[shivasuma]

Originally Posted by microaubin

Loved the review. And three other things

1. Lockable Glove Box:- Really need this especially in India. Don't recall seeing it in the current crop of cars except Maruti Omni.

I think the jetta has a lockable glove box.

[raul]

This makes the Jetta look good, which itself is overpriced. So we have a chain of massively overpriced vehicles creating their own dynamic on incoming models.

I really don't see how this is value for money given you can get a loaded Passat or even stretch a bit and get a Beemer or go for better equipped Superb, Sonata and save some bucks.

What happens if they don't get the 200 numbers, are the pricing and marketing folks accountable or do they just pull a figure out of thin air? A Camry for 26-28 lakhs, its unreal!

Without getting into the tired argument about overpriced cars in India let's just compare the prices in the US to get a feel for the huge skew and the strong stuff Toyota India is smoking!

[Vid6639]

Disappointing to say the least. When the specs were out, I was sure Toyota would pull out a winner here in terms of pricing since they removed so many stuff. Only 2 airbags, no TCS, no rear sun shades (even my Altis has them!) and lots of other stuff as well removed.

23.8L ex-showroom is more than the Superb Diesel DSG Ambition and a little less than the Passat Comfortline DSG. Those 2 cars are packed to the gills in terms of features and are diesel!!! What were Toyota thinking?? With this, the Sonata can actually take advantage and really challenge the German's.

I don't see this reaching even triple digits monthly.

[Hayek]

Decent car, insane pricing but fabulous review.

Don't agree with the diesel obsession of many here - having tested the diesel Jetta and 3 series, I must say that there is true value to the fabulous smoothness of a petrol. And as I have said on another thread, anybody thinking that the GOI can keep up the Potemkin village display it is putting up on fuel prices is smoking the same stuff that the Toyota pricing and spec team have been smoking. Rs. 23 l ex showroom Delhi probably means Rs 29-30l OTR Bombay - cheap compared to the new 3 series but crazy by every other benchmark. The skimping on airbags is very surprising. Benchmarking it to the old Accord however does not make sense - I presume it would be much better to drive with a 6AT than the Accord. And reliability alone can't sell cars - the price difference compared to a Superb 7DSG is so large that you could probably keep a spare DSG gearbox in stock and still be better off.

[mayjay]

Originally Posted by raul

Without getting into the tired argument about overpriced cars in India let's just compare the prices in the US to get a feel for the huge skew and the strong stuff Toyota India is smoking!

While it is natural to compare to the US, just to add perspective consider this. The Camry sold close to 30,000 examples in the US. In the month of July. Here the poor guys have set a monthly target of 200.

Having said that, theres no reason why it should be specced so badly at this price. In fact if Honda can sell its accord for 20 lakh / 21.x lakh for auto, surely Toyota should be able to match it. If they try.

[Jaggu]

Thank you all for all these awesome feedback. I had to rush out on a personal trip after the review was posted and hence some quick replies for the time being.

Originally Posted by GTO

These cars easily match an E Class and 5 series for backseat comfort.

From a person who owns the first gen Indian camry and the latest 5: "Toyota is miles ahead when it comes to rear seat comfort"

Originally Posted by mayjay

In fact if you compare the 2002, 2006 and this one, the A,B,C pillars including that rear window quarter-glass are almost unchanged. The doors are also quite similar, with a rising waist-line being added in the current one by cleverly changing the shape of the door mirror base.

Yes only the body panels which i believe refer to the sheet metals are new, the ABC goes with chassis.

Originally Posted by W.A.G.7

* parking brake intrusion - Will the parking brake not get mistakenly pressed while keeping the foot on the dead pedal? What if this happens at high speed?
* pricing is horribly wrong.

Excellent thread and pics anyways!

Thanks, and no when the brakes are not activated, the chances of the pedal touching is a rarest of the rare situation. If you are used to parking brakes in start stop traffic, then you will have an issue.

Originally Posted by avira_tk

Toyota needs to get a big size diesel sedan from wherever they can.

Originally Posted by karan561

Why doesnt Toyota offer this with a diesel ? The volumes will increase exponentially.

Answered below. Camry USP is refinement and in Toyota's book, oil burners are not yet there.

Originally Posted by karpusv

A little search and I find that the Camry is not available anywhere globally with a Diesel Heart. Only Gasoline & Hybrids.

Originally Posted by prakash_ajp

I remember reading somewhere that Camry will now be manufactured in India. If that's the case, why is the Camry still priced higher than the competition?

It is being assembled right now, to be very honest i was hoping and praying that the price will be sub 20 lakhs or just about 20. The 23 Lakh figure was a rude shock for me today afternoon.

Originally Posted by Boomerang

Tell me they have disc brakes for the rear wheel?
====
Exposed wiring is shocking for Toyota at this price. heat being its major concern.

The turbo hose length is unusally short. Will this give a better push?

Yes rear discs are there. I had pointed the exposed wiring and someone from Toyota has already made a note.

Turbo? This is a non turbo petrol engine.

