Hero Honda 4T oil in Gladiator

Hashim · 13th April 2009, 17:13

Yamaha service is going bad really bad, today I went to auth. yamaha dealer for my gladiator service and instead of yamalube (original oil used in yamaha bikes) they used Hero honda 4T because yamalube now cost Rs.400 and Hero honda 4T comes for Rs.185. He convinced me that time that its equally good and every dealer is using this oil only. I could do nothing but agree because he had already poured the oil when I was not around and yamalube was not in stock as well.
Now after service I feel bike is not that smooth as it was before, I can feel engine vibration

Experts please advice what to do? get the oil changed or keep it?

Also the bike was having engine shutting down problem on zero throttle which they fixed but RPM is not same, its varying. When engine is hot, its engine is running very fast. They set the RPM to recommended 1300 when engine was hot but when I came home after service its again running very high, I don't have tacho but I can sesnse from sound that its not 1300.
When bike was new, its RPM used to be even. What could be the problem?

Raccoon · 14th April 2009, 01:37

ROTFL... this is really funny!

Anyway, if you gonna use HH oil, try and avoid the one made by BPCL. I'v not used it myself, but it seems most who have used it don't find it upto the mark.

Anyway, why use HH branded oil in your Yamaha? Just go for something better like Gulf Pride 4t. Much better oil at just slightly higher price. There are many other choices...

As for your RPM problem, it should be set on hot engine only. You think your RPM is higher than 1300? Try getting your carb cleaned properly. Also check the spark plug gap.

Hashim · 14th April 2009, 19:55

Yes that oil was made by BP. At service they first cleaned the air filter, washed the bike and gave me. I had to scold wash man to apply polish as well and when I found RPM problem not fixed, shout at mechanic as well. He then cleaned the carb jet and also checked timing chain.
After riding it today, I feel engine RPM is ok when bike engine is run for say 5km but when driving contineously for 10km or more and bike engine is extremely hot (read after abuse) the RPM is definately around 1800 I guess. Is this normal ?

Silver Knight · 14th April 2009, 21:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raccoon

ROTFL... this is really funny!

Anyway, if you gonna use HH oil, try and avoid the one made by BPCL. I'v not used it myself, but it seems most who have used it don't find it upto the mark.

Anyway, why use HH branded oil in your Yamaha? Just go for something better like Gulf Pride 4t. Much better oil at just slightly higher price. There are many other choices...

As for your RPM problem, it should be set on hot engine only. You think your RPM is higher than 1300? Try getting your carb cleaned properly. Also check the spark plug gap.

But it seems: Please explain that. I would like to tell you one thing Hero Honda don't give approvals to any tom dick and harry and more importantly without sticking to quality BP cannot hold on with the approval for long.
Also if you want I can give you the concerned Sales Officer in the area to take up the quality issue as chances of spurious cannot be written off. And one piece of advise to all bhpians. As far as possible try to buy lubricants from petrol bunks as they get direct delivery from company. For other brands like Castrol Gulf etc try to source from reputed and well known lube shops.

Raccoon · 15th April 2009, 01:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hashim

Yes that oil was made by BP. At service they first cleaned the air filter, washed the bike and gave me. I had to scold wash man to apply polish as well and when I found RPM problem not fixed, shout at mechanic as well. He then cleaned the carb jet and also checked timing chain.
After riding it today, I feel engine RPM is ok when bike engine is run for say 5km but when driving contineously for 10km or more and bike engine is extremely hot (read after abuse) the RPM is definately around 1800 I guess. Is this normal ?

Polish? They actually polish your bike after the service?? Which polish?

If the RPM is set correctly, then any deviation is not at all normal. Maybe a tiny bit... say 50 - 100 RPM above the set range might be permissable when the engine is very hot, and also due to any possible variation in atmospheric pressure, ambient temprature, etc. This is for "normal" use. If you suddenly decide to ride off to a place of high altitude or something, you may see a bigger change... but this is not your case as such changes are not observed when riding within a city.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silver Knight

But it seems: Please explain that. I would like to tell you one thing Hero Honda don't give approvals to any tom dick and harry and more importantly without sticking to quality BP cannot hold on with the approval for long.
Also if you want I can give you the concerned Sales Officer in the area to take up the quality issue as chances of spurious cannot be written off. And one piece of advise to all bhpians. As far as possible try to buy lubricants from petrol bunks as they get direct delivery from company. For other brands like Castrol Gulf etc try to source from reputed and well known lube shops.

I wont speak about Hero Honda's overall quality standard, as after getting my new CBZ, I don't quite think so highly of them. Won't get into that here, but I'v heard several people say that BPCL's HH oil does not perform as well as the one from Idemitsu or Tide Water Oil. Anyway, feel free to confirm this for yourself... just suggesting that you try the other manufacturers and check this out for yourself.

