[john doe]

Most garages seem to be very bad at brake bleeding and take terrible shortcuts.

This time I suggest that you get the brake booster checked and if needed , do the bleeding correctly again.

This process needs to be done very rarely, definitely not every quarter.

Heres one link from a very respected magazine:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars...-bleed-brakes/

This is the important bit that 99% of indian garages do not follow:

Get a piece of clear plastic tubing (aquarium tubing is fine, and it's cheap). Push one end of the tube over the brake bleeder bolt at the right rear of the car. Put the other end of the tube into a small, clear bottle with an inch or two of clean brake fluid in it. (This will keep air from being sucked back into the brake cylinder or caliper.)

[Prodigy07]

Got a chance to drive my uncle's Grand i10 Asta Petrol variant.

The drive was so smooth. Even on the pothole filled Mount Poonamallee Road, the car performed really well. No jerks/vibrations at all.

The same stretch on my Ritz/Ertiga would have been pathetic. Not sure if the upsized tyres are the culprit here.

Anyways, I was very happy after the 5km drive

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

If car is on idle and one repeatedly presses brake pedal ( had to do this on ghat section ), the brake pedal becomes stiff. Engine was ON, but the pedal became stiff. I had to brake and change gear which brought the engine to idle, release brake, but then apply brakes again due to oncoming traffic ( cabs overtaking downhill ). Wasn't very confidence inspiring.

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

Brake bleeding was done in Feb 2015 at around 47XX kms. or so.
If bleeding does not solve this, the car will have to see service center. Cant take chance on this.

At idle RPM, the engine has to generate enough vacuum in the booster to maintain the pedal movement which it isn't able to do hence the pedal is getting hard when pressed successively at very quick intervals.

Get the booster checked and brakes bled.

I don't think brake bleeding will be the main cause here. My doubts are on the booster.

@Graaja: Good one!

[amolathalye]

Hi Grajja ,

I am using a Grand i 10 AT since last 1.5 years. Trust me , it's difficult to forget the fact that such a premium car has no airbags and no ABS. It keeps hurting my mind all the time. Why on earth they have thought of not including such important safety features ? It's my first AT and i have started liking it for its convenience but whenever I am driving it outside city limits & highway , I curse Hyundai for not providing the basic safety features. So although I love driving it I still feel that it's a compromise. I regret my decision. Never ever buy a vehicle in this class / price bracket without the safety features. Give some more importance to the safety features than any other feature as it may save your life.

Regards
Amol

[Bump-Stop]

Just paid the booking amount (Rs..5000/-) yesterday morning for a silver Asta (O) for my parents. The dealer called me up yesterday evening and told me that a consignment of new cars have just arrived, and that I could come to check them out today☺

Originally Posted by Bump-Stop

Just paid the booking amount (Rs..5000/-) yesterday morning for a silver Asta (O) for my parents. The dealer called me up yesterday evening and told me that a consignment of new cars have just arrived, and that I could come to check them out today☺

Have insisted that I be present for the PDI......you get to see things first up....

[RSR]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

My Feb 2014 Grand i10 diesel is showing some rust on lower arm.

Originally Posted by nik hill

I will not call any such rusting to be normal. The companies are very reluctant to commit anything in writing which they can not be sure of.

Originally Posted by a4anurag

I have gone through all your posts regarding rust on the lower arm area.

Originally Posted by RoadFiend

I put my Grand i10 on hold after seeing this. Want to be sure about Hyundai A.S.S. Please keep us updated.

Originally Posted by skanchan95

After reading about this, I immediately checked our November 2014 manufactured Grand i10 and there is no rust formation in the areas mentioned by you.

Here are more cases of rust formation on cast iron parts of different cars that I found on Team-BHP.

