[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by rakesh_r

RE would have worked hard on getting the right exhaust note.

They've been selling motorcycles due to their trademark sound for ages now. Pretty sure they would have paid a lot of attention to that aspect.

Some articles had mentioned that the 270 degree firing order was chosen specifically for this reason.

[aravind.anand]

Yes, there is a specific video about the engine development, where Sid Lal speaks a lot about how important the sound and character of the engine was during the development. He calls the sound of the twin a rumble - for which they would have opted for the 270 degree crank.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0v6ivTHiudQ

And yes, this is a really nice video to demonstrate that 'rumble' of the twins

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yZGAgI6Q7do

[ringoism]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

- Timid road presence (pictures, YouTube)
- exhaust note (YouTube)
- riding posture
- Performance figures (not actual performance)

And believe me, RE fanboys are much worse than RE critics. At least the latter speak with some experience and numbers. How does one have a meaningful discussion when all arguments are centred around the bike's soul?!

I think many have gone too far on both sides... worshiping a thump on one side (nothing else in consideration), or else dismissing all RE's as antiquated, unreliable, overpriced lumps on the other. I say this as someone who used to have very little appreciation for them (despite having ridden many over the years) and who now owns and enjoys one.

There IS something to be said for "soul" or character or rider connection or whatever else you could call it - some of the best-selling, most-loved vehicles in history excelled in that if not in the specs, and some of the most technically advanced in reality felt a little uninspiring to many people in actual use. While sometimes useful, tech data definitely does not tell the complete story all that accurately. Mazda (automobiles) way back had the advert line, "It just feels right", and they produced a number of cars during that time that were good to drive (and good to look at too). That's something partly subjective, but is also arrived at by involving a lot of people in the development process, which it sounds like RE has been trying to do. But yes, they are a particular type of people it sounds like, who already appreciated an Enfield's good points. Exhaust note is important primarily to people who have already proven their priority on it - by buying Enfields in the past. If RE was targeting other customers primarily, they wouldn't have bothered so much about how it sounded.

IMO many "out there" tend to err on the side of being armchair enthusiasts / analysts. They advise someone which bike to buy because one has 1/2 more peak bhp. Or they feel bad about their 400bhp car, which they've fully enjoyed for the past 12 months, because this year's new model has 406bhp. They are allowing themselves to be manipulated by marketing departments and peer pressure / status obsession. Nobody is EVER going to be able on the street (and hardly on any track in the world) to tell the difference that supposed 6bhp makes at that level - or probably even the 1/2 bhp on the executive commuter. Ridiculous but it happens daily.

Until very recently, 500cc Bullets were considered to be pretty decent (if crude, vibey) performers, at only around 25bhp. In the mid 40's, the twin will represent a day and night difference in actual feel. Who cares if whichever Triumph has more per cc? I've ridden the Bonnie, the Tiger, a Ducati, RD350, and some Honda V4's / Suzuki GS750, FZ600 etc way back when. Let the bike stand on its own merits, it is going to cost a small fraction of what you're going to lay out for a T100 or Daytona. Duke 390 will likely be faster (full-on) and cheaper but then it's a completely different animal, not for everyone.

At the end of the day, you've got to get out and ride a bike, unless you are just going to keep it as a showpiece in your sitting room. And "the proof's in the pudding" as they say. Take it out for a 20-30 minute ride on the kind of roads you plan to ride, and see if you're smiling wide when you get back. If one or two things bother you, think whether they can be easily altered (riding posture would be one, with a different handle / footpegs).

Beyond that, almost nobody's riding around with a stopwatch, almost nobody's got mirrors all around to look at themselves in, few are going to find opportunity to do "the Ton" except in their dreams, and even if they do, it's gonna be far less than 1% of their total riding time in a year. Finally, if you're planning to spend solid time in the saddle, you've got to "feel right" about what the bike does for you. As others have said, it can be a very personal thing. If you're planning instead to sit at a cafe and gloat over the fact that you've got more (useless) bhp/cc than the next guy, or that your bike has allegedly better "road presence" (how do you measure THAT?) or a 5mm bigger disc brake, this might not be your bike.

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

Triumph is also much better at the "tech" aspect. They can (if they so wanted) pull out 120+ BHP from a 675 cc engine. They Chose not to pursue HP in case of the Bonnie

RE not being able to extract more from this engine is a constraint; not a choice

??? The video was very clear that RE was making a deliberate decision based on the target market's preferences, to emphasize the perceived strong points of the well-loved singles: in particular the strong torque curve and flexibility and sound of the engine. A 120+bhp 675 would be peaky; It would also be expensive to buy / maintain. It would in no way fit the character of a retro-classic, practical rider type bike like RE wanted with these twins - it wouldn't be balanced / nimble as were also stated goals.

Whether or not RE was capable of building such an engine (unlikely) is completely besides the point - why on earth would they want to, and who cares if their tech capabilities are more limited than Triumph's at this stage? The engine they developed fits the character / performance of the bike they want to build right now, on the basis of what the existing RE customer base appreciates. Keeping in mind that RE is selling maybe 50,000/mo bikes right now and is the biggest 2-wheeler success story in India (commercially), apart from any new customers who jump on the brand, they are probably aiming largely towards a lot of existing ones upgrading. They don't need to please everyone.

