[ashwinprakas]

Originally Posted by nitro.1000bhp

I seriously doubt the 125 would feel faster than 390 or 200. Seat of butt or otherwise. The only marked improvement would be the handling as the 125 would have lesser rotating mass (inertia) than 200 or 390. Precisely why the 200 feels more eager to tip into the corner than 390.

Well, since this has more to do with feel and experience I'm out of words when it comes to describing the feel, though I'd give it a shot.

The Duke 200 lacks the 175cc's and higher CR of the Duke 390 but is more gruntier and eager off idle, this is due to less displacement resistance, which again is the principle that makes multicylinder's more tractile in comparison to a thumper, lower displacement cylinders get going sooner as they have less volume to displace with respect to their bigger counterparts.

The 390 starts getting scarier/exciting once things get into motion but the 200 would stop your heart the moment the throttle is whacked open, there is no foreplay just imminent response, this feel is often misinterpreted as agility due to weight differences but rather than that it is the aggressiveness in the torque curve timing that makes you feel so.

Experienced this first hand when TD'ing a Patina ExhausTECH coming from about 50k+ km's of riding a ZMA which had a stage 3 intake setup, the pull of the Platina took me by surprise as the only small displacement motorcycles I'd ridden to date were the ones from Hero Honda which performed more or less like a smaller ZMA due to their similar bore*stroke properties. The acceleration off idle was a bit scary and made a strong impression even though the mid to top end performance was as expected from a commuter.

Similar experience was the case with a co-rider while riding inter-state, since the dude was a close friend I could not refuse his request to ride my Discover 100 4G through rural TN, so I was on his well maintained almost brand new Yamaha Fazer Gen 1, the motorcycle seemed plush but that was the end of it, it was nowhere as agile as the D100, he was zipping by traffic and was far ahead of me while I was struggling to keep up on the Fazer, though if on the highways where displacement triumphs the results would've been completely different.

We have a few other experiences among the Kerala xBhp chapter where we've witnessed a Honda Shine(125cc) keep perfect pace with an experienced rider on a Honda CBR250R leaving the rest of the riders with higher displacements at a distance.

Myself on my CT100B trailing another CBR250R had given a rider trailing us a tough time on a Yamaha Gen 2 FZ, we also have a few other scenarios were the smaller displacement motorcycles have reached the destination hours before the big boys were able to catch up given the strategic course that had to be taken to reach the said destination.

Anyways, lets wait till we get our hands on the Duke 125 because it is truly nothing like we've experienced before, it would single handed'ly become the hottest running motorcycle in the country as I doubt even super-bikes lurk into the 14:1 territory which if I'm not mistaken used to be Diesel Territory.

God the excitement!

I do echo your thoughts about the future being small and agile . We need more fun, lightweight bikes in our market. This perception that small capacity bikes have to be dull, boring commuters should change soon with bikes like these

That is what the mind says, but the heart knows no logic, it would dwindle down to a single pot, air cooled, SOHC, carburetor fed thumper.

Again going by feel of the tush, carburetor fed machines make you feel the G's more than a state of the art FI setup, as also confirmed by buddies who drag and build thumpers.

We're either a bunch with severe saddle sores or just fools clouded by emotion

[nitro.1000bhp]

Originally Posted by ashwinprakas

Well, since this has more to do with feel and experience I'm out ..

The Duke 200 lacks the 175cc's and higher CR of the Duke 390 but is more gruntier and eager off idle, this is due to less displacement resistance, which again is the principle that makes multicylinder's more tractile in comparison to a thumper, lower displacement cylinders get going sooner as they have less volume to displace with respect to their bigger counterparts.

The 390 starts getting scarier/exciting once things get into motion but the 200 would stop your heart the moment the throttle is whacked open, there is no foreplay just imminent response, this feel is often misinterpreted as agility due to weight differences but rather than that it is the aggressiveness in the torque curve timing that makes you feel so.