Originally Posted by vb-san

This probably will be least loaded car on safety in this segment. And overall I feel there is too much of bling – overdose of chrome, and that melted chocolate-like faux-wood is too garish for my taste. Something like this (Camry Hybrid 2.5) would have been better.

In person the car is much better, both interiors and exteriors. If it would help, from the review pic - the veneer on top of the "central" air con vent is an accessory. Sides still remain OE.

Originally Posted by smartcat

That's head's up display - are the numbers just a reflection on the windscreen from the device on the dashboard?

Yes its a reflection, and it has a square patch of some kind of sun film thigie, stuck to the windshield also, for better visibility.

Originally Posted by Vid6639

I don't see this reaching even triple digits monthly.

250 is what they aim per month, i believe.

Originally Posted by Hayek

Don't agree with the diesel obsession of many here - having tested the diesel Jetta and 3 series, I must say that there is true value to the fabulous smoothness of a petrol.

True! But the gap is fast diminishing.

[drbones]

Post deleted by the Team-BHP Support : Please do NOT post one-liners that add little or no informational value to the thread. We need your co-operation to maintain the overall quality of this forum.

Please read our rules before proceeding any further.

[prakash_ajp]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

From a person who owns the first gen Indian camry and the latest 5: "Toyota is miles ahead when it comes to rear seat comfort"

Could it be because the way the 5 series gets driven?

May be people at Toyota think that those who spend 20+ lakh on a car won't mind an additional 3-4 lakh for the refinement and reliability. What they don't know is that there are people who spend tens of lakhs on a vehicle but still get their car registered in Pondicherry to save on road tax. I have a feeling that folks at Hyundai must be feeling lot better now.

[Sahil]

Why even bother launching this car, Toyota? The sales numbers won't even justify the CKD volumes needed.

With Toyotas alliance with BMW can we expect the Camry to come with BMW's 2ltr diesel from the 320d, that could be a game changer!

[deetjohn]

Nice review Jaggu. Thanks for sharing. Do you have a pic of the car in dark shades and without the chrome embellishments?

A little too big and Toyota has killed it with garish chrome all around.

A CKD with less features. So why is it so expensive? I guess even the hoteliers will stay out since they wouldn't save much. I wonder who will buy it then.

[nkrishnap]

Very nice review there! Rated a well deserved 5 stars.

I am simply stunned at the pricing. A little too ambitious with the targets of 200 units per month that they have. They have shot themselves in the foot with the stupid pricing.

They should have priced it something like 19.95 lacs or something to pull a few people into the showroom.

For Bangalore 23.5 Ex showroom will make the one road price easily above 28 lakhs

[Vid6639]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

250 is what they aim per month, i believe.

That is being very very optimistic considering that the Superb doesn't do those numbers with a Petrol and diesel option with 2 trims each.

[apurva512]

Whoa!!. That interior faux wood colour is absolutely ghastly. Given the amount of it that has been used and its prominence, it should have been a more muted colour. The wood colour on the pic vb-san posted would have been a much better option.

[Yeldo]

Originally Posted by mayjay

... mentions that the earlier car was priced at 21.58 - 23.73 lakhs. That was a CBU. This is a CKD and it is priced at 23.8 lakh. Maybe they are charging for all that chrome!



In fact if you compare the 2002, 2006 and this one, the A,B,C pillars including that rear window quarter-glass are almost unchanged. The doors are also quite similar, with a rising waist-line being added in the current one by cleverly changing the shape of the door mirror base.

Ahem, after all the talk of CKD, I share your bewilderment on the pricing too..

Well, Toyota might be thinking, if Hyundai can ask 20L, then why can't we, Toyota, ask 15% premium? The Accord comes at 21.5L, so definitely 23L is OK, isn't it?

I also noticed the similarities with the 2002 model. And I think that that is a solid and dignified profile, which IMO suits to the intended audience.

The Camry has suffered not only due to its high price or lack of a Diesel, but also because of the EPCG imports by hotels- many pre- hotel cars are available for ridiculously low prices, reflecting poorly on the resale value of the car.

[dkaile]

Originally Posted by Yeldo

Toyota might be thinking, if Hyundai can ask 20L, then why can't we, Toyota, ask 15% premium?

Well worldwide Camry is the biggest cash cow for Toyota. It also gives them the major pie of their profits. But it is not sold at such a premium pricing as they are hoping to place it here in India. They want to cash in the edge they have got here over Hyundai and Honda. When the previous fully imported model was selling between 21~23L, it was expected that the CKD would be priced below that. Had it been launched at the expected price of say 19~20L, it would have set the particular market segment ablaze.

But maybe Toyota Management in India never wants to set leadership with this particular segment. That is why the overall conservative approach with the previous Camrys too. They have opted for the same conservative approach for the Etios/Liva brands rather than bringing in the more aggressive Yaris. They can easily attain leadership status in each segment of their offerings but their slow and steady approach for our Indian market may backfire if immediate corrective actions are not put in place.