[Samir Taheer]

Originally Posted by bblost

This over reaction by a bunch of over entitled people is almost funny except that someone got hurt.
I hope the victim files a police complaint and gets justice. This kind of behavior should never be tolerated in any civilized society.

Exactly my thoughts.

Originally Posted by ghatotkatch

Sure, I know the types, didn't expect anything better than getting personal when one lacks any valid argument.

I have nothing but support for what you say. Whilst I have to admit, the language used is questionable, it gives no one the right to react that way.

I read in the papers today that the boys have been banned (or going to be banned) from IBW - Right Decision!

P.S - Are these the same bunch of kids that went up in arms with death threats, etc against Motorscribes after the India Super Bike Week at Amanora, Pune?

[Sawyer]

Originally Posted by poised2drive

You do not hit people for expressing their opinion , unless that opinion is taking away your right or infringing on your privacy; which is not the case in this incident.

Erm...I am sure you did not mean what was written after "unless"...

You do not hit people, period. Except in the case of physical self defence, and even then you have to establish that in a court of law.

We are a nation of laws, not a banana republic.

Though I often thing we should go the US way, allow everyone that can have one to get a gun, and then let the chips fall as they may. Even road rage may come down. Try honking/flashing lights at a US "truck" in Texas that has two hunting rifles strapped in plain view at the back. Or even one that doesn't.

[Spitfire]

Before this Vlogger (whatever that even means??) and the peacock riders who beat him up were born or knew what "bikes" meant, we were riding across the country on 100cc, 150cc, 350cc - 2 and 4 Strokes. And I am not even 40 yet. We had no cameras, forget video cameras. We rode for the love of it.

Now we get a bunch of jokers with easy money and fast bikes and still cannot and will not get to an inch of the riding we did. No I do not have proof of reaching Khardungla on 100cc 2-Stroke scooter. Because I will tell you what, we reached there after riding from Goa all the way without a clue what we were doing. We were numb with excitement, our equipment or whatever was left of it did not even suffice to make the vehicles run. Forget buying a 10-15k worth of camera equipment and taking care of it. Heck that amount was all the budget for the trip for 10 guys. No I am not exaggerating. And this was in 1999, when we were still teenagers. On the way back we rebuild on the side of the road the complete engine of an RX-100 and rode back 1000 kms. on it.

We still don't fathom how we did it. Now when that group meets up we shake our heads and smile the most content smile. No words are spoken. We are happy to be alive.

Compare the biking then to the "biking" today -
1. 400cc+ bikes: the torque of one which will be equal to all of the bikes we had within a group of 10.

2. Roads (yes roads) - Ah! the most underrated part of it all.

3. GPS - heck, who remembers those 6x6 feet paper maps. Though detailed it tore and got washed off in the rain within 100 kms. Then it was logic and commonsense from there on.

4. Mobile Phones - STD or Local Booths were non-existent on the 2 lane highways. We used to call home once a week. That too not to tell them we are on the road but that we are happily in the college hostel.

5. Internet and twitter for updates, Facebook Groups like HVK for minute updates - I mean there was this guy who was asking on the HVK facebook forum - "I am standing infront of so and so board, what turn should I take?" He had a minimum of 200 replies.

Think about it, we at 2 AM in the night we were trying to feel the road to see if its strong enough to take the weight of the bikes to ride ahead. On all our fours.

6. Online hotel booking - That is so underrated man!! Its hilarious. We were sleeping on the benches in the railway stations because we had no clue where we were or whether there is something called as a hotel in that village. Electricity and clean drinking water was like a dream in some places enroute.

7. Online spares availability, compact tyre inflators, batteries (dry batteries with no top up required) - You see the value in that today? Do YOU, BIKERS DO YOU? Oh man!! You have no clue.

8. On Call PickUp service - of course you need to pay for it. But you know you will get it. You dont have to take turns to push a 350cc Bullet on a 60 degrees climb, because your moronic friends rode off on their bikes without bothering to look behind. And when they realize it you are lost, rode back 40 kms to find you.

