??). I'm a novice n not an expert sports rider (hardly).

Used ninja 250 - a late 2009 model is available for just under 2 lac. It had an akrapovic slip on, puig sliders n a tank pad. The bike has done under 8000 Kms n is very very well maintained. Not a single scratch. The owner will also provide the stock exhaust. I've loved the ninja since the day it was launched. It is touted as the best learner bike for someone looking to get into sport riding. But I am very aware that this is an almost 5 yr old vehicle. Plus the service cost is much higher than the ktm.

Since you say you would ultimately like to settle with a bigger bike, I would suggest you to save money for it now and buy a good used 200 and use it for a year or so and get ready for the bigger bike in terms of riding skills and relearning a lot from moving a lot from the Bullet to a modern bike (there is a learning curve involved for sure). When you do sell the 200, you will lose little because most of the loss has already been bore by the guy you are buying it from.

Between the used Ninja 250 vs the brand new 390, I would suggest the Ninja for the same reason. When you do sell and move to the bigger bike, you will lose less on the used Ninja than on the new 390. Also since you would anyways be moving to the big KTM, why not sample the Kawasaki first as well (also a twin versus a big single)? Also the Ninja may be a "learner" bike abroad, but for us its a pretty potent machine. Al these 3 are for that matter. So always respect the bike, and give it a hundred percent when on top.

For the kind of riding you are planning, and seeing as you are located in Delhi, there is nothing much the Ninja cannot or will not do which the 390 could or would. Just be sensible in the rough stuff.

[VW2010]

Used ninja 250 - a late 2009 model is available for just under 2 lac. It had an akrapovic slip on, puig sliders n a tank pad. The bike has done under 8000 Kms n is very very well maintained. Not a single scratch. The owner will also provide the stock exhaust. I've loved the ninja since the day it was launched. It is touted as the best learner bike for someone looking to get into sport riding. But I am very aware that this is an almost 5 yr old vehicle. Plus the service cost is much higher than the ktm.

It does make sense to buy a 200 that is going pretty low these days around 80-1L as DR suggested. Reason is that you want to upgrade to a bigger bike.

The 200 is not a slouch and you may actually enjoy the 200 over the Ninja. Ninja is far smooth and beautiful to ride all day. For its shape its actually very comfortable to ride long and the engine is bloody smooth and strong for your fun.

It is also more ideal route to take up 600 or a 1000cc bike in the future.

Coming to 390, its a pocket rocket as everyone says. You will never get bored to ride it day in and day out. Very less attention grabbing than the green magnet ninja and its so subtle till performance blows away most of the bikes on road.

Ever wonder how it feels in a 650 to see a plastic 390 trailing most of the times in tours. Thats what 390 can do. Its not exactly comparable to the 650 but it is as good as it gets for the money you pay.