Experienced this first hand when TD'ing a Patina ExhausTECH coming from about 50k+ km's of riding a ZMA which had a stage 3 intake setup,
We're either a bunch with severe saddle sores or just fools clouded by emotion

What is displacement resistance? Never heard of this term. But if you're talking about resistance between the Piston and liner it's the same coefficient for the respective metal/alloy used irrespective of cc.

There are a few reasons duke 200 feels peppier than 390 low down the Rev range. One is the lighter piston/flywheel effect which takes lesser time to gain rpms and the other because the throttle cam on the (old gen) 390 is neutered. In other words it takes two twists of the grip to get to full open position so it feels less responsive.

The pros/cons of carb vs fi has been debated to death on all forums . I won't start over but my 2 cents , a drag race doesn't cover all kinds of riding conditions. Fi systems can adapt to differing conditions to provide optimal efficiency which is why they are preferred over carbs.

[tabrez]

Seems like KTM is setting the stage ready for 125-Duke's entry
https://news.maxabout.com/bikes/ktm/...duke-rc-india/

The interesting bit in the article is the speculative pricing of the 790-Duke which is being cited as Rs. 5.99L (ex-showroom).

Back on the topic of price hike, is it just me or does anyone else who feels that the 390 is being systematically stripped of it's VFM quotient ? In Bangalore, the lowest online OTR I can find is over Rs. 3.13L. Sorry for going Off-Topic.

[nosfreak]

i remember during the launch of the D390, a reporter asked about the Duke 125cc, Mr Bajaj's reply was "bring me one customer who would buy it." meaning it wasn't cost effective at that time. Hoping to see a positive pricing from Bajaj which they always do.

If i'm correct the only F.I 125cc is the Hero Glamour sold in India. The discontinued Honda Stunner F.I was good during its time, only the price couldn't justify it.

[ACM]

I feel the call wrt a duke 125 is short sighted and will result in duke brand dilution at the cost of numbers in the short run.

[payeng]

Originally Posted by ACM

I feel the call wrt a duke 125 is short sighted and will result in duke brand dilution at the cost of numbers in the short run.

I concur with you.

This news could also be a speculation generated by the press. There hasn't been any official announcement of the same.

Bajaj/KTM India will be well aware that there would hardly be any takers for the 125 cc KTM.

[jpcoolguy]

Originally Posted by ACM

I feel the call wrt a duke 125 is short sighted and will result in duke brand dilution at the cost of numbers in the short run.

Originally Posted by payeng

I concur with you.

This news could also be a speculation generated by the press. There hasn't been any official announcement of the same.

Bajaj/KTM India will be well aware that there would hardly be any takers for the 125 cc KTM.

Exactly, my thoughts. Bajaj would be wary of what they have done to the brand "Discover" after launching multiple variants, which has destroyed the brand, leading to abysmal sales from a high of second largest bikes just behind the Splendour series.

[Kuldeep31]

KTM might have missed the entire plot with their pricing. With an ex-showroom price of 1.25, they have ventured in the territory of R15 and some 200 ccs. I see no reason for picking a naked KTM 125 over a fully faired, vastly more accomplished segment leader of sort R15. Except for the USD, TFT console (it doesn’t even offer ABS) other gizmos are more or less similar to a Gixxer/ Hornet. Mechanically too, specs of the bike fall in the 150cc category. IMO they should have kept it around the 1.05- 1.10 mark to pull potential customers of Gixxer/ Hornet/ Apache. https://news.maxabout.com/bikes/ktm/...rnPW6v0t9lvsho

[TusharK]

A test mule of the KTM 125 Duke has been spotted testing in India. The bike was spotted on the outskirts of Pune.



The 125 Duke is reported to be KTM's new entry-level offering in India. In terms of styling, the bike looks similar to the 200 Duke. The test bike has an underbody exhaust and is sporting orange alloy wheels. It also has a rear disc brake.

In the international market, the KTM 125 Duke is offered with a fuel-injected 124.7cc, single-cylinder, liquid-cooled engine that delivers 14.8 BHP and 12 Nm of torque. The engine is mated to a 6-speed transmission.

