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-   -   Mumbai biker's death in Leh raises questions about unorganized tour operators (https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motorbikes/210541-mumbai-bikers-death-leh-raises-questions-about-unorganized-tour-operators.html)

Just came across this sad but eye-opening news article from Midday

Unrealistic expectations IMHO!

Any motorcycle tour (or group ride) is always under own risks. The company can at best arrange for a backup vehicle, while normally they arrange only the logistics and accommodation. They can't ensure safety on the road - that purely depends on the rider, and most of all - luck as well.

The road isn't a game park, nor a controlled environment. Not even the government can guarantee safety on such trips - it is up to individuals to understand the risks and proceed with caution.

Sad news indeed. However seems like they are trying to shift the blame here. Lot of my colleagues go to these trips to leh ladakh, and are perfectly happy with the services provided. As far as I have heard from them, these organizers have a mini car garage, and a doctor or two in the group for emergencies. Rest what do they expect.

Lack of preparation is a critical factor that mostly gets overlooked, and most non-professional organizers don't seem to care how (in)experienced the riders are, as long as they pay up. One needs more than a bike and an adventurous spirit to tackle some of the most punishing terrain on earth, but most are led to believe all they need to do is turn up to win.

It will always be risky - two wheelers are inherently risky in the best of terrain - but this case appears to be one of many where people just give in to an impulse believing it will all work out, until it doesn't, and grieving families are left behind to pick up the pieces.

This bit really stands out from the article. Cross-country biking trip, and no alternate contact info?

Sadly, questions that should've been asked and answered as part of preparation for the trip.

To all bikers on this forum, please follow your passion but ensure your families have all the necessary information to react to an emergency, and aren't left searching for answers and paperwork in case of an unfortunate outcome.

Sad news indeed, may the departed RIP.

Though i completely agree with Crazy_driver here, this seems to be heading in a wrong path. What kind of T&C did the rider agree to, usually it is signed without reading, and i am sure the organizers would have themselves well covered in the clauses.

This needs to be taken as a lesson learnt, and also push for more precaution. I have myself been having the itch to do this sector from past few years. The question i kept asking myself was am i ready for it, what happens if something untoward happen, is this all worth it, and till now answer i have been getting is a resounding no. The day it turns to yes, i will make a long preparation list, get physically fit and then take it up.

In the mean time, it was a very good and relaxed trip on the fortuner :)

TBH, I think the rider and even the family were aware of the risks and will come to terms with the death of their family member soon. But it is the way it was handled is what has really saddened and I am sure angered them. They are right in their anger too!

Yes, the road isn't a controlled environment. But the company should have had the cojones to firstly keep the family informed, have someone accompany the body and even help in getting the paperwork done. Also in releasing the person's personal belongings at least. I find your post very unsympathetic.

Yes, accidents happen but the company knows the risk. They should have had the courage to follow through too.

I may sound harsh but when someone puts themselves on a bike - he/she understands the risk. People may be passionate about biking but you need to understand the reality rather than live in dreams; which is that anything goes wrong and a biker is at the receiving end. And on the Indian highway where there is virtually no control on speeds and road conditions are unfamiliar hence the risk is multiplied manifold.

I have loved riding my bike but on the highway? Nope. Also, the first time I thought riding a bike was dangerous even in a city, I stopped doing that. My passion was just not worth the risk.

As for this case, no one really knows the truth. There will be multiple versions of it and eventually someone who has more clout will prevail. It is dreadful for his family; but we as a nation do not give two hoots about Road Safety, until it comes back to bite us.

A very sad news indeed but as fellow members have said lack of preparedness and safety is the main reason for the casualties. Blaming the tour organiser for the whole fiasco is not the right thing. The onus lies on the rider too.