Wont ask for the Sales Officer's details as I currently don't use any BPCL products except their petrol... lol.

As for the spurious oil, I always have that on my mind before buying oil from anywhere... even authorised shops/dealers. I'd suggest others do the same.

Hashim · 15th April 2009, 10:03

They use some liquid polish, it was yellow color bottle, some unbranded stuff but it gave very good shine.

A new question arise here, how to check if oil is duplicate? Is there any test?
I suggested mechanic why not use castrol 4T, but he said most of them are fake. He also showed me one gladiator gearbox which was open for cleaning. Owner had used fake engine oil in that engine and it was so dirty from inside, small bits of metal, carbon residue etc.

Raccoon · 15th April 2009, 17:31

Castrol is known to have maximum fakes... so maximum risk if you want to use it. Anyway, there are better oils available. But you should still be careful. Buy only from v well known places/authorised dealers/petrol bunks. Check the seal and container very carefully. Also, if you stick to one brank, you'll become fimilar with the colour, etc., of the oil; and also the kind of seal and containers used. So if you get a duplicate in future, it will be easier to tell.

ravi@64bhp · 15th April 2009, 17:47

Hashim, if you are not satisfied by the HH oil, you can change it outside and see the difference. You can use Gulf Pride or Elf MotoGold as suggested by Raccoon. They are really good.

YamaLube at Rs.400 might be semisynth oil which is w50 oil. The mineral YamaLube is priced somewhere at 185 bucks which is made by Mobil. (correct me if I am wrong).

Hashim, have you been using YamaLube semisyth all these days?? If yes, obviously you feel the difference as the SemiSynth is better than normal mineral oil.

But, as per manual Gladiator needs 20w40 oil (correct me if I am wrong), and why you want to go for w50 semisynth?? Of course, using w50 oil in hot conditions is good theoretically.

Hashim · 15th April 2009, 19:46

Mineral yamalube is used at service center. I wanted to change oil but fear I might get some fake stuff and ruin the engine. At least watever is inside right now is original, though performance is not as smooth as yamalube. I talked to service center and yamalube will be avaialble in few days. I might get it changed then.

Raccoon · 16th April 2009, 01:52

I'm not fan of Castrol, but what I don't understand is why these service centres say they dont use Castrol because fakes are rampant! Usually they get oil in bulk - be it individual bottles in crates or barrels. And these can easily be gotten from an authorised source... and also checked for genuineness. If an individual customer like me can do it, so can they!

I'm mentioning this because I had written to TVS for some query and they passed it on to the local dealership. And the guy gave me the same crap. I find it fishy. Mebbe there is some other hidden agenda...

Btw, don't assume that what they put inside your bike is genuine just because the authroised service centre did it. Check the bottle and all... and get it changed in front of you.

greatmana2000 · 3rd May 2009, 15:52

The gladiator does have tis problem of idling . The timing has to be set when the engine is cold and the idling is set after the engine has heated up . This is because of the lean burn engine technology .

You might have idling related problems ,may b because the service centre guy did not set the valve adjustment properly .

If that is the case you can get to the local Yamaha office in your state and I am sure you will get a properly serviced bike .

I had to do this once when the service centre guy did not adjust the valves and they argued that the timing and valve adjustment was correct . But after a phone aall from the yamaha office the guy serviced the bike in front of me and the difference was day and night .

For inlet valve the gap is supposed to be .5 and for outlet it is .7 .

Hashim · 3rd May 2009, 19:22

Thanks! I'll definately contact yamaha office now because bike has developed starting problem also. It was really a bad day when I went for service.

13th April 2009, 17:13	#1
Hashim BHPian Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aligarh Posts: 449 Thanked: 49 Times View My Garage	Hero Honda 4T oil in Gladiator Yamaha service is going bad really bad, today I went to auth. yamaha dealer for my gladiator service and instead of yamalube (original oil used in yamaha bikes) they used Hero honda 4T because yamalube now cost Rs.400 and Hero honda 4T comes for Rs.185. He convinced me that time that its equally good and every dealer is using this oil only. I could do nothing but agree because he had already poured the oil when I was not around and yamalube was not in stock as well. Now after service I feel bike is not that smooth as it was before, I can feel engine vibration Experts please advice what to do? get the oil changed or keep it? Also the bike was having engine shutting down problem on zero throttle which they fixed but RPM is not same, its varying. When engine is hot, its engine is running very fast. They set the RPM to recommended 1300 when engine was hot but when I came home after service its again running very high, I don't have tacho but I can sesnse from sound that its not 1300. When bike was new, its RPM used to be even. What could be the problem?
	() Thanks