Comparisons with Triumph, who indeed has much more history in the modern era of tuning high-performance engines over several vastly different platforms, are not really fair. Apart from the Himalayan, this is only RE's second truly new engine (maybe 2-1/2 including the UCE, which shares many parts / dimensions with the earlier AVL's, whose development was outsourced). They're taking it a step at a time and I think they're doing a good job. They (incomprehensibly) seemed to rush the Himalayan to market without having properly proven all its components, and they have suffered gravely for it. But the basic engineering and concept were solid, as is being proved with v.2. There were good people involved then and now, and I expect they'll get it mostly right with the twins - they know they can't afford another fiasco, and again there's no real upcoming competition they have to beat to market. They can take their time and get it right, and I'm expecting they probably will this time.

Personally, I can hardly wait to ride one, hardly wait to hear it in person - because I know for a fact that I've never been able to get a recorded video sounding quite like my bikes' actual output.

-Eric

[aravind.anand]

Well put together post, from a really neutral point of view

IMHO This post really clears up the space for good. I too feel that the engine specification would suit the laid-back positioning of the bike, and would also go well with RE's current line-up and their target audience - if I might add, thier heritage too.

I hope people don't classify Ringorism as yet another fanboy, and nitpick his post and start an irrelevant argument that Mazda's reliability cannot be matched by RE and so on

[bsenroy]

Ok, so the static reviews and impressions have started to come in. Here is one from good ole Blighty uploaded a week back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-3fcpUehbA

The reviewer says he will 'soon be able to order one'.
Dealer says that RE will launch 9 new models in the coming two years.

The last beat does sound promising to those in the wait for a larger Himalayan. But chances are the new models will be updated paint schemes on existing line-up, aka the Redditch con job.

[maker_of_things]

My friend happened to get a testride of the new 650GT. He loved it. I'll post a link of the initial review if and when he posts it.

[aravind.anand]

Well, the previous post just reminded me of few images of the Continental GT650 with a full-length seat that he caught on test. This was prior to the unveil in November, and hence he had requested me not to share it with anyone else, and I completely forgot about these images after the unveil happened







Now looking forward for the sneak peek review!

[R-Six]

Originally Posted by maker_of_things

I'll post a link of the initial review if and when he posts it.

Happy to read about the initial feedback from your friend. Hope the entire hype RE has created is justified once the actual bike is launched.

Originally Posted by aravind.anand

images of the Continental GT650 with a full-length seat

Wow! I must admit that the bike is a looker which those blackened rims and the new full-size seat. Looks like it has a slightly better design and I kinda linked the design of the seat as well. It has much better proportions than the full-length seat they had for 535 variant.

Thanks again for sharing these pics.

Ride safe,
R-Six

[aravind.anand]

Originally Posted by R-Six

Wow! I must admit that the bike is a looker which those blackened rims and the new full-size seat. Looks like it has a slightly better design and I kinda linked the design of the seat as well. It has much better proportions than the full-length seat they had for 535 variant.

The seat on the GT535 was actually a literal flat bench, no curves or contours whatsoever. So this seat is a definite improvement over that. And from the images, this looks to be more comfortable than the seat on the Interceptor 650 too.

[R-Six]

Originally Posted by aravind.anand

The seat on the GT535 was actually a literal flat bench

Tell me about it. My wife hates it when I call my GT a 2 seater and invites her for a spin.

On the other hand, the single seat is very comfortable on rides. It has some extra cushioning as compared to the flat bench kind of seat they offer as an accessory.

The new one looks really good.

Ride Safe,
R-Six

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

The Royal Enfield Interceptor 650 seems to have caught the fancy of a royal family member in the UK -

http://overdrive.in/news-cars-auto/r...rince-william/

[Karthik.guru]

Originally Posted by maker_of_things

My friend happened to get a testride of the new 650GT. He loved it. I'll post a link of the initial review if and when he posts it.

Attachment 1752955

I found it !
Here's a link to the full review.
https://www.cartoq.com/royal-enfield...ng-motorcycle/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UReCpYJO34

[maker_of_things]

Originally Posted by Karthik.guru

I found it !
Here's a link to the full review.
https://www.cartoq.com/royal-enfield...ng-motorcycle/
https://www.Youtube.com/watch?v=6UReCpYJO34

Thanks Karthik. I got off work a couple of hours ago and opened my Instagram feed to see my the posts that my friend has made. It's the same thing that has been covered on the Cartoq link as well.

Although there's a lot of background noise, the exhaust note seems to be pretty good. It looks like the stock muffler and not the S&S mufflers that were on the display models.

I've heard rumours that it's gonna launch in a couple of weeks. I don't have a source to verify this info. But let's hope that's true.

[bsenroy]

Interceptor 650 and GT 650 spotted in new colours:






SOURCE: https://www.autocarindia.com/bike-ne...colours-408162

ADDITIONAL IMAGES HERE: https://www.rushlane.com/royal-enfie...-12268721.html

[aravind.anand]

Originally Posted by bsenroy

Interceptor 650 and GT 650 spotted in new colours:

These aren't new colours, they had been around since last December - IIRC, they made their debut in some Auto show in Australia. These were the colours that were seen in the video which was shot by a dude on a Himalayan from a dealership in Australia. That colour on the Interceptor is called the Baker express, and is my personal favourite.