Whatever happened is a very sad incident. There is no substitute for human life. Half prepared organisers, ill trained riders unforgiving terrains, the list is too long for finding out faults.
1. Organisers blame. The idea of making a quick buck by organisers has proven to be fatal for a lot of people. Most of organising teams do not have any medical backup. With the terrains being extremely harsh and unpredictable, you can never expect what is waiting round the corners. And most of these small time organisers have next to nothing in the backup vehicle, any mishap is bound to be troublesome as medical facilities and network coverage is almost non existent in places.
2. Riders blame. Over confidence is the thing that grounds most of drivers. The fake sense of security that I have driven 1 lakh kilometres without any incident, I have done Leh tour 5 times earlier is not a good thing. Roads are improving now, earlier it was just a mud trail. One rainfall and the entire old track will be gone and a new one created. Not paying a heed to traffic conditions at all. I have just got a gentleman with all riding gear on way to Leh , trying to overtake me from left side for almost 15 kilometres. With the current four lane construction hampering traffic, allowing a vehicle to overtake is not always possible to pass. And finally when I had let him go, he and his his bike with entire stuff was lieing in a 4-5 feet deep trench dug for road cutting. And that great soul was cursing the labour instead of accepting that he was on wrong way.
3. Government blame. There are minimal registration formalities for all sort of adventure sports. No check at all. This tourist season, when government cracked down on adventure sport organisers in Manali and Kulu, some shocking revelations were made. Raft drivers not knowing to swim, Glider pilots not having any official training, and so on. The list is too long.

And in given particular case, it is next to impossible to find out what happened and it is very much unlikely to produce a witness. In the end, only sufferers are the family of deceased. For police, this is nothing but a case and file number. There are plenty instances of our intellectual police botching up cases in one or other way.

P.S. I am in no way discouraging people. You might be invincible after 1 lakh kilometres on road, but hills are unforgiving. One wrong decision will leave you bed ridden for life. Always follow rules, do not over speed in hills, never overtake from wrong side, if vehicles are caught in jam, do not be over smart and make another lane and block the traffic completely. Don't go on secluded trips without informing atleast one known person.
In the end, just want to say, No adventure is bigger than human life. Be safe yourself and keep others safe as well. Humans don't come with replacements. So be safe, and arrive safe.

It could be due the rider's lack of preparation of riding on dirt and slush/mud/gravel/stony tracks. Once you go past spiti valley, the roads are basically river beds which could be dry, slushly or with running rapids depending on the day of the hour. Late afternoons are rapids due snow melt and any time before 10am and post 4 pm expect black ice especially on shadowy stretches.
Riding on each of this varying conditions requires different skillsets. Riding on smooth gravel, slush, rocks, shallow river beds etc all changing rapidly hour to hour is what should be expected. Ideally the tour company must have experienced riders conduct daily briefing, buddy riding always and have walkie talkie communication with the lead and the tail. Simple precautions like this may have saved his life, due timely medical help.

I am surprised nobody has gone beyond the written word and done some background check on this guy Fakira Rider. Absolute imbecile of the first order.

https://youtu.be/-Xqkp_WDJo0

This guy needs to go behind bars for the fact that he continues the tour inspite of what happened as opposed to accompanying the body home. Will teach every other vlogger out there a good lesson.

I'm not surprised at some of the posts that show a lot of ignorance and implied assumptions by a good majority on and off the forum with regards to the structure and operations of these "tour operators". This is not only concerning to motor-biking, but applies to other group activities - trekking, hiking, cycling, rafting and a few more.

Let me give a bit of background - I have been trekking, hiking, riding and cycling over the western ghats over the last 15+ years; from a time period when these ghats were in pristine form & untouched from a commercial standpoint (from an group activity perspective). Back then the number of folks doing such activities were way lesser, and much better informed/capable of handling themselves in case of emergencies.

For example, peaks like Harishchandragad, Raigad, Tikona, Bhimashankar, Lohegad, Naneghat and many more; if one had to do a trek to any of these peaks, one had to assemble a group and gather information from locals and undertake the activity knowing the risks involved. You made an informed decision even before embarking on the trip. If you newly joined a group of hikers, the senior ones would validate your experience and dissuade newbies from the tough hikes. Same used to be the case for cycling trips and other activities/sports.

But slowly operators and activity organizations started picking up a commercial motive to these. And voila - today you have a plethora of choices to do different activities in the market, and in most cases, there are no checks and balances, neither from the operator side nor from the individual side. The operator manages the travel and bookings and charges the members a slight premium. Just a simple NDA is signed that has a waiver clause on the operator from all liability. This is set one.

In addition to these, there are a lot of "group activities" where a few enthusiastic guys plan out the travel itinerary and volunteer to manage the bookings while others are invited to join in; and most of the rest blindly agree to the final plan. There are no NDAs signed, there is no single ownership of the entire trip. It's just a bunch of guys and gals grouping together to gain the (economic) benefits of a larger set. This is set two, a much much larger set.