And much more.

Now compare it to these absolute noobs - that Vlogger and the pimped out machine and the misplaced pride.

That Vlogger who is 23 and owns a 1000cc bike is calling others bike names - if you didn't have the luxury of points 1 to 8 above, you would be dead and being vulture fodder on the slush filled plains of this amazing country and no one could have known it for weeks together. Because you could have not walked more then 50 meters pushing through slush with spinning wheels of your 1000cc torque monster.

To the peacocks who have pimped their bike quite literally for all to look at. Fair enough. No issues there. Your bike, your problem. Touching another person - biker or not. You guys get no respect for that. We could have painted our Kinetics like it was born to a peacock on dope too and gone big bore and put it on a stand for others to pass lewd comments on. That's easy. Riding that peacock across the country is not.

To add, we used to treat our bikes like our girlfriends. We could not have let either of them on stage for others to gawk at. It was just us, maybe they were not 800cc 100 bhp or Aiswarya Rai's. But we valued them. So when you call your bike your family, then please do MEAN IT.

On a Serious Note, I am from Goa and IBW is held there. If that vlogger wants to lodge a police complaint he can contact me. We will haul the high and mighty ungrateful rears of those peacocks to the station there. Political connections and all the jazz included. Show the spine first though before you complain.

Side Note:

Originally Posted by Sawyer

I am not at all surprised at this because it is entirely in line with how the country, including its leaders, are behaving these days. Why should bikers be better behaved?

Are you serious? So you are saying before 2014, quite obviously from your posts. That we lived in Utopia? Do you want me to list all the incidents before 2014 and expose your surreal and blatant bias? Or will you stop this almost vulgar and public display of deep rooted hate to a democratically elected government. Political discussions are not allowed here. So please behave.

[scorpian]

@Spitfire,
Hats off to your post,you said it all in your post exactly what was going on in my mind.Most do not realize the real biking that was true and prevalent before the advent of gps,video cameras and all the gadgets.
Your post reminded me of doing the goa-pune route on my dio and yes it was all i had at that time,just fuel,an extra belt and my bag.I had no clue what would happen and how long i would take to reach and who would i ask for help if anything went wrong.
Most of them i know and including myself in this group have stopped visiting IBW cause somewhere the true spirit of biking seems to be lost.

[ku69rd]

Would definitely agree with Spitfire post.

The biking that we used to do back in the mid 90s till mid 2005 was entirely different compared to what we have today. Getting a proper helmet was a luxury which few could manage. The love for roads, food & sheer joy was what propped us up. Still remember referring to the road maps taking directions from the truck drivers to reach our destination. We never had that magic fluid in the tires incase there was a puncture. We had to push or ride the bike on its tank to get it to the nearest help.
The trend has unfortunately changed, is it for the good or bad is something left to each of their perspective. These days we have all the works. Are they being made optimum use of the same? (i cannot answer the question)

Regarding this incident, I feel the Vlogger was the perpetrator. He had not right commenting on bikes owned by people. I can understand if he had commented on a bike in the showroom (unsold). At the same time, the bikers had no business in bashing him up. Possibly wiser sense must have prevailed on the bikers and must have ensured that he takes down the video/photo with the unsavory comments.

To each his own, the owner must have felt his ride looks better with those stickering works. But again right here on team BHP we have a thread that reads as Pics of Weird and Wacky Mod Jobs.

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by Spitfire

That Vlogger who is 23 and owns a 1000cc bike is calling others bike names - if you didn't have the luxury of points 1 to 8 above, you would be dead and being vulture fodder on the slush filled plains of this amazing country and no one could have known it for weeks together. Because you could have not walked more then 50 meters pushing through slush with spinning wheels of your 1000cc torque monster.
.

While you make some interesting points in your post, I don't quite understand what his fatness has got to do with having an opinion.

I do not support the language he used to voice his opinion. But he does have a right to speak up regardless of how overweight or obese he might be.