The bike comes with an upside-down telescopic fork suspension at the front and a monoshock at the rear. Stopping power is provided by a single 300 mm disc brake with a 4-piston caliper at the front and a 230 mm disc brake with a 1-piston caliper at the rear. It also gets ABS.

At present, technical details of the India-spec 125 Duke are unknown.

Source:

TheDukeist / Youtube

Link to Team-BHP News

[landcruiser123]

Somehow I'm feeling that it might not get the volumes KTM might expect from a product priced very low. The guy who wants a KTM will buy a 200, the guy who doesn't want to spend much will get a Pulsar 2xx. That being said, I'm surprised they never launched it before- they were making this bike in India and it'd not costed them too much to start selling it.

Can Audi sell many A1's for 20 lakhs? Not too many.
From the Corolla to Crysta and Superb to Passat, A1 will get lost in the price range.

Lower you go in the market, the products are more for utility than desire.

[LordSharan]

KTM Duke 125 is launched with ABS at 1.18L ex showroom, Delhi.

Link- https://www.motoroids.com/news/ktm-d...inr-1-18-lakh/

What started off as a rumour, is today’s reality. The KTM Duke 125 ABS has been launched in India today. Priced at at an introductory price of INR 118,163 (ex-showroom Delhi), it will be available across 450 exclusive KTM showrooms in India. Almost a Duke 200 with a smaller engine, the bike has been bolted around a trellis frame, features an aluminium swingarm, USD front forks and ABS.

To give you more details, the motor is a DOHC, 4 valve, liquid cooled and fuel injected unit which cranks out 14.5 PS at 9,250 rpm and 12 Nm at 8,000 rpm, paired with a 6-speed gearbox. The KTM Duke 125 ABS weighs 141 kilos dry, 148 with fluids and its fuel tank can carry 10.2 litres of the good stuff. Meant for beginners as a stepping stone into brand KTM and performance motorcycling, seat height stand at 818 mm.

[jpcoolguy]

The Bajaj-KTM website however seems to not have updated with Duke 125 launch. Not sure how true is the launch news, Bajaj is known to make right noises when launching a new product, not silence. However, the sites like BikeWale, BikeDekho have been updated with the price for Duke 125.

1.18L seems optimistic pricing for this bike considering the another pocket rocket R15 retails at 1.28L ex-showroom and has more oomph than Duke 125. Even, the less glamour FZ25 retails at 1.21L. Not sure whether Bajaj made the right call to launch this bike at this price and we need to wait and see how the market reacts to this in upcoming months.

[sukiwa]

So, KTM launched Duke 125 at almost same launch price of Duke 200 in 2012 .

[ram.iyer95]

That pricing (that too introductory) might come across as a sticker shock for most! Though the engine output figures seem impressive for a 125, in India, where higher cubic capacity motorcycles are generally associated with status, it might not be received well.

When we have capable motorcycles like the TVS Apache RTR 200, Yamaha R15 and FZ25, Bajaj's ever-popular NS200 in this price segment, why would anyone buy a 125 for similar money? Heck, even the Duke 200 can be had for around ₹1.6 lakhs ex-showroom The only advantage I see here is ABS being offered as standard, but many competitor bikes have it as well. After all, there is no replacement for displacement.

Seems like Bajaj-KTM has lost the aggression that they exhibited while pricing the Duke 390.

[MaheshY1]

Stupid pricing. It makes about the same power as the Gixxer SF ABS. And less than the RTR 200 ABS. Both of which cost less to buy and to own. Hell, for a small premium, the R15 will give more power and comes with:

1. Variable valve timing (something people should care about)
2. Fairing (something people do care about)

For the old styling? Hell no. If it had the 390's LED headlight, color dash, Bluetooth, then maybe it'd have made some sense. But, for 1.18L, there are better options out there that may have one less gear to shift but offer far better value.

Total turn off after the RE and Jawa. I'm not getting my hopes high for the Huskies either.