All of them are new cars, some not even registered, some a few months old, and one from the official Team-BHP review. The photos were taken by the owners themselves, and by the official reviewer in one case. The relevant threads are linked below each photo:



1) Rust on an engine part of a brand new (unregistered) Maruti Suzuki SX4:




http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/buying...ml#post2483992



2) Rust on some engine parts of a 6 month old Maruti Suzuki Ertiga:




http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...ml#post3255499



3) Rust on the brake disc of a Maruti Suzuki Celerio on Team-BHP's official review:




http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...ml#post3447554



4) Interstingly, rust on exactly the same part mentioned here, but on a brand new Honda City:




http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post1114719



5) Rust on the steering shaft and some other parts of a brand new Ford Fiesta:




http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/long-t...ml#post2647614



6) Rust on the front lower arm and brake discs of a brand new Ford Fiesta S:




http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post1435083



7) Rust on some parts of a brand new (unregistered) Fiat Grande Punto:




http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...ml#post1379784



8) Rust on a clamp on a 4 month old Tata Nano:




http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post2093173



There are other cases too on Team-BHP.

I'm not suggesting anything here.

I hope metallurgy experts on this forum can chip in with their 2 cents.

[Parth46]

Just to add my two cents, there is rust in similar parts in my Grand i10 Asta (O) petrol, as well, but in slightly lesser intensity. Car is ~18 months from date of manufacture.

I did point this out seriously during the first two services, when my car was on the ramp, but the service head of both workshops mentioned that it's normal in cast-iron parts and some level of rust in these parts will be there in almost every car and that there would be no performance or reliability issues due to this.

I did a random check of several other cars in the workshop of varying vintage and true enough, there definitely was some level of rust in these components in ALMOST all cars, but certainly not ALL of them.

I've let it rest for now, but will surely monitor the level of rust formation weeks and months down the line, especially after the monsoon gets over. I'm wondering whether some kind of 3M underbody treatment can help in this scenario and provide some extra protection.

[Bump-Stop]

Went to inspect the car today morning during the PDI. Noticed the following points:
1. Uneven panel gap between the front left door and the side panel.
2. Rust on lower arms (as has been mentioned earlier in the thread.

Checked at least 6-7 other vehicles in the lot, both points found to be in varying degrees in all vehicles

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by graaja

There could be a problem with the brake booster in your car which is causing the brake pedals to go hard. Have this checked as well.

]

Originally Posted by john doe

This process needs to be done very rarely, definitely not every quarter.

Heres one link from a very respected magazine:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars...-bleed-brakes/

This is the important bit that 99% of indian garages do not follow:

Get a piece of clear plastic tubing (aquarium tubing is fine, and it's cheap). Push one end of the tube over the brake bleeder bolt at the right rear of the car. Put the other end of the tube into a small, clear bottle with an inch or two of clean brake fluid in it. (This will keep air from being sucked back into the brake cylinder or caliper.)

Originally Posted by a4anurag

Get the booster checked and brakes bled.

I don't think brake bleeding will be the main cause here. My doubts are on the booster.

Didn't get time to send the car for further investigation.
And to be very frank, I hate taking the car to workshop apart from scheduled maintenance.
The issue is serious, but I dont have enough time as of now to take the car and I am sure the workshop will use all its energy to bill something.

Originally Posted by RSR

Here are more cases of rust formation on cast iron parts of different cars that I found on Team-BHP.

All of them are new cars, some not even registered, some a few months old, and one from the official Team-BHP review. The photos were taken by the owners themselves, and by the official reviewer in one case. The relevant threads are linked below each photo:


There are other cases too on Team-BHP.

I'm not suggesting anything here.

I hope metallurgy experts on this forum can chip in with their 2 cents.

The attached images are rather surprising. Quality does not seem to go up as compared to earlier cars. Did not face such issues even in our 1992 Maruti 800 which we sold off in 2012.

Originally Posted by Parth46

Just to add my two cents, there is rust in similar parts in my Grand i10 Asta (O) petrol, as well, but in slightly lesser intensity. Car is ~18 months from date of manufacture.