[ghatotkatch]

Here is the difference if you missed it - no one, neither selfdrive nor the vlogger, is assembling goons to seek out spitfire and beat him for calling someone names. That might be a small difference for some, but big one in my book.

[asit.kulkarni93]

Retaliation upto what extent? Will it be fair if the vlogger now goes to the place where spitfire is and gets violent with him? If he joins the forum and reacts appropriately, the retaliation is acceptable. You can go to any extent thinking how you want to react, but it boils down to how you actually do. We as civilized individuals need to maintain the balance in the society, If we start getting bothered with such social media posts then we will be having a curfew 24x7 with riot police deployed.

[poised2drive]

Originally Posted by Sawyer

Erm...I am sure you did not mean what was written after "unless"...

You do not hit people, period. Except in the case of physical self defence, and even then you have to establish that in a court of law.

We are a nation of laws, not a banana republic.

Though I often thing we should go the US way, allow everyone that can have one to get a gun, and then let the chips fall as they may. Even road rage may come down. Try honking/flashing lights at a US "truck" in Texas that has two hunting rifles strapped in plain view at the back. Or even one that doesn't.

You are partially right.

I did not mean someone is free to indulge in violence if his right is violated.

Having said that, infringing on privacy is a tricky issue and one might be forced to indulge in violence [ grabbing the camera or mobile that is being used to take photos , for instance] to safeguard privacy , when the said privacy is about people and as you said , it should be proved in the court.

Nonetheless, in the present instance, nothing of that sort occured.

[VW2010]

If he joins the forum and reacts appropriately, the retaliation is acceptable.

So basically there is a level of retaliation that is acceptable. This i do not agree. It is either no retaliation and move on or any retaliation. I am for the former but if you accept retaliation and put a scale, i am sorry to disappoint that, that scale is not standard for every individual.

[ashwinprakas]

IBW's stand in the matter;

We condemn such an act. By the time our security men reached the spot, they had all cleared out. We have identified an attacker and the superbike owner, and have decided to ban them from IBW. We do not tolerate such behaviour.

Source: Indiatimes & Cartoq

[asit.kulkarni93]

Originally Posted by VW2010

So basically there is a level of retaliation that is acceptable. This i do not agree. It is either no retaliation and move on or any retaliation. I am for the former but if you accept retaliation and put a scale, i am sorry to disappoint that, that scale is not standard for every individual.

You can not react to anything just on the basis of two extreme possible situations. The scale of retaliation can't be decided by me or you but we have "law & order" for the same . And if you think retaliating this way is the right then as I said this can lead to a greater nuisance. Today it was sanket who did apologize tomorrow it might be a similar group from another city and the fight between these two groups can create a havoc. Honestly this could have been handled better by people managing IBW.

Anyway I think we have a difference of opinion here. This can go on for a long time and I honestly find no reason in discussing this further. I have used your way of no retaliating and my way of Newton's 3rd law at some point of time. Both have their fair share of benefits. Let's agree to disagree!

[Sawyer]

It isn't a question of scale and measurements or standards thereon; it is a question of retaliation not being in kind when violence is used to counter words, spoken or written. It doesn't take a genius to figure that one out.

Indeed, even retaliating in kind against violence is almost always an offence; exceptions that are legal have to be proved in court.

[Neeraj1903]

I request moderators to close this thread because
1. The biker and his friend have been banned by event organisers.
2. The discussion in this thread is not healthy and is unlike other TeamBHP threads. No offence meant to any of the BHPian involved in this thread but just that now that the matter has been closed there is no point in beating dead horse.

Pic courtesy: WhatsApp forward

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by Sawyer

It isn't a question of scale and measurements or standards thereon; it is a question of retaliation not being in kind when violence is used to counter words, spoken or written. It doesn't take a genius to figure that one out.

There is a difference between a reaction and a response. When I respond to somebody I would acknowledge their opinion and try to tell them my opinion and the logic for it. Reactions would be more emotional.
Retaliation is the territory of those who are more judgemental and would like to decide for others (in my opinion). It is a territory where I would not like to see myself; either at the receiving or the delivering end of the stick.