14th April 2009, 01:37	#2
Raccoon Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Poona Posts: 1,851 Thanked: 116 Times	ROTFL... this is really funny! Anyway, if you gonna use HH oil, try and avoid the one made by BPCL. I'v not used it myself, but it seems most who have used it don't find it upto the mark. Anyway, why use HH branded oil in your Yamaha? Just go for something better like Gulf Pride 4t. Much better oil at just slightly higher price. There are many other choices... As for your RPM problem, it should be set on hot engine only. You think your RPM is higher than 1300? Try getting your carb cleaned properly. Also check the spark plug gap.
	() Thanks

14th April 2009, 19:55	#3
Hashim BHPian Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aligarh Posts: 449 Thanked: 49 Times View My Garage	Yes that oil was made by BP. At service they first cleaned the air filter, washed the bike and gave me. I had to scold wash man to apply polish as well and when I found RPM problem not fixed, shout at mechanic as well. He then cleaned the carb jet and also checked timing chain. After riding it today, I feel engine RPM is ok when bike engine is run for say 5km but when driving contineously for 10km or more and bike engine is extremely hot (read after abuse) the RPM is definately around 1800 I guess. Is this normal ?
	() Thanks

15th April 2009, 10:03	#6
Hashim BHPian Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aligarh Posts: 449 Thanked: 49 Times View My Garage	They use some liquid polish, it was yellow color bottle, some unbranded stuff but it gave very good shine. A new question arise here, how to check if oil is duplicate? Is there any test? I suggested mechanic why not use castrol 4T, but he said most of them are fake. He also showed me one gladiator gearbox which was open for cleaning. Owner had used fake engine oil in that engine and it was so dirty from inside, small bits of metal, carbon residue etc.
	() Thanks

15th April 2009, 17:31	#7
Raccoon Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Poona Posts: 1,851 Thanked: 116 Times	Castrol is known to have maximum fakes... so maximum risk if you want to use it. Anyway, there are better oils available. But you should still be careful. Buy only from v well known places/authorised dealers/petrol bunks. Check the seal and container very carefully. Also, if you stick to one brank, you'll become fimilar with the colour, etc., of the oil; and also the kind of seal and containers used. So if you get a duplicate in future, it will be easier to tell.
	() Thanks

15th April 2009, 17:47	#8
ravi@64bhp BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 602 Thanked: 10 Times	Hashim, if you are not satisfied by the HH oil, you can change it outside and see the difference. You can use Gulf Pride or Elf MotoGold as suggested by Raccoon. They are really good. YamaLube at Rs.400 might be semisynth oil which is w50 oil. The mineral YamaLube is priced somewhere at 185 bucks which is made by Mobil. (correct me if I am wrong). Hashim, have you been using YamaLube semisyth all these days?? If yes, obviously you feel the difference as the SemiSynth is better than normal mineral oil. But, as per manual Gladiator needs 20w40 oil (correct me if I am wrong), and why you want to go for w50 semisynth?? Of course, using w50 oil in hot conditions is good theoretically.
	() Thanks

15th April 2009, 19:46	#9
Hashim BHPian Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aligarh Posts: 449 Thanked: 49 Times View My Garage	Mineral yamalube is used at service center. I wanted to change oil but fear I might get some fake stuff and ruin the engine. At least watever is inside right now is original, though performance is not as smooth as yamalube. I talked to service center and yamalube will be avaialble in few days. I might get it changed then.
	() Thanks

16th April 2009, 01:52	#10
Raccoon Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Poona Posts: 1,851 Thanked: 116 Times	I'm not fan of Castrol, but what I don't understand is why these service centres say they dont use Castrol because fakes are rampant! Usually they get oil in bulk - be it individual bottles in crates or barrels. And these can easily be gotten from an authorised source... and also checked for genuineness. If an individual customer like me can do it, so can they! I'm mentioning this because I had written to TVS for some query and they passed it on to the local dealership. And the guy gave me the same crap. I find it fishy. Mebbe there is some other hidden agenda... Btw, don't assume that what they put inside your bike is genuine just because the authroised service centre did it. Check the bottle and all... and get it changed in front of you.
	() Thanks

3rd May 2009, 15:52	#11
greatmana2000 BANNED Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: chennai Posts: 703 Thanked: 58 Times	The gladiator does have tis problem of idling . The timing has to be set when the engine is cold and the idling is set after the engine has heated up . This is because of the lean burn engine technology . You might have idling related problems ,may b because the service centre guy did not set the valve adjustment properly . If that is the case you can get to the local Yamaha office in your state and I am sure you will get a properly serviced bike . I had to do this once when the service centre guy did not adjust the valves and they argued that the timing and valve adjustment was correct . But after a phone aall from the yamaha office the guy serviced the bike in front of me and the difference was day and night . For inlet valve the gap is supposed to be .5 and for outlet it is .7 .
	() Thanks

3rd May 2009, 19:22	#12
Hashim BHPian Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aligarh Posts: 449 Thanked: 49 Times View My Garage	Thanks! I'll definately contact yamaha office now because bike has developed starting problem also. It was really a bad day when I went for service.
	() Thanks