I did point this out seriously during the first two services, when my car was on the ramp, but the service head of both workshops mentioned that it's normal in cast-iron parts and some level of rust in these parts will be there in almost every car and that there would be no performance or reliability issues due to this.

I did a random check of several other cars in the workshop of varying vintage and true enough, there definitely was some level of rust in these components in ALMOST all cars, but certainly not ALL of them.

I've let it rest for now, but will surely monitor the level of rust formation weeks and months down the line, especially after the monsoon gets over. I'm wondering whether some kind of 3M underbody treatment can help in this scenario and provide some extra protection.

Yes, its better to keep a check on such parts. And quality control over casting is on difficult side. This does indicate variation in quality, and Hyundai QC should get involved and investigate such variances over cars with and without rust, rust of varying degree, etc.

Am planning to send my car in next week to workshop along with my driver, with the hope that all is OK.
Not happy with utter lack of support from Hyundai, though.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

Didn't get time to send the car for further investigation.
And to be very frank, I hate taking the car to workshop apart from scheduled maintenance. The issue is serious, but I dont have enough time as of now to take the car and I am sure the workshop will use all its energy to bill something.

Am planning to send my car in next week to workshop along with my driver, with the hope that all is OK. Not happy with utter lack of support from Hyundai, though.

Have you received any call or any updates from Hyundai regarding the issue?

Are you sending for servicing or for this issue?

[promit]

I've have had Hyundai art leather slip-on seat covers since day 1. I've obliviously wished the seats were more supportive and contoured on the sides.
Recently, sat in a Dolphin Honda City, 3rd Gen Honda City and an Elite i20 - all sans seat covers and the front seats was super comfortable in comparison to my Gi10.

Then, I found this in our own official car review of the Gi10 by GTO:-

The front seats have a subtle bucket effect, making you sit 'inside' them.
Well-contoured front seats offer good support.

I guess, the Hyundai slip ons are ill fitting readymade ones. Going to take them off and replace them soon with the stitched snug fitted variety. Any thoughts?

[RSR]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

Didn't get time to send the car for further investigation.
And to be very frank, I hate taking the car to workshop apart from scheduled maintenance.
The issue is serious, but I dont have enough time as of now to take the car and I am sure the workshop will use all its energy to bill something.

Why not try a different workshop this time? I guess there should be more than one dealership / service centre in and around a city like Vadodara.

There clearly seems to be some issue with the vacuum booster system for the brakes. It needs to be diagnosed correctly to fix the problem.

Even if the car is under warranty, you may try getting an expert opinion from a trusted multi-brand garage or friendly neighbourhood workshop (if you don't trust the authorised dealer workshops). A skilled mechanic with enough experience should be able to identify the fault quite quickly.

You can then get the identified fault fixed at an authorised workshop if the car is under warranty, as once you know exactly what is causing the issue, they cannot take you for a ride and ask you to unnecessarily replace parts.

Originally Posted by promit

I've have had Hyundai art leather slip-on seat covers since day 1. I've obliviously wished the seats were more supportive and contoured on the sides.
Recently, sat in a Dolphin Honda City, 3rd Gen Honda City and an Elite i20 - all sans seat covers and the front seats was super comfortable in comparison to my Gi10.

I guess, the Hyundai slip ons are ill fitting readymade ones. Going to take them off and replace them soon with the stitched snug fitted variety. Any thoughts?

If one wants to retain the support and comfort offered by the car's seats, then the best option is to use them as they are (i.e. without seat covers). I've discovered this harsh truth after sitting in a variety of cars with & without seat covers of different kinds.

Seat covers tend to distort the support (& hence reduce comfort) offered by the car's original seats. This is certainly true in the case of front bucket seats, which have good contours and excellent side bolstering.

The rear bench seat generally tends to have much less contours and side bolstering than those on the front bucket seats, so seat covers may not make much of a difference to the comfort levels of the rear seat (as they don't distort the support much).