In both sets, folks like you and me jump in with minimal clarity on what to do in case of emergencies, who's responsible, whom do we reach out for support. There is no validation if every individual has the necessary experience, fitness and knowledge to do such an activity/trip. Sometimes fellow participants/riders stop to help; but it's a voluntary action at most. In both sets, the organizer/operator has probably no liability in case of a legal/police case. Let me give a more understandable example, say you, I and a few more tbhpians plan and go on a long breakfast drive and one of us gets into a serious/fatal accident, the rest are not responsible in any manner.

In a way, these problems are going to happen again and again as long as we, the potential participants of such activities don't take the extra effort on realizing the underlying risks of participating in such group activities and take proper pre-emptive steps.

True that, anyone who rides a motorcycle or facilitates it should be well aware of the fact that something's about to get every rider sooner or later, and at times when it does there's really not much anyone can do, that's simply how this is.

As for abandonment, I do not see this to be a clear case of that, if you were to ask me I'd say the guys from HOG who resumed their ride in spite of a fellow rider succumbing to his injuries after an accident, is more guilty of the same than any random tour operator is.

That's just me.

May the fallen rest is peace.
A.P.

Lots of thoughts. I've done Leh on a bike twice, separated by 9 years, first time in 2007 and second time in 2016. Know friends from Bangalore who were riding to Ladakh solo on their bikes as far back as in the late 90s and early 2000s.

The number of people has certainly increased. The 90s were guys like my buddies who were great riders, took the trouble to find out whatever they could by talking to people and basically took great pains to make the trip happen. They knew bikes in and out, were capable of making most repairs on the go and were totally ok camping and sleeping/eating rough.

The second 'wave' was guys like me on my first trip. Small groups, 2-3 riders who knew and trusted each other. A lot of the ground work had been done, information was quite easily available, routes were well plotted, there was basic tourist infrastructure in place. But still it required some level of planning, interaction with the more experienced people who had done the ride and some level of self-reliability when it came to riding or fixing the bike. At least changing tyres, swapping cables, etc.

Now it's basically tourism. And a lot of riders do it just because it needs to be ticked off a bucket list, for instagram/bragging rights. Bikes are reliable, tour operators abound, huge groups, 'biker brotherhood', ride to Khardung to support women's rights, veterans welfare, against animal cruelty, etc etc, there are planned stops on the way and even luxury stays at places like Pangong. As such, the 'entry barrier' so to speak has gone down, people who can barely ride are planning Leh, forget about being able to fend for themselves in case of a breakdown or accident or unscheduled stop en route. Whats worse, people who have the done the ride once or twice begin to believe they're now qualified enough to 'lead' a large group and turn it into a career option. The exact same thing is happening in the adventure sport scene in India btw.

Let's face it, and maybe I'm going to get a lot of outrage for this but- yes, if something does go wrong, it can be a nightmare, but otherwise, riding to Ladakh now is really not a big biking or endurance achievement. Yeah, it's beautiful and very satisfying, but it's hardly the Paris-Dakar you know :).

Am not saying no one should ride to Ladakh, it's a great experience. And I am certainly no one to judge who should be 'allowed' to go there. Not saying x person who knows how to dismantle and put together an engine should be allowed while someone who does not know how to change a bike tyre should not (anyway, that's what tubeless tyres are for right! :)). But when the ride itself is being fueled by a tour operator's commercial interests or motivated just to say one did it, then incidents like this are going to multiply.

And going by the Ladakhi response to other such things, I think we're soon going to be looking at 'only official bike tours run by the Leh bike tour association allowed'.

Will end with one observation from the 2016 ride (which was incidentally my wife and I on one bike). En route, got the chance to help a few bikers, 3 who had flat tyres, one who was running out of fuel. I noticed that ALL the solo riders and the smaller groups of 2-3 riders who were passing by would stop to see what was wrong and offer to help. NONE of the big tour groups stopped at all, they just swept past, despite they being the guys who had the backup vehicle and spares! Make whatever you will out of that fact.


EDIT: None of this is making any such assumption about the incident that is the main topic of this thread. Just want to make that clear, whatever I posted is not about this particular incident.

As someone who also likes to roam around on two wheels - I do understand what made him undertake that trip, and wish his soul peace. And my heart goes out to the family.

That said - the post is only related to the questions posted in the article, and is only realistic IMHO. I have neither mentioned the rider, nor the family in the post for this reason, but hope others who plan such rides do take strong note of the risks involved and proceed with caution! As evident recently - this is becoming a big tourism industry of sorts, but the mountains remain the same as ever - a very hostile riding environment.

Would totally disagree, however! What else is life worth living for, if not for passions?