This may be a bit hard to digest for those of us (including myself) who view seat covers as a must-have accessory, but it's the reality nevertheless. Not having seat covers comes with its own set of disadvantages, and that's why we use them.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

Have you received any call or any updates from Hyundai regarding the issue?

Are you sending for servicing or for this issue?

I haven't received any call or mail or even Facebook post from Hyundai. I had earlier posted on Facebook using the complaint number so that they do not reply with usual stuff of "Contact Details".

Rather unfortunate, but it seems Hyundai has preferred to abandon the issue. I remember a few years ago when my mother was operated and Innova's wheel wont come out after puncture, a call to Toyota breakdown and one or two heated arguments later, the guy confirmed that breakdown help will arrive soon. I told him Innova's registration number when he was asking for chassis number, etc. Was standing in queue to get medicines for Mom. He realized gravity of my situation and that night a flat bed came to pick Innova.

Hyundai seriously lacks any logic or sense.
Let say, I agree with the rust, but how to monitor the rust ? Hyundai seems clueless. Rust is a silent killer, wherever it is. Be it in foundation of large machines in industries or in a car.

I doubt if service is going to help me out, in this rust issue. Yes, the brakes need an urgent attention. Am not able to spare any time out right now due to a stiff work schedule. The fog lamp assembly will have water marks after a wash. Mr. Kumar agreed on this and I plan to get them changed after monsoon.

As of now, I have put tyre upgrade on hold. Using the car as it is, but slightly scared because of brakes. Michelin 175/65 R14 are available for Rs. 4900 in my city per tyre. Snapdeal has it cheaper by around 850 Rs. per tyre. But no further expenditure on this car as of now.

Originally Posted by RSR

Why not try a different workshop this time? I guess there should be more than one dealership / service centre in and around a city like Vadodara.

There clearly seems to be some issue with the vacuum booster system for the brakes. It needs to be diagnosed correctly to fix the problem.

Even if the car is under warranty, you may try getting an expert opinion from a trusted multi-brand garage or friendly neighbourhood workshop (if you don't trust the authorised dealer workshops). A skilled mechanic with enough experience should be able to identify the fault quite quickly.

You can then get the identified fault fixed at an authorised workshop if the car is under warranty, as once you know exactly what is causing the issue, they cannot take you for a ride and ask you to unnecessarily replace parts.

Tried one near my office, but he said he will have to check and a drive is required for confirmation. The way these garage guys drive, I opted out of it.

Any parts I replace except tyre and wipers will be under warranty. Will be firm on this with service center. And this time I will visit Downtown Hyundai service center. Not Car Scanner. Planning to take my car for service after monsoon.

Originally Posted by Bump-Stop

Went to inspect the car today morning during the PDI. Noticed the following points:
1. Uneven panel gap between the front left door and the side panel.
2. Rust on lower arms (as has been mentioned earlier in the thread.

Checked at least 6-7 other vehicles in the lot, both points found to be in varying degrees in all vehicles

The uneven panel gap is not normal. This should have been caught during visual inspection at assembly line itself.
Rusted component is steering knuckle which holds together various components like lower arm, tie rod, etc. Rust is almost as much as my car.

[aaggoswami]

I have a rather bad update to share.

On 27-June-2015, I visited Kavi Kombai ( a nice Lord Shiva temple which submerges in water during high tide ) with my friend in my grand i10. All was fine and I thought let me once again try to adjust to this car. All this while the thoughts of selling off Grand i10 were revolving in my mind.

After a week, the car starts to jerk whenever shown a tough task, like quick overtaking of any overloaded Tata Ace or any three wheeler or overtaking two 2-wheeler riders riding parallel to each other and talking on an already encroached road. Yes, this is where the torque of a modern turbodiesel should help.

But even in 2nd gear at 1800 rpm or so, if I press 20% throttle ( approx. ), the car jerks for a moment and then suddenly the torque comes. It was odd. Never faced such momentary jerks which felt as if the engine is shut down for a second.
Logic said : If there is something wrong the CEL ( Check Engine Light ) would light up on dash. It didn't. NO CEL meant I ignored it thinking that its creature of my mind who hates Grand i10.

But day by day it was getting worse. The frequent jerks started happening at any rpm. NO CEL.
Yesterday, when I was out to buy a few things the car was not ready to move further at 2000 rpm in 1st gear. Just vibrating. This was not a transmission issue, the engine was not picking up revvs.
Stopped the car on side of the road, increased throttle and observed : The rpm needle was moving automatically 500 rpm up and down even with the throttle pedal pinned down onto floor. Still NO CEL.

Today morning while going to office, I almost crashed as the engine just kept on losing power for 2-3 seconds at any time, sometimes even 5 seconds. NO CEL.
Then it was enough. Called up my driver who brought Waggie from home to place where I work and took grand i10 to Hyundai Authorized service center, Downtown Hyundai Chhani.

Its was traced down to MAF sensor error. Via my driver's cell, I had a word with some mechanic who said that we have removed the error from ECU and its OK. I asked him to provide some document of the task undertaken, but he laughed at me.
Evening I came home and wanted to refill in Grand i10. I was unpleasantly surprised to find that engine was now performing at 50% what it was. NO CEL.
Immediately called the service center and after a few heated arguments, took the car myself there. It was a horrible drive.
The issue was again MAF sensor, this time it was replaced. Due to my rather angry call, Mr. Kumar ( mentioned in one of my above posts ) was still in office and did not leave.
Even after MAF replacement, the revvs were not enthusiastic, and I asked them if ECU was OK. One technician said that the intake and engine cover show signs/footprint of Rat. Told them immediately that CEL should have lit up and Grand i10 is parked where I used to park Baleno. Wagon R is parked just after Grand i10.

The technician told me that CEL was ON when the car was brought in this afternoon and that I could have ignored it. I am DAMN SURE that CEL did not light up. Before driver took my car to service center, I wanted to give my car to a colleague to confirm if I was wrong. He barely drove the car for 100-200 mtrs. and said that its not in a drive-able condition due to some strong misbehavior of car. He did not observe CEL either.

Coming back to service center visit, after MAF error wont go, the technician reset the ECU and asked me to go for a drive with another technician. The technician with me during drive told me : " you are suddenly pressing throttle after brake and hence engine is not picking up speed ".
During the drive even in 3rd gear 1500 rpm full throttle, the car would pick up speed very slowly, and the same car would shoot off with such throttle input. RPM were not rising even remotely fast. Very slow. And then stopped the car,did a flat out run. The car failed to pick up smart speed even in second gear. Fifth gear, 70 kmph, full throttle, and engine struggled to cross 2000 rpm.

After the drive technician accompanying me reported that I was pressing accelerator too much. I immediately told him to get test drive grand i10 diesel, same route, I would drive and lets observe performance.
Eventually, they asked me to have the car parked for tomorrow's detailed evaluation. Asked them to drop me home and they said that car will be picked up tomorrow from my home. No CEL during trail with technician or to my drive home.

Car has done 79XX kms. My guess is that ECU went kaput or something similar and it further spoils other parts. They should NOT have asked me to drive the car after repeated MAF sensor error even though the part was replaced. This could have lead to damage/further damage to engine.
I miss the day dad asked me to be smart with my purchase and resources and get Liva diesel ( with ABS ). I miss not buying Swift.

Steering getting overtly assisted, inconsistent braking, excessive rust and now sensor failure. All in less than 2 years of ownership.
Lets see what they throw down at me tomorrow.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

After a week, the car starts to jerk whenever shown a tough task,

But even in 2nd gear at 1800 rpm or so, if I press 20% throttle ( approx.), the car jerks for a moment and then suddenly the torque comes.

Any non standard fuel station where the car was refuelled?

Since the MAF is sorted, I place my doubts on either bad fuel or choked fuel filter.

I'd say get the fuel tank cleaned, get the fuel filter changed. Fill-in fresh fuel and see if the issue repeats.